Alcoholic beverages in Heaven

[Yelsew]

Not only will there be no marriage in heaven there will be no babies born in heaven. No one in heaven ever dies, so there is no reason for replacements. That is why it is essential to evangelize (harvest) as many souls for heaven as possible.

Let's assume that ALL the people who ever lived and will live on this earth go to the NEW JERUSALEM that comes down to the NEW EARTH. Each person would have a heavenly space of approximately 1/3 of a cubic mile or 49,065,984,000 cubic feet of space to call home.

 

[ChristianCynic]

Originally posted by Yelsew:
Let's assume that ALL the people who ever lived and will live on this earth go to the NEW JERUSALEM that comes down to the NEW EARTH. Each person would have a heavenly space of approximately 1/3 of a cubic mile or 49,065,984,000 cubic feet of space to call home.

Space.... the final frontier.........

 

[blackbird]

Brother Yelsaw!
And the New Jerusalem is just the "Capitol City!"

Brother Frogman!
Grapevines in Heaven! YesSirRee! And nothing dies! YesSirRee! No Alcohol! YesSirRee! Since alcohol is a result of the dying process of the grape, etc.!!

Brother Cynic!!
I'm still waiting on those cash, gasoline, hotel tickets!! Have a good day, Brother! I'm your friend!!

Blackbird

 

[BrianT]

Originally posted by HankD:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />I ain't trying to "milk" anything

38 posts and counting.

We had 2 Guernseys when we had a farm in Maineummy and her daughter Buttercup.

They gave 1/2 and 1/2.

No wine though.

</font>[/QUOTE]I once had a dog, and when he wanted to come into the house, he would let out a little whine. OK, bad joke, never mind....

From blackbird:

Grapevines in Heaven! YesSirRee! And nothing dies! YesSirRee! No Alcohol! YesSirRee! Since alcohol is a result of the dying process of the grape, etc.!!

So how is Christ going to drink of the fruit of the vine? Doesn't crushing a grape into juice "kill" it? What's on the menu at the marriage supper of the lamb? Logic, what a terrible thing to waste....

 

[Frogman]

I do like seedless grapes though. But not grape-juice. Maybe a cup of coffee or tea?,

Praise God, the fountain of living waters shall be there.

Bro. Dallas

 

[Yelsew]

God is Spirit! Does spirit eat or drink? There will be no planting or harvesting in heaven for both of those are work and we are told that we will enter into rest in the arms of Jesus! We are also told that our only work then will be the Worshipping and praising of God!

But, that seems incongruous to me because we were made for work, which satisfies the soul. Without work we soon become bored and enter into mischief.

Idle hands are the devil's tools! etc.

 

[Frogman]

What reason is there to think it is figurative? Surely it means what it says? "Look not thou upon the [obviously fermented] wine when it is red" means just that. And if you can't look at it, how can you drink it???

"Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit." John 12.24

There is no death in heaven. And in fact death only exists for believers because of the wages of sin our flesh is still subj. to.

But apart from the death, and quickening of the vine, (Christ John 15), there would be no branches (churches), nor fruit (individuals having received salvation).

All this is the result of the dying process.

Though a grape must die to be "processed" into either juice or wine, I too must have died to have been born of the vine.

A grape, a raisin, juice, wine, still products of the vine, and thus the fruit of the vine, from which death in the natural occurred in order that quickening in the spiritual can occur.

Often today we attempt to bring forth the fruits, apart from the death. Death is such an ugly word to us, even though we are delivered from it, we find many who dread it.

Is it because we perceive material comforts may be absent in Heaven? I don't know.

God Bless.

Bro. Dallas
Glasgow, KY.

 

[Frogman]

Christ ascended into heaven after the bodily resurrection.

We shall be as he is. When He appeared to the apostles he did eat and drink.

Bro. Dallas

 

[Helen]

Yelsew,
Here is another thought for you. In John 17 we find that Jesus defines eternal life as knowing the Father and the Son. There is no possible way we could ever come to complete knowledge of God, so I have a feeling that we will be busy with discovery even in heaven! I doubt our interests and work here on earth will be wasted. I have a feeling that maybe, just maybe, whatever work we were created to do will continue, but without wrong turns, temptations, etc.

And I do know that in His resurrection body Christ ate with the disciples. And in Revelation 22 we find that the fruit of the tree of life is there in each season and that the leaves themselves are for the healing of the nations. I can't tell you I understand all this -- I don't. But I do think that even though it is spiritually we are created in the image of God, there is going to be more to this whole thing that we know now.

[ October 03, 2002, 12:26 PM: Message edited by: Helen ]

 

[blackbird]

What's on the menu in Heaven? J-E-S-U-S!! Heaven is all about Jesus! He is Heaven's Passover! He is Heaven's Wine!

And lets get truthful again about the alcohol content of wine. If you think about it--the alcohol is a waste product produced in the dying process of the grape--as covered in above post!

The alcohol is the wine's "Junkyard!" Heaven ain't got no junkyard! The only junkyard I read about is the one mentioned "Right outside!"

Now, when we get to Heaven and discover that "Golly! This wine has alcohol content!"--you'll be able to look over at ole Blackbird with a "Fish Fed Cat" grin on your face! BUT--if its visa versa--if there is no alcohol content in Heaven's wine--ole Blackbird will be "High Five-'n!" all over the streets of gold! I'll be "Woopin'!" like a Sioux Indian at a War Party! Deal??!!

Your friend,
Blackbird

 

[BrianT]

Originally posted by blackbird:
What's on the menu in Heaven? J-E-S-U-S!!

"Mom, pass the Jesus and the gravy please."

"Not until you finish your brussel sprouts, son."

And lets get truthful again about the alcohol content of wine. If you think about it--the alcohol is a waste product produced in the dying process of the grape--as covered in above post!

Yes, let's get truthful. Christ said he was not going to drink of the fruit of the vine until he comes in his kingdom. Pretty hard to drink grape juice without killing a few grapes.

Now, when we get to Heaven and discover that "Golly! This wine has alcohol content!"--you'll be able to look over at ole Blackbird with a "Fish Fed Cat" grin on your face! BUT--if its visa versa--if there is no alcohol content in Heaven's wine--ole Blackbird will be "High Five-'n!" all over the streets of gold! I'll be "Woopin'!" like a Sioux Indian at a War Party! Deal??!!

You are very strange.

[ October 03, 2002, 01:11 PM: Message edited by: BrianT ]

 

[blackbird]

BrianT!!

Brother! Brother! Brother! You've got to have a little sense of humor here! I watch Bill Murray and Eddie Murphy-you watch Mr. Roger's Neighborhood! Straight faced, sweater zipped up to his tie knot! Land's sakes, man--I am strange, that's true! But its my personality. Laugh a little bit, Brother! Relax!

True, true! Alcohol is one of my pet peaves--I'll stomp on it, swing at it, shoot at it, and when the day comes for the dentist to pull my real teeth out and I'm left with just my gums--I'll just "gum" the issue to death and spit it out!

And I believe with my whole heart that I have my boxin' gloves on and am standing in the corner with the truth about alcohol--and I'm waiting for the bell to ring so that I can come out and beat the "livin' snot" out of the poison people injest for fun! Oh, I might get hit a few times, in the face, in the stomach, arms--and yes, I'll even take a few "Rabbit" punches and some "below the belt!" Now, when I stand over the issue as the ref "counts to ten"--and I KO the issue--and its all over with but the cryin' and you get yourself all washed up--I'll take the participants out to supper--and love them and admonish them as a brother and a sister in the Lord Jesus--you'll be my best friend! Keep in mind--I ain't trying to KO you--I'm trying to KO alcohol!! . . . Wait a minute! Is that the bell?? See you in the middle of the ring, friend! Remember, I love you and I'm really smilin' through my mouthpiece--but when I swing--I ain't gonna be hittin' air!!

Your friend,
Blackbird

 

[Ransom]

blackbird said:

If you think about it--the alcohol is a waste product produced in the dying process of the grape--as covered in above post!

If I thought about it, I probably wouldn't eat much at all.

But, based on the above, I would assume you don't eat bread - which could not exist without the same process of fermentation. Those little holes in bread? The waste product produced as yeast eats sugar and excretes carbon dioxide and alcohol.

Or cheese - secretions squeezed from the hind end of a cow, deliberately soured by the introduction of bacteria, coagulated, and allowed to ripen (i.e. ferment). Some of it even grows fungus. Yum yum.

But as it is, I like my rotted smashed grapes either red and fairly young, or white and medium dry - and my days-dead, dismembered cattle carcass medium rare. Funny how God would bless the eating of dead dismembered cow carcass since it is the by-product of a large, dead animal, but there you go.

[ October 03, 2002, 04:02 PM: Message edited by: Ransom ]

 

[BrianT]

Originally posted by blackbird:

Brother! Brother! Brother! You've got to have a little sense of humor here! I watch Bill Murray and Eddie Murphy-you watch Mr. Roger's Neighborhood! Straight faced, sweater zipped up to his tie knot!

Is that the image I present? If you only knew...

True, true! Alcohol is one of my pet peaves--I'll stomp on it, swing at it, shoot at it, and when the day comes for the dentist to pull my real teeth out and I'm left with just my gums--I'll just "gum" the issue to death and spit it out!

Thank you for that lovely mental picture.

And I believe with my whole heart that I have my boxin' gloves on and am standing in the corner with the truth about alcohol--and I'm waiting for the bell to ring so that I can come out and beat the "livin' snot" out of the poison people injest for fun!

Interesting how you are against someone having a little wine with dinner now and then, but not against sanctioned physical violence. So many of your delightful allegorical comparisons involve beating, shooting, general warfare, etc. I wonder how many of the weaker brethren you are offending?

 

[Ransom]

blackbird said:

True, true! Alcohol is one of my pet peaves--I'll stomp on it, swing at it, shoot at it, and when the day comes for the dentist to pull my real teeth out and I'm left with just my gums--I'll just "gum" the issue to death and spit it out!

So not only have you ripped off Billy Sunday's prohibitionism, you appear to have plagiarized his vapid rhetoric too.

 

[blackbird]

Ransom & BrianT!!

So, its two against one here lately! I ain't against you guys--I ain't! I am against intoxicating beverages and the alcohol found in it! That industry in general! I ain't against you two--I'm against what you pour into your mouth that is an intoxicant!

Nowhere in the word does it say that bread and cheeze are mockers! By the way--can you clear up for our readers the thought you brought up concerning cheeze coming from the hind end of a cow!?? I believe you call the things that the raw milk comes from--udders! For those readers who are not "Farm Boys and Girls" but are identified as City Slickers--there is a possibliity that the phrase you used could be confusing! Besides, if I told ole "Mert" and little #63 what I think you were implying--the two girls may become offended at our little 3am meeting!!

My use of warfare scares you, does it not? It offends you, when I use boxing terminology and fighting and swords and spears and handguns when I stress a point?? What about the weak readers?? Jesus wasn't afraid to make statements such as "I came not to bring peace, but a sword!" Now, I thought Jesus was a peace lovin' guy? Liberals want to picture Jesus tiptoeing through the tulips, shakeing hands with the senators and congressmen and kissin' little babies! He did all that, true! But He had a sharp sword--that will make Luke Skywalker's Light Sabre--look like an "Old Timer" pocketknife!!

When the disciples counted the swords in their arsenal and had an inventory count of two--what did Jesus say? "Now, boys! You know I'm against those things! I wish you hadn't 'a brought those things into this upper room--such a sacred place!" When Peter wacked that servant's ear off there in the garden--never once did Jesus "beseech" Peter to "sheath" his weapon! He brought healing--true--but not before there was a slice taken out of the fella's ear like Peter just opened up a can of Spam!

How come Paul makes reference to weapons of our warfare?? Gee, the Romans and company never thought to form a DMZ around Paul!!

What about when Jesus comes to Earth again--welding a sword--making Anikan Skywalker and Obi-Wan Kanobi look like they just got out of Boy Scouts. No bloodshed?? Try measuring up to the horse's bridals--probably an average of 4 feet deep!

So, don't let my weapons scare you--I ain't aiming at you--I'm aiming at the beer and whiskey , and all of that sissy wine and any other intoxicating beverage someone may decide to dream up! Just don't get caught in my "Line of Fire!"--because its a fight to the finish, my dear brother!

PS--I ain't plagerizing the late great Brother Sunday--compared to me, he's Liberal!

Your friend,
Blackbird

 

[C.S. Murphy]

Originally posted by Ransom:
[QB]blackbird said:

If you think about it--the alcohol is a waste product produced in the dying process of the grape--as covered in above post!

But, based on the above, I would assume you don't eat bread - which could not exist without the same process of fermentation. Those little holes in bread? The waste product produced as yeast eats sugar and excretes carbon dioxide and alcohol.

What about unleavened bread? I don't know if the Bible mentions bread in heaven, it may I just don't remember it. This thread is on alcohol. I have always assumed the fruit of the vine Jesus promised to drink in the kingdom would be alcoholic but Blackbird has a good point(or whoever made it) that the alcohol comes from fermentation, which is rottening and death. No death in heaven, and the view that eating grapes is killing them is just plain silly. Please refute the point about the frementing of wine in Heaven instead of taking off on bread, cheese, steak, guns, violence, and donuts

Murph

 

[BrianT]

Originally posted by blackbird:

I ain't against you guys--I ain't!

And I "ain't" againt you. I'm against your faulty logic, false conclusions, misrepresentations, double standards, and avoidance of simple points.

My use of warfare scares you, does it not? It offends you, when I use boxing terminology and fighting and swords and spears and handguns when I stress a point??

No, I am not scared or offended. It's interesting how you avoided the point, presented another double standard, misrepresented me, and jumped to a false conclusion all at the same time. That takes real talent!

By Murphy:

No death in heaven, and the view that eating grapes is killing them is just plain silly. Please refute the point about the frementing of wine in Heaven instead of taking off on bread, cheese, steak, guns, violence, and donuts

How do you make grape juice? Do you not pluck grapes off the vine, and crush them? How is that "silly"? How do you make bread? Do you not harvest living grains, dry them, grind them up into flour? Murphy, Blackbird's point was that alcohol is impossible because there is "no death" in heaven - but his very premise would prevent not only alcohol, but everything were some plant life dies. Blackbird's point is refuted by demonstrating the premise is faulty.

I'll tell you what is silly: this discussion.

 

[C.S. Murphy]

Originally posted by BrianT:

How do you make grape juice? Do you not pluck grapes off the vine, and crush them? How is that "silly"? How do you make bread? Do you not harvest living grains, dry them, grind them up into flour? Murphy, Blackbird's point was that alcohol is impossible because there is "no death" in heaven - but his very premise would prevent not only alcohol, but everything were some plant life dies. Blackbird's point is refuted by demonstrating the premise is faulty.

Brian once again you refuse to answer the points listed. I truly believe Blackbird may have something here, maybe not. But I won't learn anything about that from you because you are too busy bringing up something else. If your bread view is valid do we know for certain bread will be eaten in heaven? As I said I don't know but possibly the fermenting process is different from picking and eating grapes. I will say one thing for you though, I am pleased that you have posted one reply to me that did not include donuts.
Murph

 

[HankD]

Brethren,

First of all, Jesus can do whatever He pleases.
If He wants to make wine or grape juice in heaven (or the Kingdom) without growing the grapes, picking and squeezing them (killing them) then He can.

Might I remind everyone that He already did it here on earth at the marriage in Cana. He made wine without any grapes at all, just water.
He also made fish flesh without killing any fish at the feeding of the 5000.

Second RE:the "fruit" of the vineyard:
The word that Jesus uses for fruit in this passage is not the standard word for fruit as of a tree such as an apple (karpos) but refers more to the resultant product from a process (ghennema);(plant, cultivate, harvest, squeeze, and put in wine skins).

Third, if we are resurrected when we drink this "fruit" of the vineyard that Jesus makes for us "new in the Kingdom" and it happens to contain alcohol, it won't matter because we will be alive through the Spirit and not oxygenated blood.
A resurrected human being could drink a gallon of pure ethanol and not get drunk because the bio-physics of blood intoxication won't be there (remember, a drunk's blood alcohol is what determines legal intoxication).

And yes, I agree. This thread is getting silly.

And I wish people would stop with this krispi Kreme thing and no donuts in heaven

HankD

[ October 03, 2002, 11:33 PM: Message edited by: HankD ]