A New Look At Revelation

[tyndale1946]

In the diversity of the Church we may have many different ways of reading and approaching Revelation. But surely one way to “test” our readings is to see whether they produce hope, obedience, joy, courage, perseverance, and expectation. If they don’t, i.e. if they don’t produce the fruit of the Spirit in us, we should abandon those ways of reading. If we read Revelation as worshippers, we will discover that it takes on the character of devotional literature, strengthening our devotion and filling us with God’s life. In times of trouble, and indeed in all kinds of times, we need to be reminded of how the Story ends. JESUS WINS!

I agree... Its time study and re-evaluate this beautiful book and how it applies to our Christian walk in this life now!... Brother Glen

 

[OldRegular]

In the diversity of the Church we may have many different ways of reading and approaching Revelation. But surely one way to “test” our readings is to see whether they produce hope, obedience, joy, courage, perseverance, and expectation. If they don’t, i.e. if they don’t produce the fruit of the Spirit in us, we should abandon those ways of reading. If we read Revelation as worshippers, we will discover that it takes on the character of devotional literature, strengthening our devotion and filling us with God’s life. In times of trouble, and indeed in all kinds of times, we need to be reminded of how the Story ends. JESUS WINS!

I agree... Its time to end all this arguing, bickering and backbiting!... And put into practice what this says and act like the Christians we claim to be!... Brother Glen

Brother, You are exactly right. JESUS WINS! and because of that those who have been redeemed by HIM win. I have made that point numerous times on this Forum. Revelation is a book of [VICTORY.

I have also on several occasions noted that the Commentary on Revelation by Philip Edgecumbe Hughes reads almost like a devotional to me. He is an English Anglican and the book is worth reading by all Saints regardless of their view of the Book of Revelation.

 

[tyndale1946]

Brother, You are exactly right. JESUS WINS! and because of that those who have been redeemed by HIM win. I have made that point numerous times on this Forum. Revelation is a book of [VICTORY.

I have also on several occasions noted that the Commentary on Revelation by Philip Edgecumbe Hughes reads almost like a devotional to me. He is an English Anglican and the book is worth reading by all Saints regardless of their view of the Book of Revelation.

Amen!... My Brother!... I was afraid this post would fall on deaf ears!... Also want to thank you for the recommendation of the book Kingdom Come which I read and thoroughly enjoyed... Also I would like recommend one to you... Revelation Images Of Redemptive History by Elder Joe Holder can be found on Amazon and is well worth the read. He also believes as you do
Revelation is a book of VICTORY... I will check out the Hughes book... Brother Glen

 

[Greektim]

In the diversity of the Church we may have many different ways of reading and approaching Revelation. But surely one way to “test” our readings is to see whether they produce hope, obedience, joy, courage, perseverance, and expectation. If they don’t, i.e. if they don’t produce the fruit of the Spirit in us, we should abandon those ways of reading. If we read Revelation as worshippers, we will discover that it takes on the character of devotional literature, strengthening our devotion and filling us with God’s life. In times of trouble, and indeed in all kinds of times, we need to be reminded of how the Story ends. JESUS WINS!

I agree... Its time study and re-evaluate this beautiful book and how it applies to our Christian walk in this life now!... Brother Glen

According to Rev. 5:5, Jesus has already won. So it is not "in the end".

 

[OldRegular]

According to Rev. 5:5, Jesus has already won. So it is not "in the end".

I agree that Jesus Christ has already won although I would look beyond Revelation 5:5 to see what GOD has to say to HIS Church prior to the Victory Celebration.

 

[tyndale1946]

I agree that Jesus Christ has already won although I would look beyond Revelation 5:5 to see what GOD has to say to HIS Church prior to the Victory Celebration.

Agree... He who hath ears to hear let him hear what the Spirit sayeth to the churches... We are individually and collectively, the ecclesia, the called out, the church... Brother Glen

 

[Iconoclast]

In the diversity of the Church we may have many different ways of reading and approaching Revelation. But surely one way to “test” our readings is to see whether they produce hope, obedience, joy, courage, perseverance, and expectation. If they don’t, i.e. if they don’t produce the fruit of the Spirit in us, we should abandon those ways of reading. If we read Revelation as worshippers, we will discover that it takes on the character of devotional literature, strengthening our devotion and filling us with God’s life. In times of trouble, and indeed in all kinds of times, we need to be reminded of how the Story ends. JESUS WINS!

I agree... Its time study and re-evaluate this beautiful book and how it applies to our Christian walk in this life now!... Brother Glen

Yes....I believe Revelation is to be read alongside the book of Hebrews...It was written to comfort the church as it was facing persecution and the great tribulation.
It answered the question for new converts and the church throughout history as to where is The Lord Jesus Christ now and what is He doing.

He reigns as Prophet Priest and King right now.

 

[Jesus Saves!]

I agree we win by the blood in the end. These post reminded me of a song I've heard. Here are a few of the lyrics.

The battle is raging, soldiers are falling,
It seems that defeat is at hand.
But we must keep fighting until we shall hear,
The call from that heavenly land,
For there's no surrender in this battle we're fighting
The price is to great now to quit,
So remember no matter how hard your battle
The back of the book says we win

In Revelation the battles are over,
We're gathered there round the throne
Reunited with loved ones who've gone on before us
Seeing their faces once more,
Singing a new song, the angels can't sing
Redeemed by the blood of the Lamb
So remember no matter how hard your battle
The back of the book says we win.

 

[tyndale1946]

Yes....I believe Revelation is to be read alongside the book of Hebrews...It was written to comfort the church as it was facing persecution and the great tribulation.
It answered the question for new converts and the church throughout history as to where is The Lord Jesus Christ now and what is He doing.

He reigns as Prophet Priest and King right now.

Thank you my Brother and Amen!... Revelation is to be read alongside the book of Hebrews?... I never knew that!...That is an interesting insight and I will surely compare the two... Brother Glen

 

[tyndale1946]

I agree we win by the blood in the end. These post reminded me of a song I've heard. Here are a few of the lyrics.

The battle is raging, soldiers are falling,
It seems that defeat is at hand.
But we must keep fighting until we shall hear,
The call from that heavenly land,
For there's no surrender in this battle we're fighting
The price is to great now to quit,
So remember no matter how hard your battle
The back of the book says we win

In Revelation the battles are over,
We're gathered there round the throne
Reunited with loved ones who've gone on before us
Seeing their faces once more,
Singing a new song, the angels can't sing
Redeemed by the blood of the Lamb
So remember no matter how hard your battle
The back of the book says we win.

AMEN!...JESUS WINS/WE WIN!... Brother Glen:jesus::godisgood:

 

[Iconoclast]

Thank you my Brother and Amen!... Revelation is to be read alongside the book of Hebrews?... I never knew that!...That is an interesting insight and I will surely compare the two... Brother Glen

Hebrews highlights the Eternal priestly intercession of our Great high Priest....Hebrews 12 speaks of Him speaking from the throne to us on earth....
22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,

23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

25 See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:
26 Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven.

27 And this word, Yet once more, signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.

28 Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear:

 

[Iconoclast]

15 And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there ariseth another priest,

16 Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.

17 For he testifieth, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.
19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.

20 And inasmuch as not without an oath he was made priest:

21 (For those priests were made without an oath; but this with an oath by him that said unto him, The Lord sware and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

23 And they truly were many priests, because they were not suffered to continue by reason of death:

24 But this man, because he continueth ever, hath an unchangeable priesthood.

25 Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.

26 For such an high priest became us, who is holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and made higher than the heavens;

27 Who needeth not daily, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifice, first for his own sins, and then for the people's: for this he did once, when he offered up himself.

 

[percho]

Brother, You are exactly right. JESUS WINS! and because of that those who have been redeemed by HIM win. I have made that point numerous times on this Forum. Revelation is a book of [VICTORY.

I have also on several occasions noted that the Commentary on Revelation by Philip Edgecumbe Hughes reads almost like a devotional to me. He is an English Anglican and the book is worth reading by all Saints regardless of their view of the Book of Revelation.

I Googled and it looks like you can download it in PDF

 

[OldRegular]

Hebrews highlights the Eternal priestly intercession of our Great high Priest....Hebrews 12 speaks of Him speaking from the throne to us on earth....
22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,

23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

25 See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:
26 Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven.

27 And this word, Yet once more, signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.

28 Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear:

Verses 22-24 are some of the most sublime thoughts in all of Scripture.

There was a time when I thought Hebrews was my favorite book. Then I spent some months studying and teaching Ephesians and a couple of years studying and teaching Revelation. I guess I would have to say the favorite book is the one you are spending time in.

 

[OldRegular]

To move things alone I thought I would express some of the things I learned from my study of Revelation some years ago.

I believe there are seven parallel sections in the Book of Revelation that picture the Second Coming of Jesus Christ, as follows:

1. The first such picture in Revelation occurs at the opening of the sixth seal [Revelation 6:12-17]. The terror of those under judgment, the complete despair of those who have rejected the grace of God, as manifested in the sacrificial death of His Son Jesus Christ, will be held in common by all classes of man and is best described by the words: hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand? As terrible as is the picture presented the reality of God’s final judgment will be far worse than language can convey.

2. The second such picture of the end of the age occurs at the sound of the seventh trumpet [Revelation 11:15-19] when it is announced: The kingdoms of this world are become [the kingdoms] of our Lord, and of his Christ. Voices ring out, the praise of all the host of heaven, the great multitude, the four beasts, and the twenty four elders. The coming of the Kingdom brings the resurrection to life, the Blessed Hope, of those who are redeemed to God by the blood of the Lamb. However, those who have rejected the grace of God, who have trampled underfoot the Blood of the Covenant, who have loved darkness rather than light will learn that death is no escape. Theirs is the resurrection to judgment, the ultimate woe, the second death, the lake of fire.

3. The third such picture of the end of the age is shown by the dual harvest [Revelation 14:14-20]. The first harvest, by the Son of Man, is that of ones who have been redeemed by the blood of the Lamb and sealed with the Holy Spirit, who have persevered, who have not bowed the knee to Baal. These will sing the new song, the song of redemption. These will enter into the joy of the Lord. Their redemption is complete. The second harvest is in stark contrast to the first. A command is given and the vine with its fully ripe grapes is reaped and cast into the great winepress of the wrath of God. With the thrust of the sharp sickle the wrath of God is visited on all unrighteousness.

4. The fourth such picture of the end of the age occurs when the seventh vial, the final cup of the wrath of God is poured out [Revelation 16:17-21. The voice of God comes from the throne within the temple saying It is done. And every island fled away, and the mountains were not found signifying the final shaking of the heavens and the earth [Hebrews 12:26, 27]. The great harlot, Babylon, is judged.

5. The fifth picture of the end of the age [Revelation 19:1-10] contrasts the marriage of the Lamb and His Bride, the glory Church, the New Jerusalem, with the judgment of that great harlot, Babylon, the counterfeit church and the bride of the antichrist

6. The sixth picture of the end of the age [Revelation 19:11-21] shows the return of the One who is Faithful and True, the Word of God, the King of Kings and Lord of Lords [/i][/color][/b]to execute judgment upon the beast, the false prophet, and those who bear the mark of the beast in the battle of that great day of God Almighty [Revelation 16:14] at a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon [Revelation 16:16].

7. The seventh picture [Revelation 20: 7-10] of the end of the age presents a second account of the ‘battle’ of Armageddon. Satan is released to gather the ‘nations’ to battle against the camp of the saints, the beloved city. The nations, referred to as Gog and Magog , encompass the camp of the Saints, the beloved city. Here, as in Ezekiel 38 & 39, Gog and Magog represent the opposition of the world to the people of God. It is very likely, as some expositors believe, that the account in Ezekiel is prophetic of the battle of Armageddon. The camp of the saints and the the beloved city are the people of God, the Church, who are alive on earth. The battle is not a physical battle between the Church and the forces of Satan. Neither is it a physical battle between the returning Saviour with His army and Satan with his army. Rather this is a spiritual battle in which the outcome is certain: fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. We see pictured here the final defeat and judgment of Satan, he is cast into the lake of fire.

 

[Iconoclast]

Verses 22-24 are some of the most sublime thoughts in all of Scripture.

There was a time when I thought Hebrews was my favorite book. Then I spent some months studying and teaching Ephesians and a couple of years studying and teaching Revelation. I guess I would have to say the favorite book is the one you are spending time in.

:wavey: They are all special but I am drawn to Hebrews like a magnet.:thumbsup:

 

[OldRegular]

:wavey: They are all special but I am drawn to Hebrews like a magnet.:thumbsup:

So am I. Hebrews, properly studied, is the death knell to dispensational doctrine.

 

[Sapper Woody]

So am I. Hebrews, properly studied, is the death knell to dispensational doctrine.

If you're referring to all the "by faith"s in Hebrews, it has nothing to do with proper dispensationalism. Dispensationalists do not believe in different salvation plans. They only believe that God's interactions with man have been different in different parts of history.

 

[Iconoclast]

So am I. Hebrews, properly studied, is the death knell to dispensational doctrine.

39 and these all, having been testified to through the faith, did not receive the promise,

40 God for us something better having provided, that apart from us they might not be made perfect.



22 But, ye came to Mount Zion, and to a city of the living God, to the heavenly Jerusalem, and to myriads of messengers,

23 to the company and assembly of the first-born in heaven enrolled, and to God the judge of all, and to spirits of righteous men made perfect,

24 and to a mediator of a new covenant -- Jesus, and to blood of sprinkling, speaking better things than that of Abel!

25 See, may ye not refuse him who is speaking, for if those did not escape who refused him who upon earth was divinely speaking -- much less we who do turn away from him who [speaketh] from heaven,

26 whose voice the earth shook then, and now hath he promised, saying, `Yet once -- I shake not only the earth, but also the heaven;'

27 and this -- `Yet once' -- doth make evident the removal of the things shaken, as of things having been made, that the things not shaken may remain;

28 wherefore, a kingdom that cannot be shaken receiving, may we have grace, through which we may serve God well-pleasingly, with reverence and religious fear;

29 for also our God [is] a consuming fire.

 

[OldRegular]

If you're referring to all the "by faith"s in Hebrews, it has nothing to do with proper dispensationalism. Dispensationalists do not believe in different salvation plans. They only believe that God's interactions with man have been different in different parts of history.

No I am not talking about the statements on faith. I am saying that Hebrews correctly shows the unity of Scripture but also shows the superiority of the New Covenant. Unless I am mistaken the initial Scofield Reference Bible taught that salvation was determined by obedience to the terms of the particular dispensation.

A reason more important to dispensationalists, however, comes from statements made by early dispensationalists which indicate that salvation in the Old Testament was not by grace. The Scofield Reference Bible was the Bible of early Fundamentalism, and its editor, C. I. Scofield, was one of the leading popularizers of dispensational thought. Scofield made this unfortunate statement: “As a dispensation, grace begins with the death and resurrection of Christ (Rom. 3.24–26; 4.24, 25). The point of testing is no longer legal obedience as the condition of salvation, but acceptance or rejection of Christ, with good works as a fruit of salvation (John 1.12, 13; 3.36; Mt. 21.37; 22.42; John 15.22; Heb. 1.2; 1 John 5.10–12).”[iv] This seems to indicate that in the New Testament salvation came by grace through the acceptance of Christ, while for those under the Mosaic Law salvation came by works through the maintenance of a system of works. Based on other comments by Scofield, this writer has concluded that this was an unfortunate phrasing by Scofield, but that is beside the point—the statement has been in print for over a century.

A related problem is that Lewis Sperry Chafer, a leading early dispensationalist, gives the impression that the dispensation of Law was a forsaking of a previous plateau of grace, a reversal in the progress of the dispensations. “When the Law was proposed, the children of Israel deliberately forsook their position under the grace of God which had been their relationship to God until that day, and placed themselves under the law.”[v] The implication is that the Old Testament saint was under grace until Moses, under law until Christ, and the New Testament saint is now again under grace.
http://fbfi.org/salvation-in-dispensationalism/