A Bar Room Ditty?

[Covenanter]

I think the common tune in our section is an arrangement tune generally called Christmas. I say I think because I recall that text is in our book, but we generally never sing it. I'll have to remember to look tonight and see what tune it is. The tunes I associate with "While shepherds watched" are Glory Shone Around by T. J. Allen and Sherburne by Daniel Read. Since they are fuging tunes, they are more commonly sung at singing conventions rather than church. These two are not in our church books but in our Sacred Harp.

I haven't any of those tunes - even Handel's "Christmas" though I've hear a "folk" variant of it which includes the dreadful chorus "Sweet bells" as in

To you in David's town this day
is born of David's line,
a Saviour who is Christ the Lord,
and this shall be the sign -
Sweet bells, sweet chiming Christmas bells;
they cheer us on our heavenward way,
sweet chiming bells.

As church musician & choir member I had to look up the definition of "fugue." As one used to "traditional" hymns tunes & singing, those you suggest sound chaotic.

 

[rlvaughn]

As church musician & choir member I had to look up the definition of "fugue."

In the Sacred Harp idiom it is usually spelled "fuge." Some professional musicians and music instructors distinguish it from a fugue, sometimes saying the fuging tune "resembles a fugue." I don't know enough about fuges/fugues apart from the kind we have to say what is correct, one way or another. Our fuges -- simply put -- are usually the equivalent of a hymn tune with a "round" tacked on the end -- except that end section, though each voice part starts at different intervals like a round, is so designed for all four voices to end together (usually).

As one used to "traditional" hymns tunes & singing, those you suggest sound chaotic.

That is a fair term, and is one of the reasons we sing them at singing conventions rather than church services. They are enjoyable for singing, good music practice, but not particularly conducive for listeners picking out all the words (if they don't already know what they are), in the section where the voices enter at intervals and "chase" one another.

 

[robycop3]

The melody isn't nearly as important as the WORDS.

Remember, our NATIONAL ANTHEM is sung to the tune of "To Anacreon In Heaven", an old British drinking song.

 

[agedman]

The truth is that extremely few hymns ever relied upon the worldly drunken living bar songs.

Rather, folks, in which the great hymns of faith over the last 400 years have been written, used to desire that which was far removed from such enticements and shunned the plying of the ungodly with the godly considering it shameful.

The history of tunes and songs that were paired with lyrics is rich in wonderful accounts. I had a shelf of books in which contained the "story" behind the hymns, and my friend Al Smith was one particularly close to such accounts.

That said, this thread also alludes to the paring of current worldly popular music with words given by great Godly men of the past. What sadness! I do no know of any one of the writers who would have enjoyed or endorsed that practice. Rather, they would have considered such as shameful.

The great lyricist that give accounts of what impressed them were most concerned that the music adaptations to their lyrics would not be focused upon other than the words and truth be what was imprinted musically in the heart. For music reaches the heart long before the intellectual understanding is engaged. Here is one composer to illustrate: http://www.cyberhymnal.org/bio/k/n/knapp_pp.htm


One of the items that this thread has not considered is the reputation of the current popular writers/composers and alignment to their own doctrinal thinking in the popular musical offerings.

For example, Hillsong is extremely problematic from a doctrinal viewpoint. I wonder how many have been snared into what they think merely by endorsing some music they produce.

Some of the music is very sound ( if you get past the presentation) yet there is danger in the allure of the methods and presentation into embracing all that Hillsong teaches.

It has long amazed me that the folks of the BB will demean and proclaim as heretical what is taught by the television evangelist popular teachers of the "crouch network" yet willingly and gleefully not present that same disassociation when it comes to music that is popular and generated from that same crowd.

Fanny Crosby liked to attend a pentecostal church, never to join but to enjoy. She is never aligned with such a group by either her demeanor, her character, her lyrics, nor her lifestyle. Yet, much of what she wrote is extremely good and I know of none other that wrote so prolifically. Now numbered at over 10,000 lyrics written, more were recently discovered. She was uniquely gifted.

However, I also know of not one lyric she wrote that was put to a "popular" tune of the day derived from the world. She would have rebuked such as ungodly.

Sadly, according to this thread, discernment may be lacking in presenting the worldly with the Godly as acceptable.

 

[rlvaughn]

That said, this thread also alludes to the paring of current worldly popular music with words given by great Godly men of the past.

I think in the thread there has been more that allusion, in that some have directly mentioned such parings. Each will have to speak for himself, but speaking of it and endorsing the practice are not the same thing. For example, I mentioned that I once heard "Amazing grace how sweet the sound" sung to "The House of the Rising Sun" tune. That is a fact (if my memory is correct). But I didn't think it was a good thing.