Angels and CoHabiting with Mankind?

[DHK]

I've addressed that at least twice before on this thread, and so have others. Look at the passage. He doesn't say that at all.

Jude, NASB
6 And angels who did not keep their own domain, but abandoned their proper abode, He has kept in eternal bonds under darkness for the judgment of the great day,
7 just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities around them, since they in the same way as these indulged in gross immorality and went after strange flesh, are exhibited as an example in undergoing the punishment of eternal fire. ​

Note that the half-brother of Jesus states quite clearly that those angels have been kept in eternal bonds since they abandoned "their domain" -- heaven, and the presence of God. The reference to "strange flesh" is to the men of Soddom and Gomorrah and the cities around them that sought after illicit sex with other men. It does not say angels did so. And as has been pointed out repeatedly, they being spirit beings not of flesh, such a sexual relationship is impossible.

People want to believe in fairy tales and magic, but it has no place in bad interpretations of biblical passages.

The more relevant Scripture is here:

2 Peter 2:4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;
5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;

The angels that sinned and are reserved for judgment, kept in chains of darkness until that time, are the same ones that are associated with the evil catastrophic events that happened during the time of Noah.

 

[percho]

Was Mary impregnated by 'elohiym ?

Contrary to what one may believe concerning the Son of God; During her pregnancy all the way up to the birth of Jesus, did Mary feel as if someone had been procreated within her?

Was this baby that was born of her actually a part of her and is still so today?

Is this relative to whether angels could produce offspring with women or not?

I believe it is, yet I am also not sure.

I like DHK believe Jude says angels did.

 

[percho]

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,double post

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

:BangHead::BangHead::BangHead::BangHead:

Find me anywhere the Bible refers to fallen angels as "Sons of God"!! It is not there!! Oh, the absurdity! And from supposedly biblically literate people!!

Only righteous angels are the "sons of God" by creation – God is their Father in that limited sense. Scripture says that those who follow Satan have him as their father (John 8:44). It does not necessarily follow that the phrase "sons of God" always refers just to the righteous angels. Instead, the phrase and overall concept is overwhelmingly applied in Scripture – not to angels – but to believers!

Any other "interpretation" is lacking in scholarship, spiritual guidance, and understanding.

I'm done here. This truly is the height of foolishness.

 

[abcgrad94]

I couldn't find the exact post, but I think Webdog brought up the point that on earth, God created everything to reproduce after its own kind. That is absolutely true, and it is an argument we use all the time against evolution. Fish don't turn into reptiles, dinosaurs into birds, etc. We do, however, have "kinds" that produce hybrids. Horses and donkeys produce a mule or a hinny, depending on which was the male and which was the female parent.

But, it's entirely possible that people and angels are also a "kind." Christ was made a "little lower than the angels." Psalm 8:4-5 calls man a little lower than the angels. One has to wonder why this phrase is used to compare man and angels. If we are a "little lower" what does that mean? That we are not as powerful or as spiritual? It would seem this indicates angels and man are very similar, or maybe within the same "kind."

Also, I Corinthians 6:3 says we will "judge angels." Why would God let man judge angels, and why would the angels need to be judged by man? Perhaps it's because of the fallen angels who sinned with human women.

 

[DHK]

:BangHead::BangHead::BangHead::BangHead:

Find me anywhere the Bible refers to fallen angels as "Sons of God"!! It is not there!! Oh, the absurdity! And from supposedly biblically literate people!!

Job 1:6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them.

Who are the "sons of God," and why is Satan among them, standing in the presence of God?

 

[Yeshua1]

:BangHead::BangHead::BangHead::BangHead:

Find me anywhere the Bible refers to fallen angels as "Sons of God"!! It is not there!! Oh, the absurdity! And from supposedly biblically literate people!!

Only righteous angels are the "sons of God" by creation – God is their Father in that limited sense. Scripture says that those who follow Satan have him as their father (John 8:44). It does not necessarily follow that the phrase "sons of God" always refers just to the righteous angels. Instead, the phrase and overall concept is overwhelmingly applied in Scripture – not to angels – but to believers!

Any other "interpretation" is lacking in scholarship, spiritual guidance, and understanding.

I'm done here. This truly is the height of foolishness.

Demons are fallen angels, so they would have once been knowb as "sons of God"

Why is it so hard to believe that demons could possess fallen sinners, and that the union between them and females would have been evil unusuall beings?

 

[Reynolds]

:BangHead::BangHead::BangHead::BangHead:

Find me anywhere the Bible refers to fallen angels as "Sons of God"!! It is not there!! Oh, the absurdity! And from supposedly biblically literate people!!

Only righteous angels are the "sons of God" by creation – God is their Father in that limited sense. Scripture says that those who follow Satan have him as their father (John 8:44). It does not necessarily follow that the phrase "sons of God" always refers just to the righteous angels. Instead, the phrase and overall concept is overwhelmingly applied in Scripture – not to angels – but to believers!

Any other "interpretation" is lacking in scholarship, spiritual guidance, and understanding.

I'm done here. This truly is the height of foolishness.

It is your contention that "sons of God" can not reference fallen angels but it can reference fallen men?

 

[Revmitchell]

You have the teaching of the verse wrong.

No I don't. You are welcome to twist that anyway you wish to support your fairy tale.

 

[percho]

I couldn't find the exact post, but I think Webdog brought up the point that on earth, God created everything to reproduce after its own kind. That is absolutely true, and it is an argument we use all the time against evolution. Fish don't turn into reptiles, dinosaurs into birds, etc. We do, however, have "kinds" that produce hybrids. Horses and donkeys produce a mule or a hinny, depending on which was the male and which was the female parent.

But, it's entirely possible that people and angels are also a "kind." Christ was made a "little lower than the angels." Psalm 8:4-5 calls man a little lower than the angels. One has to wonder why this phrase is used to compare man and angels. If we are a "little lower" what does that mean? That we are not as powerful or as spiritual? It would seem this indicates angels and man are very similar, or maybe within the same "kind."

Also, I Corinthians 6:3 says we will "judge angels." Why would God let man judge angels, and why would the angels need to be judged by man? Perhaps it's because of the fallen angels who sinned with human women.

It tells you what a littler lower than the angels means. For the purpose of death.

Angels can not die. ----- See Luke 20:36 Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection.

Man was created so that he could die.

Jesus the Son of the living God was born of woman do he could suffer death.

 

[DHK]

It tells you what a littler lower than the angels means. For the purpose of death.

That is wrong.

Angels can not die. ----- See Luke 20:36 Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection.

Again wrong. That is not what the verse says. Read the context:

Luke 20:33 Therefore in the resurrection whose wife of them is she? for seven had her to wife.
34 And Jesus answering said unto them, The children of this world marry, and are given in marriage:
35 But they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage:
36 Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection.

Verse 36 "Neither can THEY die" refers to humans, not angels. It refers to the woman and the seven husbands in the resurrection. It does not refer to the angels. "They are the children of the resurrection." The angels are not the children of the resurrection, they will never be resurrected.

Man was created so that he could die.

Wrong again. Man was created for the glory of God.
In fact the Westminster Catechism says:
"The chief end of man is to love God and glorify him forever."

But in Ephesians one it declares:
Ephesians 1:12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

 

[percho]

That is wrong.

Again wrong. That is not what the verse says. Read the context:

Luke 20:33 Therefore in the resurrection whose wife of them is she? for seven had her to wife.
34 And Jesus answering said unto them, The children of this world marry, and are given in marriage:
35 But they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage:
36 Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection.

Verse 36 "Neither can THEY die" refers to humans, not angels. It refers to the woman and the seven husbands in the resurrection. It does not refer to the angels. "They are the children of the resurrection." The angels are not the children of the resurrection, they will never be resurrected.

Wrong again. Man was created for the glory of God.
In fact the Westminster Catechism says:
"The chief end of man is to love God and glorify him forever."

But in Ephesians one it declares:
Ephesians 1:12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

In what manner are the resurrected equal unto the angels?

Can angels die?


And how will man unto whom it was once appoint to die bring glory to God?

Is it not by being redeemed from the power of Satan, that is death, by being given eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. The gift of God?


Jesus prayed. And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was. John 17:5

1 Peter 1:21 Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.

Is that the glory Jesus prayed for? Did it come with the resurrection?

And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together. Rom 8:17

Is that the same glory? When did Jesus inherit glory? When will we?



How was the Christ as of a lamb without spot and without blemish going to die if man in whose image he would come wasn't made to die?

 

[DHK]

In what manner are the resurrected equal unto the angels?

Read the passage. When we are resurrected we will be as the angels. There will be no more death. That is what Christ said. Neither will there be any more marriage for ALL of mankind.

Can angels die?

Nope, and neither will man be able to die AFTER the resurrection as Jesus said.

And how will man unto whom it was once appoint to die bring glory to God?

This is before the resurrection. Now we are created to bring glory to God, while on this earth, and someday this earthly, temporary body will die. Then we will reign with him. We are heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ.

Is it not by being redeemed from the power of Satan, that is death, by being given eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. The gift of God?

Yes, but we wait for the redemption of our body.

Jesus prayed. And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was. John 17:5

1 Peter 1:21 Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.

Is that the glory Jesus prayed for? Did it come with the resurrection?

And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together. Rom 8:17

Is that the same glory? When did Jesus inherit glory? When will we?

How was the Christ as of a lamb without spot and without blemish going to die if man in whose image he would come wasn't made to die?

Christ was speaking of the resurrection. In heaven we are like the angels.
We are spirit beings. There is no marriage for us in heaven.
We are as the angels. That is what Christ said. He was referring to mankind. Read the passage again. "They are as the angels in heaven," he said, referring to mankind.
Not we nor the angels marry or procreate in heaven.

But that doesn't rule out those activities on earth does it?

 

[percho]

Read the passage. When we are resurrected we will be as the angels. There will be no more death. That is what Christ said. Neither will there be any more marriage for ALL of mankind.

Nope, and neither will man be able to die AFTER the resurrection as Jesus said.

This is before the resurrection. Now we are created to bring glory to God, while on this earth, and someday this earthly, temporary body will die. Then we will reign with him. We are heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ.

Yes, but we wait for the redemption of our body.

Christ was speaking of the resurrection. In heaven we are like the angels.
We are spirit beings. There is no marriage for us in heaven.
We are as the angels. That is what Christ said. He was referring to mankind. Read the passage again. "They are as the angels in heaven," he said, referring to mankind.
Not we nor the angels marry or procreate in heaven.

But that doesn't rule out those activities on earth does it?

Actually we are in agreement.