Alarming Statistic

Thank you, sir.

This is an exploding field right now. Of course I would recommend my husband's website: www.setterfield.org -- but that is pretty technical in a lot of areas and concentrates on certain things he has researched, and does not try to take on all the argument. He is deeply involved in the whole area of plasma research right now and is finding some astounding things. We are also getting a new website (same URL) ready which will have some much more lay-friendly stuff on it.

I would highly recommend the Discovery Institute website -- these are the Intelligent Design folk, and I worked presenting ID for awhile before I married Barry. The men in that field are extremely careful and brilliant. They do NOT try to present young earth creation -- they are not all even Christians. But they do present a very scientific approach towards critiquing Darwinism, which is quite valuable.
They are here: http://www.discovery.org/

Leadership University covers a host of subjects from a Christian perspective: http://www.leaderu.com/

For some excellent creation science by a number of authors, go to True Origin (this also contains direct rebuttals to some of the material on Talk Origin, an evolution website). I am Helen Fryman there, which was my name before I married Barry.
http://www.trueorigin.org/

Creation Safaris does an outstanding job of looking at news headlines regarding creation and evolution and dealing with them from a Christian and scientific perspective. We know the man who runs this and he is truly brilliant: http://www.creationsafaris.com/crev200702.htm

Dave Plaisted, out of Florida, has an excellent page put together with a variety of articles: http://www.cs.unc.edu/~plaisted/ce/

The Geoscience Research Institute is SDA, but has some of the most reliable science available as published by the researchers themselves. Barry has been invited to speak there several times. We respect these men and women highly: http://www.grisda.org/

These websites will get you started! Cruise them and decide what best suits your needs. I see you are in Florida. There is a chance Barry and I will be back East late next summer for some presentations. If so, it is possible we might be able to arrange some time at your church if you like. PM me or email us if this is something that you might like. We do a six session (six hours) presentation on Genesis 1-11: Why you can believe it. The approach is scientific and theological.

You will note I did not recommend the standard sites with the standard organizations. Each of them has a line which their authors must toe and we disagree with that approach as well as some of the material coming out of them. The websites above will, I think, give you more than enough very good material.

 

I think there are a couple of things you've hit on here. The faith that kids have needs to be caught, and they need to make it their own. It cannot be the faith that their parents imposed on them by requiring them to attend church, or by being overly strict with regard to homeschooling, or a Christian school, or regulating their television and music.

I think kids need to see that what you say you believe about your faith is real. Telling them and making them go to church is one thing. Showing them it is real to you is quite another. Spending time together as a family, worshipping, praying and studying the Bible is absolutely key and it's not just a matter of going through the motions. You must invest time in their life. They need to know they can count on you, that you have their back, and that you are going to be there for them. Parents, according to the scripture, are responsible to provide for their children, protect their children and work to secure opportunities for their future. It's not easy, but if you spend the bulk of your free time investing in your family, you'll have a lot more credibility and influence with your children.

And as far as church goes, sure, there are churches out there that just play games with their kids, and offer nothing of substance. But just because a church works to make its ministry to children and youth relevant to them, and tries to translated the gospel into their language doesn't mean they are not effective. My observation is that the churches that are the strictest and most traditional in their approach to ministry, the churches that are always critical of what other folks do, are the ones that don't have any young people, and if you don't have them, you have no influence over them. You can't sit them down in rows of chairs with a Bible and a pencil and lecture to them. You have to have effective discipleship relationships and accountability.

We are raising four boys, 17, two 16 year olds and a soon to be 12 year old, and my biggest fear is that they won't stick to the church later on. They are in a Christian school, and there are times when I wonder whether that will cause over exposure and burnout. So I am constantly in prayer, not just for them, but with them. I show them that I love them unconditionally because of Christ, I teach them one on one as much as I can and I've watched the oldest one pick up on some of that and start to put himself in position to be an example for the younger ones. Upon the advise of our pastor, we removed the "requirement" that the three older ones have to go to church, but so far, they haven't missed a Sunday. They all have ownership of a piece of ministry that the youth group is involved in, and it has become important to them. We'll take it one day at a time.

 

Little Johnny was overheard saying, "If Hell is more boring than church, I promise to be good the rest of my life!"

 

Parents spend more each year on entertainment than they do on the education of their children. They spend almost zero time discipling anyone including their children.

It's like the saying, "More is caught than is taught." Too many think that making disciples is preaching and standing up in the front of a class to teach the Bible. That kind of thing happens in a lot of schools while the listeners are students being filled with intellectual knowledge only and not disciples.

 

In every Sunday class I taught I gave them homework and my classes have always grown in size and committment. Out of each class are people I disciple because they are willing to pay the price to follow Christ and learn.

We need to get rid of the fun mentality. Learning is work. It is often hard work. The reward of hard work is the benefits it brings to one's life. At the university I see too many students who have been having fun for too long and then are placed in a situation where their ignorance shows. At that point they quickly realize what they learned in high school. They also realize how much they wished they had learned. I have never seen a poorly prepared student be happy about a lack of preparation.

 

And the people have traded the truth for a lie. Now they are living with it and having fun for awhile.

 

Want to mention one thing here. I went to a Lutheran church with a girlfriend in the 4th - 6th grades. They completely emphasized Bible stories. Thus, at a time when doctrine per se would have confused me completely, I became extremely well acquainted with the stories themselves.

Doctrine should start in jr. hi in my opinion, and in high school the cults should be examined and compared to what the Bible says. This will produce not only innoculation against the cults, but it will do so because of a firm knowledge of what the Bible actually says.

 

Jesus taught many things in parables.

Nothing wrong with Bible stories as long as we don't miss the principles and lessons taught by those stories.

 

Wow! This thread is full of great stuff -- not great that our kids are leaving the church, but lots of great observations that indicate the problem is not at all simple.

• Some teens are leaving because they haven't been fed and discipled.
• Some are leaving because they've heard the church say one thing and seen their parents lead lives that literally didn't line up with what the church taught.
• Some teens are rebelling against legalism.
• Some parents expect that what the kids get on Sundays is enough to counter all the other stuff they get the rest of the time.
• Some are leaving because they are rebellious by nature -- sinners. AND it has nothing to do with what the church did or what their parents did, but it is only due to their rebellious and sinful nature. That one I know well because I followed that path at 18. I went back to Him and then to church because God didn't let me alone until I did.

And at some point we all have to take personal responsibility apart from our upbringing or our church or our Sunday School teacher.

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I agree about the Bible stories. They are full and rich and deep. We teach them and learn them and relate to them. We see ourselves in them. We understand so much doctrine because we know the history through those stories. I've asked so many questions about God's plan because of those stories. I've connect oh so many dots through those stories.

 

The Chrisitans amidst communism sent their kids to atheistsic schools and some of the strongest Christians have come from those countries.

Some of the strongest Christians I find were not raised in Christian homes and were led to Christ and discipled by a fellow student in a secular university who as serious about his faith in Christ.

 

Amen, gb93433!

 

Lots of good anecdotal stories about this one or that one.

But the fact of the matter is (generally speaking as a whole) is as jjump has stated. The condition of todays "christian" youth is the same as the condition of the "christian" church today. Laodicea.

I preached a message not long ago titled, "Are you Hot or Not" based on Rev. 3:16. Got good response to it. Needs preached more often in my opinion.

Be very greatful for the few. I strongly believe we are past the harvest and have now entered the gleanings. Nothing you can do about it but focus on the gleanings. And thank God for them.

 

God is at work everywhere and is not limited by our failures. However, He expects me to examine carefully what the best situation is for my child. And it often is not what is best for your child.
Or even for other kids in the same family.

One could read your words to mean that a young child is better off without Christian influence, and I don't think that is what you are trying to say.

 

Be a good example to them. Let them see you serve with all your heart. Second generation christians tend to be a little more luke warm but if they see you do it they will follow. (IMHO)

 

Amen, Soulman!! I once heard the late, great Dr. Adrian Rogers give this quote while preaching a "Family" series

What the parents do in moderation---the children will do in excess!!!

 

Right---but

Underline the word "some"

I've been on secular campuses where I have and have seen others as well--shareing their faith in the Lord Jesus Christ publically

On the other hand---I've been on campuses of some Baptist U's---where they seemingly don't want to share "diddly" about their faith in Christ!!

 

This is a great thread about a serious, serious problem.

A good resource that I would like to suggest is a book called, Rock Solid Kids by Larry Fowler. It just talks about what the Bible says about children's ministry and how the church needs to support the parents in their primary role as spiritual role models for their children. From all the comments I've read on here, I think all of you would like the truths shared in this book.

I do believe you need to get kids involved in serving as early as they can understand and learn from it. Kids have to see it being real to their parents and church leaders and then experience the difference that Christ can make in their own personal life. If they are never asked to "Walk" in faith, but only asked to "absorb" faith, it doesn't mean nearly as much to them. The difference is brought through discipleship and ministy opportunities.

God Bless you all!
WW2'er

 

Often that is because there is so little differnce between the Baptist U and the world. Whereas the Christians in secular universities often know the difference between what a real Christian looks like and the world. Plus the fact that they arepersonally taught to win people to Christ and disciple people rather than architectural evangelism or putting up a big billboard.