Adam not literal????

[Shortandy]

On a different site I am having a conversation with a guy who says that Adam and Eve were not literal people. He says they are representative of humanity in general. He asserts that if his postion is true that nothing is lost theologically.

My question to you guys is.....Is this correct?

What theological difference would there be if "Adam", in Paul's words in Romans, was not a real person?

Help me out here and give some things to bring to this discussion.

Thanks!!!

 

[Amy.G]

On a different site I am having a conversation with a guy who says that Adam and Eve were not literal people. He says they are representative of humanity in general. He asserts that if his postion is true that nothing is lost theologically.

My question to you guys is.....Is this correct?

What theological difference would there be if "Adam", in Paul's words in Romans, was not a real person?

Help me out here and give some things to bring to this discussion.

Thanks!!!

Gen 5:5 And all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years: and he died.


If "Adam" was another word for mankind, then I guess all mankind died.

Adam was a person, the first man. Scripture is clear on this.

 

[matt wade]

It's just a typical arguement that liberal "christians" use to support their belief in evolution. They like to believe things like "God kicked off the process" instead of the literal creation account.

What theological difference does it make? Well, honestly, if you can't believe that God created earth, and everything on it, I don't think you have faith in the right God and I'd wonder if you are even saved.

 

[Jim1999]

In the first couple of chapters in Genesis, adam was the generic name for humankind. The name for Adam appears in chapter three. The term "adam" in Hebrew covers both, the adamic creation and Adam, the first man.

No theology is affected, and this understanding is not limited to evolutionists.

Cheers,

Jim

 

[Winman]

Amy's answer is excellent. Ask your friend if every person lived 930 years and died. :laugh:

Gen 4:1 And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD.

And if Adam means many men, then Gen 4:1 takes on a completely new meaning.

1 Cor 15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

And how many men can be the first man?

 

[Tom Bryant]

No theology is affected, and this understanding is not limited to evolutionists.

I don't understand your answer at all.

What about 1 Cor. 15:22 - "For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive."
or
Romans 5:12- Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned—

The rest of Scripture seems to take him as a literal man.

 

[Pastor Larry]

No theology is affected, and this understanding is not limited to evolutionists.

A lot of theology is affected, including (or especially) Romans 5. The whole issue of the imputation of sin is destroyed if Adam is merely representative. At some point, there had to be an Adam, an original man who sinned and whose sin is passed down. It impacts anthropology, soteriology, and bibliology.

 

[Amy.G]

And if Adam means many men, then Gen 4:1 takes on a completely new meaning.

:laugh::laugh::laugh:
Oh that was good!

 

[Shortandy]

Not that I am defending this guys view but to bring some clarity.

He says that sin enters the world because of all humanity. He at least believes that we are born sinful. He simply asserts that it didn't have to come through one man in order for Christ's work to be so amazing.

He is promising to post some more for me. I will copy it to this forum and let you guys help me out. I really want to take this debate as far as i can.

Thanks guys.

ps....Jim1999 since you hold to this view of Adam as myth in the first few chapters maybe you can post more for us as well.

 

[Jim1999]

Timing, folks, timing. Look up the meaning of adam in Hebrew and read Genesis 1 & 2 again..The come to teh Adam and Eve scene and the entry of sin and the penalty of death. It doesn't conflict at all.

The term "adam" is used some 500 times in scripture to mean "mankind", quite apart from Adam, the man.

Cheers,

Jim

 

[Jim1999]

Note: I did not say myth!

Cheers,

Jim

 

[Salty]

Adam is found 31 times in the KJV

 

[Revmitchell]

Not that I am defending this guys view but to bring some clarity.

He says that sin enters the world because of all humanity. He at least believes that we are born sinful. He simply asserts that it didn't have to come through one man in order for Christ's work to be so amazing.

He is promising to post some more for me. I will copy it to this forum and let you guys help me out. I really want to take this debate as far as i can.

Thanks guys.

ps....Jim1999 since you hold to this view of Adam as myth in the first few chapters maybe you can post more for us as well.

Rom 5:12 Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned--

Scripture is plain and gives no room for the liberal interpretation.

 

[Jim1999]

Please, before I get called any more names, I am not going to ask you to learn Hebrew, but,please, use your concordance and look up the word adam. You might be surprised and apologetic.

Cheers,

Jim

 

[OldRegular]

Originally Posted by Winman
And if Adam means many men, then Gen 4:1 takes on a completely new meaning.

Response Posted by Amy
Oh that was good!

I agree: but shame on you Amy and me and Winman!:laugh:

Now if there were a lot of Eve's?

 

[matt wade]

In the first couple of chapters in Genesis, adam was the generic name for humankind. The name for Adam appears in chapter three. The term "adam" in Hebrew covers both, the adamic creation and Adam, the first man.

No theology is affected, and this understanding is not limited to evolutionists.

Cheers,

Jim

My point made...liberal christians hold to this idea...

 

[Jim1999]

Strong's Concordance:

119 adam; to show blood (in the face)

120 adam; ruddy, ie. a human being (an individual or the species

121; Adam, the name of the first man, also of a place in Palestine.

Gen 2:19 is 120..a human being, an individual or species.not the name Adam.

Finaly in Genesis 3:17 we finally get the name Adam

Cheers,

Jim

 

[Dave]

Adam?

The scripture is clear that the first man was named Adam. That Adam is used as a word referring to mankind in Hebrew does not detract from the literal understanding of the first 3 chapters in Genesis. The Bible is clear that sin entered by the sin of one man and the name of that man was Adam. Every man is a son of Adam and has inherited a sin nature from him.

Liberals attempt to justify modern compromise with worldly ideas by treating many literal, historical passages of scripture as symbolic. You can make the bible say almost anything with that logic. Death entered by sin, sin originated in the first man, that first man was Adam. Therefore, there was no death prior to Adam's sin. That alone kills any attempt to relate evolution to scripture.

God bless,
Dave

 

[Jim1999]

If you choose to ignore the language, that is your privilege, but remember that the next time you try to prove a point by using the original biblical languages.

Cheers,

Jim

 

[annsni]

Not that I am defending this guys view but to bring some clarity.

He says that sin enters the world because of all humanity. He at least believes that we are born sinful. He simply asserts that it didn't have to come through one man in order for Christ's work to be so amazing.

He is promising to post some more for me. I will copy it to this forum and let you guys help me out. I really want to take this debate as far as i can.

Thanks guys.

ps....Jim1999 since you hold to this view of Adam as myth in the first few chapters maybe you can post more for us as well.

Rom 5:12 Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned--

Scripture is plain and gives no room for the liberal interpretation.

Oh darn! I was JUST going to post the verse RevMitchell posted but he beat me to it. However, i'm going to go a step further and post the whole passage because it is SO appropriate for this discussion. If "Adam" doesn't mean one man in Genesis 1 and 2, then Romans 5 is a lie:

" 12Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned— 13for sin indeed was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not counted where there is no law. 14Yet death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over those whose sinning was not like the transgression of Adam, who was a type of the one who was to come.

15But the free gift is not like the trespass. For if many died through one man’s trespass, much more have the grace of God and the free gift by the grace of that one man Jesus Christ abounded for many. 16And the free gift is not like the result of that one man’s sin. For the judgment following one trespass brought condemnation, but the free gift following many trespasses brought justification. 17For if, because of one man’s trespass, death reigned through that one man, much more will those who receive the abundance of grace and the free gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man Jesus Christ.

18Therefore, as one trespass led to condemnation for all men, so one act of righteousness leads to justification and life for all men. 19For as by the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners, so by the one man’s obedience the many will be made righteous. 20Now the law came in to increase the trespass, but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more, 21so that, as sin reigned in death, grace also might reign through righteousness leading to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."