F
Filmproducer
Guest
Thank you Dragoon, well said. Also, frustrated is a much better word for anger, because the people were frustrated and scared. I have not seen anyone "angry" at the help they have been given.
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A Failure of Government in These United States
- Thread starter KenH
- Start date
FilmProducer,
My friend (female) was talking about the people in NO, she was not making a blanket statment.
I am sure you are right that there are more good apples then bad, and as always the bad apples make the good ones look bad. And I feel for them. But here are my points. To make the federal gov a villian is unacceptable. I am sure we will learn from this and do better next time. But the Idea that FEMA and others were supposed to get in within 48 hours and get everyone peachy is ridiculas. This is a disaster on a scale we have not seen in our liftime, so I think some tolerance is in order. But my biggest objection is the use of race. The suggestion that Bush or someone was indifferent because it was black people mostly stranded in NO. The lanquage about genocide and CIA hits. It seems to me that the black race has been trained to start screaming racisim anytime things are not going their way. And the failure to acknowledge problems in the balck commuity, always blaming others. I have even heard black figures suggest drugs in their community are a CIA plot, and that AIDs in the community is a Jewish Doctors plot. Look at all the trouble Bill Cosby got into when he tried to speak honestly about some of the problems in the community. The excusing of riots and looting in the community by government officials. Now I am not saying other communities, even white, don't have shortcommings, I am just saying when it comes to the black community any mention of a shortcomming, even from one of there own(Cosby), immediately brings attacks and accusations of racisim and excuses. And why is the NO mayor exempt from criticism? Dosn't he bare some responsiblity for the preparidness or lack of it.
I just find the same old tactics, the Jessie Jacksonisms, utterly distastful. It hurts us all and it hurts the black race most of all. But even the good apples are responsible for the message the communities send out into the world. This racial card being played all the time and being used as an excuse for bad behavior is the norm, and I see it in this situation and that is where I am comming from.
My friend (female) was talking about the people in NO, she was not making a blanket statment.
I am sure you are right that there are more good apples then bad, and as always the bad apples make the good ones look bad. And I feel for them. But here are my points. To make the federal gov a villian is unacceptable. I am sure we will learn from this and do better next time. But the Idea that FEMA and others were supposed to get in within 48 hours and get everyone peachy is ridiculas. This is a disaster on a scale we have not seen in our liftime, so I think some tolerance is in order. But my biggest objection is the use of race. The suggestion that Bush or someone was indifferent because it was black people mostly stranded in NO. The lanquage about genocide and CIA hits. It seems to me that the black race has been trained to start screaming racisim anytime things are not going their way. And the failure to acknowledge problems in the balck commuity, always blaming others. I have even heard black figures suggest drugs in their community are a CIA plot, and that AIDs in the community is a Jewish Doctors plot. Look at all the trouble Bill Cosby got into when he tried to speak honestly about some of the problems in the community. The excusing of riots and looting in the community by government officials. Now I am not saying other communities, even white, don't have shortcommings, I am just saying when it comes to the black community any mention of a shortcomming, even from one of there own(Cosby), immediately brings attacks and accusations of racisim and excuses. And why is the NO mayor exempt from criticism? Dosn't he bare some responsiblity for the preparidness or lack of it.
I just find the same old tactics, the Jessie Jacksonisms, utterly distastful. It hurts us all and it hurts the black race most of all. But even the good apples are responsible for the message the communities send out into the world. This racial card being played all the time and being used as an excuse for bad behavior is the norm, and I see it in this situation and that is where I am comming from.
F
Filmproducer
Guest
There you go again making blanet statements about a whole race of people YOU KNOW NOTHING ABOUT. You are basing all your opinions on the media coverage you have seen. I find your understanding of the black community utterly DISTASTEFUL and OFFENSIVE. and UNINFORMED. The whole "black" race does not disagree with the Bill Cosby's of the world. Also, how can the "black" race change the content of the media coverage. To suggest this is utterly assinine. The media will frame the stories as they see fit, and to whatever degree they want.
FP,
There you go again, assuming. I am basing my opinions on a liftime of experience. Quit being reactionary and tell me why people like Jessie Jackson and Al Sharpton exist if it is just a blanket statement. If their leaders are misrepresenting them, they should get new leaders. Why isn't Condi Rice or Clarence Thomas considered black leaders? Bill Cosby was at a major black function (I don't remeber if was NAACP or what) when he got blasted for being honest.
The democarats and liberals are enablers, who allow this situation to continue to suit their own ends. They are not freinds of the black people, they just want to use them, so they keep the racist boogie man alive with the help of Jackson and Sharpton. I believe blacks have as much potential as any race, but they are behind, why is that? Maybe it is time for some honesty. Maybe they should listen to Cosby and not Sharpton and Jackson. Maybe they should quit crying racisim everytime there is a problem or shortcoming and find out who their real friends are.
There you go again, assuming. I am basing my opinions on a liftime of experience. Quit being reactionary and tell me why people like Jessie Jackson and Al Sharpton exist if it is just a blanket statement. If their leaders are misrepresenting them, they should get new leaders. Why isn't Condi Rice or Clarence Thomas considered black leaders? Bill Cosby was at a major black function (I don't remeber if was NAACP or what) when he got blasted for being honest.
The democarats and liberals are enablers, who allow this situation to continue to suit their own ends. They are not freinds of the black people, they just want to use them, so they keep the racist boogie man alive with the help of Jackson and Sharpton. I believe blacks have as much potential as any race, but they are behind, why is that? Maybe it is time for some honesty. Maybe they should listen to Cosby and not Sharpton and Jackson. Maybe they should quit crying racisim everytime there is a problem or shortcoming and find out who their real friends are.
F
Filmproducer
Guest
Bunyon,
As I said you are basing your opinions on something YOU KNOW NOTHING ABOUT! Your lifetime experiemce does not include anything of being black or seeing how black people live. You do not hear of the real leaders in the black community, and i can tell you from experience that many black people find Al Sharpton to be off his rocker. As far as Jesse Jackson, not everything he says is wrong, like any politician he has his own opinions. Not all black people blame everything on race, but you obviously believe that racism is dead in this country. I on the other hand know it is not, from personal experience. I will never be able to convince you though, you have formed your opinions and you will keep them. It is too bad that they are based on media framing and what you see on TV, which is from experience highly exaggerated.
As I said you are basing your opinions on something YOU KNOW NOTHING ABOUT! Your lifetime experiemce does not include anything of being black or seeing how black people live. You do not hear of the real leaders in the black community, and i can tell you from experience that many black people find Al Sharpton to be off his rocker. As far as Jesse Jackson, not everything he says is wrong, like any politician he has his own opinions. Not all black people blame everything on race, but you obviously believe that racism is dead in this country. I on the other hand know it is not, from personal experience. I will never be able to convince you though, you have formed your opinions and you will keep them. It is too bad that they are based on media framing and what you see on TV, which is from experience highly exaggerated.
FP, I hope you are right. I hope it is just a trick of the media, I hope it is not denial. I've alway thought the Media was biased the other way. But as long as folks like you want to go on the attack every time caring people want to have an honest discussion, there will be no change. We will stay in the same old ruts, and the black race will be held back because of it.
But lets say you are right. What keeps Jackson and Sharpton in power and why does Cosby get attacked By the promenant organizations if the whole black race does not disagree with Bill Cosby (I never said that btw)
And I think you are proving the point. You get angry and attack someone for there honest opinion. If I have been fooled by the media, why would you attack me for it. And I know there are awsome black people, but we are talking about generalities. There are racist attitudes on both sides, just as much on the black side. But we live in a free country of opportunity. Asians have taken over at Harvard, and that is good because they earned it. If blacks are being held back, there is more to it than racisim.
BTW, where did you grow up?
But lets say you are right. What keeps Jackson and Sharpton in power and why does Cosby get attacked By the promenant organizations if the whole black race does not disagree with Bill Cosby (I never said that btw)
And I think you are proving the point. You get angry and attack someone for there honest opinion. If I have been fooled by the media, why would you attack me for it. And I know there are awsome black people, but we are talking about generalities. There are racist attitudes on both sides, just as much on the black side. But we live in a free country of opportunity. Asians have taken over at Harvard, and that is good because they earned it. If blacks are being held back, there is more to it than racisim.
BTW, where did you grow up?
F
Filmproducer
Guest
Oh as far as Bill Cosby is concerned, as i said before not everyone disagreed with him. You formed your opinionon the media response. Also the reason many black people do not consider Condi Rice or Clarence Thomas as leaders is because they are poor.
F
Filmproducer
Guest
i grew up in an upper middle class family in Maryland, but moved to Florida in high school. However, I married a black man. I am now getting my graduate degree in media bias and public opinion.
FP, I am open to what ever you can show me, especially if you are an expert in media bias. But I spent my formative years in NC. To say I know nothing about the black race is a wrong assumption. I went to school with them, worked in tobbaco with them, played sports with them.
I does seem to me that because you are married to a black man you think other peoples observations are wrong, and only you have an accurate picture.
I does seem to me that because you are married to a black man you think other peoples observations are wrong, and only you have an accurate picture.
F
Filmproducer
Guest
No Bunyon I do not feel that way. I am not even saying my opinion is the only correct one. I can say though that media does frame stories and that many portrayals of black people on TV and in Film are overly exaggerated, because of this many people have stereotyped the black community. If this was not true you would not be saying what you do of the people in NO, you would realize they are showing the same pictures over and over of the looters and thugs, and that the thugs were a small MINORITY of people.
F
Filmproducer
Guest
I can also say that I am very sensitive to this issue because my children are now considered black, because their father is. I have seen instances of racism up close and it saddens me. I am not saying that everyone is racist, or that you are racist. What I am saying is that many people are misinformed. IMO, we are too divided in this country, whether it is churches or communities. How can we understand one another if we don't put away these stereotypes, (and black people do have them of white people also), aand learn from one another.
Well, lets call a truce for now. And trust me I hope for the success of the black race, but I think their are things holding them back. And racisim is not the biggest problem. They have been here longer than the asian, the Jews, and the latinos, and yet they still are stuck by and large in the same ruts. I would like to see them get out of there rut and take the place they should have in our society, but I think in many cases the people who they think are their friend aren't and are just using them, and the people who would be their friends they attack as racist. That is my honest opinion.
F
Filmproducer
Guest
I agree lets call a truce. You are right also, they are not where they should be in society. I aslo believe they are used, probably not by all the same people as you, but still used. I also agree that some people they attack as racist when they shouldn't. My only concern has ever been trying to clear up stereotypes, because in the long run it affects everybody and we cannot move forward as a society.
NaasPreacher (C4K)
Well-Known Member
Closed at 0900 EDTOriginally posted by LadyEagle:
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Lady Eagle,
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