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Another hurricane and more earthquakes. The birth pangs continue to increase!
- Thread starter evangelist6589
- Start date
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
Your problem is reading all those prophecy books. LeHaye made a fortune writing prophecy books and scaring small children and perhaps some naive adults. Jesus Christ will return when He returns to resurrect ALL the dead and execute judgment on Satan and his disciples. Until then He tells us: Occupy till I come. Notice he did not say Occupy until I snatch you away!
When I was as wet behind the ears as you are I said the same thing. I'm pretty sure C4K would agree with me that when we were in Bible College together (30 years ago!) we never expected the Lord to tarry THIS long.
Right- so play on their fears to try to chalk a conversion? I think not.
"Sensational evangelism" is what it is called.
NaasPreacher (C4K)
Well-Known Member
Yup - exactly. But I have not given up hope
- I just stopped trying connect headlines to prophecy. It is kind of relaxing realising that there is nothing between now and seeing Jesus!
Okay, so you read eschatology. How are you doing growing in the other theological disciplines?
What are you reading for: Christology, Pneumatology, Ecclesiology, Soteriology, Hamartiology, etc etc etc?
If you're only reading eschatology your view of God and God's Word will be warped. It's like giving a child a ton of candy but no meat. They won't develop properly. True story, we have a friend who decided that after having a baby she needed to go on the Atkins Diet. Now at this time the child was about 2 years old and eating solid food. When she cooked up meals she simply gave him what she was eating on the diet. Within about 6 months her pediatrician told her to stop doing this because her child was underweight, growing slower, and not staying where he should be since he needs a complete diet.
When we only read one aspect of theology over and over we give up a complete diet of God's revelation and Gospel. We stop growing properly.
OR,
You have spoken correctly.Dispensational Ideas have moved the focus fron serving God to speculating on the mark of the beast.
:thumbs::thumbs: Well spoken and needful for all believers.
Yeah that's kind of the thing that gets me about dispensational eschatology (what might be called "prophecy") speculation. If they are correct (I don't think they are) but if they are then they have no control over whether it is going to happen and certainly won't be around when it does. So who cares? Makes no sense to me.
If there a singular Anti-Christ figure (I don't believe there is) and that person is alive...it doesn't matter.
If we are approaching the time of the rapture of the Church before the Tribulation (I don't believe in this sequence nor a Tribulation) then there is nothing we can do about it...it doesn't matter.
If an actual dragon will appear out of the earth and cause turmoil (which is figurative language)...it doesn't matter.
None of this stuff matters, it's just a rouse for people to get rich selling books. It doesn't matter. Faithfulness to God's call here and now does matter. Reaching people with the Gospel does matter.
Figuring out if a hurricane in the Gulf affecting an minor segment of the population of the world in a minor period of history is linked with an earthquake in an earthquake laden area and whether both are pointing to the end of the age...doesn't matter.
If there a singular Anti-Christ figure (I don't believe there is) and that person is alive...it doesn't matter.
If we are approaching the time of the rapture of the Church before the Tribulation (I don't believe in this sequence nor a Tribulation) then there is nothing we can do about it...it doesn't matter.
If an actual dragon will appear out of the earth and cause turmoil (which is figurative language)...it doesn't matter.
None of this stuff matters, it's just a rouse for people to get rich selling books. It doesn't matter. Faithfulness to God's call here and now does matter. Reaching people with the Gospel does matter.
Figuring out if a hurricane in the Gulf affecting an minor segment of the population of the world in a minor period of history is linked with an earthquake in an earthquake laden area and whether both are pointing to the end of the age...doesn't matter.
6 For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise.
37 For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry.
38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
Several years ago I had the opportunity and pleasure to teach through the Book of Revelation in SS. I suspect most in the class were Rapture Ready, a doctrine I reject and I am not sure my teaching changed any minds.
In that process I gained a real appreciation for the Book of Revelation. I believe that Revelation is a prophetic book but I believe it is so much more than that.
The Book of Revelation was written at a time when the churches were undergoing persecution from the Roman government, a persecution that would increase to vicious extremes at times. I believe the book was written to comfort those undergoing such persecution with the promise that the ‘true believers’, the Saints, and the Church they constitute would in time emerge triumphant. That comfort extends not only to the early churches but to the churches of all ages until the Lord Jesus Christ returns. So then the Book of Revelation, the final book in the Canon of Holy Scripture, is a story of victory and with victory, vindication;
1. The victory first promised in Eden.
2. The victory purchased by the Blood of the Lamb of God, Jesus Christ.
3. The vindication of the sacrificial death of Jesus Christ for His Bride the Church, the Redeemed of all time.
4. The vindication of the redeemed of all time, those who have “lived by faith”.
All this is portrayed in graphic detail. In the Book of Reveletion:
1. We see Jesus Christ revealed on a cosmic level, the King of Kings and Lord of Lords, whereas in the Gospels we see Jesus Christ revealed primarily on a personal level, the Son of Man, the Suffering Servant, the Lamb of God, and our Saviour.
2. We see, as no where else in Scripture, the Triune nature of God clearly revealed and emphasized, particularly in the Apostle John’s vision of the throne room of God as recorded in Chapters 4 & 5.
3. We see the sovereignty of God again clearly revealed and emphasized as no where else in Scripture, in the salvation of His elect, in His providential care over His chosen ones, and in His control of history to achieve His purpose.
4. We see time after time, in fact through seven different pictures, the triumph of the King of Kings and Lord of Lords over Satan and the dreadful wrath of God meted out to those who continue in rebellion against Him.
All the above being said I believe your comments are very true. God will bring all things to a close in His own time [speaking as a human] and in His own way. Nothing we do or say will change that truth. We may get anxious but God doesn't. We had best enjoy the life that God has given us until He takes each of us Home!
I agree with you on this one.
Christology
Christ Among other gods
Jesus among other gods
Pneumatology
God in you by david Jeremiah, and also some by John MacArthur
Ecclesiology
Nothing at this time except for sections in the book Disciplines of a Godly man.
Soteriology
Eternal Security
2 books by Lutzer
Captured by Grace by David Jeremiah
Hamartiology
Counterfeit Gods by keller
Changed into His Image
The Practice of Godliness
etc..
Oh no I read all kinds of books by lots of authors. I also have the book Crazy Love which I will start reading soon.
This is very hurtful to the Great Commission.
This jumping at shadows, this horrendous handling of apocalyptic passages hurts the church's credibility literally AS MUCH AS OR MORE THAN Harold Camping.
And it is based on the same kind of error that Camping employed.
If you are going to be an evangelist- GREAT!
But please focus on doing ACTUAL evangelism which is preaching the GOSPEL not this new, reckless daily event prophecy forecasting.
It weakens the hands of responsible evangelists.
Well said and Great Illustration of the Beauty of Preterism
You have nicely (I’m sure not willingly) made a great point about some of the foundational underpinnings of realizing preterism as the correct way to view prophecy.
Having the coming of Christ and prophecy settled frees Christians up from needing to wonder when Christ will return and allows them to get on with the business of evangelizing the world and going about the work of Christ.
It frees us up to focus on how to further the kingdom of Christ and claim the victory we have in Christ instead of putting that victory off to some future date.
You have nicely (I’m sure not willingly) made a great point about some of the foundational underpinnings of realizing preterism as the correct way to view prophecy.
Having the coming of Christ and prophecy settled frees Christians up from needing to wonder when Christ will return and allows them to get on with the business of evangelizing the world and going about the work of Christ.
It frees us up to focus on how to further the kingdom of Christ and claim the victory we have in Christ instead of putting that victory off to some future date.
I could not agree more- except that I don't understand what you mean by the phrase in the parenthesis.
I pay no or little attention to the eschatological views of Reformed & non Dispensationalists.
Preterism has been slam dunked and defeated long ago in the book "The Second Coming" by John MacArthur. I think I am more concerned with Covenant Premillennialists & historic premillennialists and their post & mid trib views.
Why be concerned? We're going to go UP together regardless.
Yeah, cuz why bother evaluating and considering other perspectives? Clearly drawing on a select few fairly shallow theologies is clearly enough to inform us. Since we've already arrived at our conclusions its really just about finding those who support them...
Well for starters, MacArthur didn't "slam dunk" preterism like you think he did. There are a number of good replies to preterism out there but no "slam dunks." In order to properly respond to preterism we must first recognize it is a viable theological option which has a lot of support. The next step is realizing that there are few "slam dunks" theologically to a system like that. Just saying man, I think you've got your head in the ground here.
The best challenges to preterism are internal evidences from within the book of Revelation itself. It is a complicated argument though.