A challenge to Arminianism

rc;

Calvinism was condemned by the church fathers as heresy. Not to mention why should I care what the Catholic Priest did. Your a Calvinist and Calvinism came out of Catholicism. In fact it's just warmed over Catholicism. Of course you would know that if you trully knew church history.
I won't respond to any more of your post because children should be seen and not heard.

 

JohnP;

Not true JohnP;
Joh 6:28 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
Joh 6:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
Faith JohnP is God's work not man's. Like I said you don't even understand your own language.

May Christ Shine His Light On Us all;
Mike

 

Hi Joseph;
This is Calvinism;
"5so that your faith might not rest on men's wisdom,"
May Christ Shine His light On Us all;
Mike

 

Joseph, I assume this question was directed toward me. I don't see any inconsistency. Paul said to the Corinthians, "My message and my preaching were not with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit's power, 5so that your faith might not rest on men's wisdom, but on God's power." To the Athenians his words were still a demonstration of the Spirit's power but the words he spoke were wise and persuasive.

Look at the outcome on Mar's Hill:

</font>

• "some began to snear" Obviously those neither moved by the Spirit nor the wisdom of Paul's message.</font>
• ...others said, “We shall hear you again concerning this.” Those whose interests were piqued by Paul's logic.</font>
• But some men joined him and believed. Those moved to belief by the Holy Spirit.</font>

In both cases Paul presents the Gospel. To the church at Corinth he delivered a message unembellished and simple and to the Athenians one that appealed to their logic and philosophies. At Athens, Paul dealt with the "Unknown god" monument. Paul spoke to them as intellectual equals. His presentation was wise or, to that audience, he would've been readily dismissed. The message was not "the wisdom of the age or of rulers...", however. The message was a plain account of Jesus Christ and Him crucified. Different audiences, different methods, same Gospel. In spite of the differences without the Holy Spirit active in hearts and minds of the listeners, Paul would have been - in the words of DL Moody - preaching against the wall.

It is also Arminianism.

 

ILL,
You always make claims that you can not back-up.
Which church council condemned Calvinism to be heretical? ... PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE I want to know? ... I'm just asking for one? If you give me one, I'll stop posting hows that? Just think ! You can stop me from posting forever by just giving me one synod ! PLease.... show me and relieve me from my ignorance !

 

Still waiting ILL !!!

Come on ! Show me how much you ACTUALLY know about this subject!! I'm going to hound you till you show me. ILL... every post! On every topic I'm going to hound you, I've cought you in a lie and am going to hold you accountable brother! And this is just typical of your Bible study also.. making unlearned claims as fact with no truth or proper study to back it up.

Where are you ILL ?

 

Hey padredurand how did you get them bullet points in they look good!

johnp.

 

johnp! Is it safe to come in? Seems a shame to see well-reasoned discussion among Christian men get interrupted by spats, "liar, liar pants on fire", my theology can beat up your theology, etc.

To start: [brackets are the lower case of { }. Where the word bracket is typed means to put one of these [ or these ] in its place </font>

• bracket list bracket;</font>
• for each bullet point bracket * bracket;</font>
• then end list with bracket /list bracket</font>

 

</font>

• That's neat padredurand! </font>

</font>

• I needed some more bullets! </font>

johnp.

 

oops sorry! Thanks padredurand!

</font>

• johnp.</font>

 

Whoa Ho Nelly! I get it! Adam never sinned in the garden? Ahhh... Now it all begins to get clear!

Lets go back to that book of Ephesians that Arminians just hate so much!

Ephesians 2:8 "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:"

And of course good old Timothy...

2 Timothy 3:15 "And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus."

"Through": (Dia) Refers to space and time as through, throughout, implying transition, continuance.

"Saved": (Sozo) Safe, delivered. To save, deliver, make whole, preserve safe from danger, loss, destruction.

"Salvation": (Soteria) Deliverance from sin, and its spiritual consequences, involving an attachment to the body of Christ, and admission to eternal life with blessedness in the kingdom of Christ."

Nooo...

"By Grace ye are saved" - One time event. God's Grace saved.

"through faith" - Transition from being saved, a continuance of being saved.

Ergo...

Once saved, always saved. (Hey that matches my name here! OSAS. I never noticed that until now! )

No Grace? Welcome to Hell. Faith does you no good until God extends His Grace to you.

Wow! You really ripped that scripture out of context!

Lets look at the scripture before it that you so conviently passed by...

Ephesians 1:11 "In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:"

We trust in him after. First we are saved. To deliver. To make whole.

After being saved, we then try to pattern ourselves after Jesus, to live the life he lived.

 

OSAS, have you really met Arminians that hate Ephesians? Just one credible citation would be helpful.

Let me offer one or two contrary to your opinion:

The question is not of Grace but the nature of Grace. Is it irresistable or conditional?

 

OSAS, have you really met Arminians that hate Ephesians? Just one credible citation would be helpful.

Ok... http://www.baptistboard.com

The question is not of Grace but the nature of Grace. Is it irresistable or conditional? </font>[/QUOTE]Irresistable...

It's called Omnipotence.

 

So, OSAS cannot win with the tools of Calvinism, so he is changing the definition of "irresistable Grace" to "omnipotence".

 

If that's the only one I guess we ought to just sit back and wait for rc and ILL to duke it out again.

And God's omnipotence is never challenged. It is man's impotence that is.

 

Hi durand;

Seems to me that maybe you're over looking that fruit of love with in your self to make that statement. A critical spirit is not a loving one.

I don't believe that rc is a brother and I'm not Catholic enough to want to call you Father.
May Christ Shine His Light On Us All;
Mike

 

Oh please... And in typical Arminian fashion you pass by posts that quote the scripture or go to the Greek? Still waiting for an answer on Eternal Life thread, and I noticed you didn't dare adress the greek in my post above on this page.

Let me explain "Omnipotence" since you miss the point.

Omnipotence: Having unlimited or universal power, authority, or force; all-powerful, absolute.

If God chooses you to be saved.

You tell me.

How are you going to stop Him?

Power Absolute, and you think you can stand against it??

 

Hi OSAS;

The posibility of God's Sovereignty being a benevolent one escapes you doesn't it?.
If it was God's purpose to save everyone He could but, where in His Sovereignty do you see God being a rapist of mens Love.
There are lots of things God can or could do and doesn't I wonder why. Is it because His mind is righteous instead of being like yours bent on the domination of every aspect of life.
May Christ Shine His Light On Us All;
Mike