Abstinence should be the only policy!

Oh brother!
It always amazes me when I stumble upon yet another demonstration of "Let's see how close to the cliff edge we can get and still have the world like us".

Unmarried sex is sin.
"Whatsoever ye sew, that shall ye also reap".
That is what God says.
God never says, "Here's how to help the world destroy themselves and stay alienated from Me".

Abstinence. Period. That is what God says. God also says "They that sew to the flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption".

We CANNOT and DARE NOT soften that message. For we are also held accountable before the Judgement Seat of Christ.

In HIS service;
Jim

 

On the previous page you said, What do you think is the biblical approach to advise those who refuse abstinence? How is that not asking for a backup message?It seems to me you are admitting that you are looking for a back up message for those "who refuse to practice abstinence." How do you now say you aren't?</font>[/QUOTE]I was asking how Andy T would approach a very real situation.

What you consider a backup message, I consider part of the whole message.

I said that I support abstinence which is the only Christian course of action. I also support not misleading or leaving folks ignorant about contraceptives.

I'll assume you are talking about extramarital sex and I agree. The russian roulette thing is especially true without condoms.

I agree. The health problems and unwed pregnancy are especially true without condoms.

 

But you act like the issue is not as serious if you use condoms. I completely disagree. When someone tells me, I will not abstain, I have nothing left to say. It would be completely irresponsible for me to coach them about how to "get around" God's laws of nature and morality. I would be condemning that person to a life of sin that is irreparable. I can't do that in good conscience.

 

And in good conscience, I can't lie, mislead, or leave ignorant folks to think that condoms have no efficacy for contraception/STD prevention in the hopes that that ignorance will keep them from practicing extra-marital sex.

 

Gold Dragon,

Can you tell me with a straight face that you really think it is God's call on our life to educate people on how to use condoms?

If this wasn't so sad, it would be funny.

 

Nope. That isn't our call on life.

But He does make a very clear call to us in the Ten Commandments not to bear false witness.

 

All the condoms in the world can not save you from the wrath of God. Let the world figure out how to deal with the consequnces of their sin if they will not repent of it. We should have no fellowship with darkness.

 

I am not suggesting you do that. Condoms do have some efficacy for those things, but they are the absolute wrong answer. We should not let people use condoms thinking that it isn't that big of a deal. It is.

 

Agreed. Condoms have no efficacy in that regard.

You can do that. I encourage continuing to preach Christ and repentance to them.

Agreed.

 

Gold Dragon,

You said, "lie, mislead, or leave ignorant" That means we need to educate, because to leave ignorant means to not educate, right?

What I am hearing from you is that it is the Christian's duty to tell others to use condoms if they choose to sin. Can you in anyway support that approach biblically? You can't. You simply can't. Shaking head in utter disbelief.

 

I am not suggesting you do that. Condoms do have some efficacy for those things, but they are the absolute wrong answer. We should not let people use condoms thinking that it isn't that big of a deal. It is. </font>[/QUOTE]Agreed 100%

 

All the abstinence cannot save you wrom the warth of God either. All the good works under heaven are incapable of saving you from teh wrath of God. That's a whole separate issue. Let's move on.

 

Then you hear wrong. That is not a Christian duty. A Christian duty is not to bear false witness.

I can't because your misrepresentation isn't what I was trying to support.

 

I think James' point is that it's the Gospel that saves people from the wrath of God. And the Gospel is the whole issue, so we will kindly not move on.

 

Hold up. The statistics I cited are very specific to the caveat of "when used properly". When those methods are used properly, the statistics I cited are accurate.

Which has what to do with the statistics I cited? Nothing. It says that half of the diseases resulted from failures. It's not a report on the failure rate in general.

Then we should all petition the IRS to revoke tax breaks on married people of differeng faiths, since not being equally yoked is a sin.

C'mon folks, while I don't advocate "free condom distribution", I do advocate people on the FACTUAL risks of varying birth controls, including abstinence.

Should we stop drug abuse education? Countless studies have shown that telling the kids the statistics on drug use actually lowers the drug abuse rate. So, why is it that education in birth control (including abstinence) is bad? Countless studies likewise show that such education lowers promuscuity rates, it does not raise it. I can find no scriptural support for ignorance. I can, however, find abundant scriptural support for being filled with knowlege and wisdom.

[ July 29, 2005, 04:43 PM: Message edited by: Johnv ]

 

What does "leaving ignorant" mean? It means to not educate, to not inform. So are you taking back what you said here?

 

Your right, it is a separate issue. But we should not be in the business of passing information designed to help the world sin 'safely'. Have you had occasion to practice any of their methods? I can tell you from experience that condoms can disappear. We are doing nothing other than promoting a false sense of security if we promote anything other than holiness. Otherwise would be to hold the doctrine of Balaam.

 

What does "leaving ignorant" mean? It means to educate, to inform. So are you taking back what you said here? </font>[/QUOTE]Not at all. I support education about contraceptives. This is not a Christian duty.

It is a Christian duty not to bear false witness, which includes times when we are discussing sex education.

 

Are you an NRA member?

Is passing information about the safe use of guns helping people commit sin with guns?

Would you support people who said that there is no safe way to shoot a gun in order to keep guns out of the hands of children and criminals?

 

So if I counsel someone to simply repent and believe, you are fine with that? I don't need to tell them, "Oh, and if you don't repent and believe, make sure you use a condom."???