Appointed To Eternal Life?

[Rye]

This is how many of the mainstream committee based English translations render Acts 13:48...

KJV - And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.
NKJV - Now when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and glorified the word of the Lord. And as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed.
NIV - When the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and honored the word of the Lord; and all who were appointed for eternal life believed.
ESV - And when the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord, and as many as were appointed to eternal life believed.
NASB - When the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord; and all who had been appointed to eternal life believed.
NLT - When the Gentiles heard this, they were very glad and thanked the Lord for his message; and all who were chosen for eternal life became believers.

Notice how scholars have translated this verse with great consistency.

ὅσοι (hosoi) As many as - a correlative pronoun, meaning there is a limit on the number of those who believe.

τεταγμένοι (tetagmenoi) appointed - a perfect passive, meaning someone else is doing the appointing.

The original language does not allow any room for human action. You cannot make the claim that they appointed themselves to eternal life.

Appointment to eternal life results in belief. If anyone does not believe, they were not appointed to eternal life.

This is a straightforward statement that is consistent with the rest of scripture.

John 8:47 - He that is of God heareth God’s words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

This does not say that they refuse to hear God's words, but that they cannot hear God's words. If anyone is of God, that means they can hear God's words because they have been appointed to eternal life.

 

[Silverhair]

This is how many of the mainstream committee based English translations render Acts 13:48...

KJV - And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.
NKJV - Now when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and glorified the word of the Lord. And as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed.
NIV - When the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and honored the word of the Lord; and all who were appointed for eternal life believed.
ESV - And when the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord, and as many as were appointed to eternal life believed.
NASB - When the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord; and all who had been appointed to eternal life believed.
NLT - When the Gentiles heard this, they were very glad and thanked the Lord for his message; and all who were chosen for eternal life became believers.

Notice how scholars have translated this verse with great consistency.

ὅσοι (hosoi) As many as - a correlative pronoun, meaning there is a limit on the number of those who believe.

τεταγμένοι (tetagmenoi) appointed - a perfect passive, meaning someone else is doing the appointing.

The original language does not allow any room for human action. You cannot make the claim that they appointed themselves to eternal life.

Appointment to eternal life results in belief. If anyone does not believe, they were not appointed to eternal life.

This is a straightforward statement that is consistent with the rest of scripture.

John 8:47 - He that is of God heareth God’s words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

This does not say that they refuse to hear God's words, but that they cannot hear God's words. If anyone is of God, that means they can hear God's words because they have been appointed to eternal life.

If you Calvinists would learn to read things in context you would not make so many errors in your posts.

Your whole theology seems to be build on out of context cherry picked verses.

 

[DaveXR650]

If you Calvinists would learn to read things in context you would not make so many errors in your posts.

Your whole theology seems to be build on out of context cherry picked verses.

It reminds me of when the Ghost of Christmas Present is taking Scrooge through town and seeing all the happy folks preparing for Christmas, Scrooge says "There's a lot of buying going on!". And the ghost says "Is that all you get out of this?" You have a point.

 

[KenH]

This is how many of the mainstream committee based English translations render Acts 13:48...

KJV - And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.
NKJV - Now when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and glorified the word of the Lord. And as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed.
NIV - When the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and honored the word of the Lord; and all who were appointed for eternal life believed.
ESV - And when the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord, and as many as were appointed to eternal life believed.
NASB - When the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord; and all who had been appointed to eternal life believed.
NLT - When the Gentiles heard this, they were very glad and thanked the Lord for his message; and all who were chosen for eternal life became believers.

Notice how scholars have translated this verse with great consistency.

ὅσοι (hosoi) As many as - a correlative pronoun, meaning there is a limit on the number of those who believe.

τεταγμένοι (tetagmenoi) appointed - a perfect passive, meaning someone else is doing the appointing.

The original language does not allow any room for human action. You cannot make the claim that they appointed themselves to eternal life.

Appointment to eternal life results in belief. If anyone does not believe, they were not appointed to eternal life.

This is a straightforward statement that is consistent with the rest of scripture.

John 8:47 - He that is of God heareth God’s words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

This does not say that they refuse to hear God's words, but that they cannot hear God's words. If anyone is of God, that means they can hear God's words because they have been appointed to eternal life.

Well said, Rye. Well said.

 

[Rye]

If you Calvinists would learn to read things in context you would not make so many errors in your posts.

Would you mind correcting me with the proper context?

Also, I have never studied any of the works of Calvin. All I’m doing is interpreting the text exactly as it is written and if a man named John Calvin happens to agree with me, then so be it.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Would you mind correcting me with the proper context?

Also, I have never studied any of the works of Calvin. All I’m doing is interpreting the text exactly as it is written and if a man named John Calvin happens to agree with me, then so be it.

Touché

 

[DaveXR650]

Would you mind correcting me with the proper context?

@Silverhair can speak for himself but the proper context is that Act 13 has Paul carefully going through a brief history of how God chose Israel, gave them charge as bearers of his Law, put up with their disobedience, allowed Israel to be the line that brought forth the Saviour, Jesus, and even though they killed him, he was raised and now as in verse 38 it is declared that forgiveness of sins is being preached to this same group of people.

At this point, verse 40, a warning is given to these Jews in real time, lest they not believe, as explained in verse 41, and the prophesy come true that they will perish. My question here is "Why is no mention made of those here who might take Paul's advice and believe, so that they not be part of those who perish in verse 41, as being "ordained" to believe or not? It seems to me that instead a clear choice is being put before them, even though you have a clear prophesy stated in verse 41.

I notice back in verse 7 you have the story of Sergius Paulus, who ends up believing after seeing what Paul does to the sorcerer. There is no mention here of Sergius having to be "ordained" to believe. Closer to the verse in question, verse 38 you have some Jews who apparently did believe and Paul encourages them and yet there is no mention of them having to be "ordained" to believe. It's only in verse 48 that the specific group of gentiles was said to be "ordained" to believe. This is my own personal take on this but I believe that it is said "ordained" here to emphasize that the fact that gentiles would believe was just as much part of God's ordained plan as what Paul had just spent the first 40 verses explaining regarding Israel and the Jews and how that God had ordained everything leading up to Jesus.

Paul, as always, was trying to prove two things, that Jesus was the actual Christ, and that gentiles could also come by faith as could Jews. That is the context. I in no way mean to diminish the role of the Holy Spirit in the salvation of anyone who comes to faith but just to caution that you can still overemphasize one aspect and go off in a tangent.

 

[Silverhair]

Would you mind correcting me with the proper context?

Also, I have never studied any of the works of Calvin. All I’m doing is interpreting the text exactly as it is written and if a man named John Calvin happens to agree with me, then so be it.

If you take your time and read Act 13:26-48 you will see what the Jews rejected and what the Gentiles accepted. They heard they gospel message and believed it and were saved.

It's not complicated when you actually read what the bible says.

For someone that has not read Calvin you do seem to hold to his errant theology so you must be getting it from the people you are reading or listening to.

 

[Rye]

If you take your time and read Act 13:26-48 you will see what the Jews rejected and what the Gentiles accepted.

Brother, the only reason why anyone rejects the Gospel is because they are enslaved to a fallen nature and it takes the work of the Spirit to bring them to life. In this case, the Jews were passed over in order that they receive justice and the Gentiles were spared in order that they receive mercy.

For someone that has not read Calvin you do seem to hold to his errant theology so you must be getting it from the people you are reading or listening to.

I started out 2024 as a synergist and I’m ending 2024 as a monergist because I had no choice but to submit to what the scripture says. It’s not that I am blindly following one man. I carefully listen to what both sides have to say.

 

[Silverhair]

Brother, the only reason why anyone rejects the Gospel is because they are enslaved to a fallen nature and it takes the work of the Spirit to bring them to life. In this case, the Jews were passed over in order that they receive justice and the Gentiles were spared in order that they receive mercy.



I started out 2024 as a synergist and I’m ending 2024 as a monergist because I had no choice but to submit to what the scripture says. It’s not that I am blindly following one man. I carefully listen to what both sides have to say.

Are you saying that the Holy Spirit has to make them alive before they can believe? That is not biblical. Man has the ability to hear and believe or hear and reject the gospel. Those that believe will be saved and vice versa.

I never was a synergist as only God can save.

 

[Rye]

Are you saying that the Holy Spirit has to make them alive before they can believe? That is not biblical.

Doesn’t Acts 13:48 say that they had to be appointed to eternal life before they believed? It does not say that they had to believe before they were appointed to eternal life.

I never was a synergist as only God can save.

I agree that only God can save. But if someone says that we have to meet a condition, such as accept a gift, I’m pretty sure that fits the definition of synergism.

 

[Rye]

My question here is "Why is no mention made of those here who might take Paul's advice and believe, so that they not be part of those who perish in verse 41, as being "ordained" to believe or not? It seems to me that instead a clear choice is being put before them, even though you have a clear prophesy stated in verse 41.

You're right, it's very possible that the Jews mentioned may have come to faith at a later point in time. Scripture does not tell us. However, your definition of "choice" seems to be that everyone is a morally neutral. A clear choice is being presented to them, however none of the Jews would ever come to Christ on their own because their choices are limited by their spiritually dead nature.

I notice back in verse 7 you have the story of Sergius Paulus, who ends up believing after seeing what Paul does to the sorcerer. There is no mention here of Sergius having to be "ordained" to believe.

From what scripture tells us, everyone is saved the same way. Just as the Gentiles had to be appointed to eternal life, Sergius had to be appointed to eternal life as well.

 

[DaveXR650]

A clear choice is being presented to them, however none of the Jews would ever come to Christ on their own because their choices are limited by their spiritually dead nature.

Verse 43 tells us that some of them did believe and were encouraged by Paul and Barnabas. Yet no mention that they were "ordained" to believe.

Sergius had to be appointed to eternal life as well.

I would agree. But we are not told that here, in the context. And in verse 40 where the warning is given, conditionally, that they should not refuse to believe and fall in with those prophesied in verse 41, again, no mention of needing to be ordained.

I'm not attacking the idea that anyone who becomes a believer was ordained to do so. I am proposing that some of the Calvinist writers that I read do indeed way overemphasize determinism when they take a chapter like Acts 13, which talks about many things, and the only thing they seem to see is that "ordained" was mentioned once.

 

[DaveXR650]

I started out 2024 as a synergist and I’m ending 2024 as a monergist because I had no choice but to submit to what the scripture says. It’s not that I am blindly following one man. I carefully listen to what both sides have to say.

Most people do that because the only way you initially experience salvation is that you believe. You have no way to perceive "election". All you know is that you now believe and it naturally appears to you that you finally figured it all out. Only later, upon further reading of scripture do you find out how much God was pursuing you and how like Paul says in Philippians chapter 3 you were "apprehended" by Christ.

But since you seem to be new to this since this happened in 2024 keep in mind that the same Calvinist writers who seriously believe in predestination also teach that we must strive to enter in at the strait gate and that Heaven is taken by storm. They also have the very best and most helpful things to say on the necessity of holiness if you want to be saved. My only concern is when I see posts like this thread is that one can get so caught up in the logic of the theology that you can end up camping so to speak on the idea that you are elect and forget the importance of believing. In fact, I would suggest that you get on CCEL and look up Calvin's commentary on Acts 13:48. He strongly agrees with the idea of God ordaining those who are to be saved but if you read his commentary on that verse he ends by warning us not to spend too much effort contemplating election while neglecting belief, which is how we connect to all this.

 

[Alan Dale Gross]

E.G. "everyone" who believes in Jesus shall have eternal life
where all of those "everyone"s have been given the necessary faith to believe.

Most people do that because the only way you initially experience salvation is that you believe. You have no way to perceive "election". All you know is that you now believe and it naturally appears to you that you finally figured it all out. Only later, upon further reading of scripture do you find out how much God was pursuing you and how like Paul says in Philippians chapter 3 you were "apprehended" by Christ

New thread: https://www.baptistboard.com/thread...egion-of-the-soul-below-consciousness.130851/

 

[kyredneck]

if someone says that we have to meet a condition, such as accept a gift, I’m pretty sure that fits the definition of synergism.

Synergists insist that the Holy Spirit cannot quicken us without our cooperation. Monergists know that the Holy Spirit works independently of our cooperation. SEE

 

[Silverhair]

Doesn’t Acts 13:48 say that they had to be appointed to eternal life before they believed? It does not say that they had to believe before they were appointed to eternal life.



I agree that only God can save. But if someone says that we have to meet a condition, such as accept a gift, I’m pretty sure that fits the definition of synergism.

Actually you are wrong in your understanding of Act 13:48. That is why you have to read that verse in context as I pointed out to you in post # 8. But even if you only look at verse 48 you will see your error.

"When the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord"
When the Gentile heard the gospel message was for them also they 1] rejoiced & 2] praised God. Ask yourself why would they rejoice or praise God if they did not believe the message? So we are told that those that had actually believed were the ones that were appointed to eternal life.

If you think that accepting the gift of salvation makes one a synergist then God must want us to be synergists.

See Act 13:48, Act 16:31, Eph 1:13, Eph 2:8-9, Rom 10:9, Rom 5:1-2 I could go on but I am sure you get the picture. God expects is to believe before He will save us. Just as the snake bitten Jews of Num 21:4-9 did not save themselves when they looked at the bronze serpent. They met the condition that God had set. Num 21:8 Then the LORD said to Moses, "Make a fiery serpent, and set it on a standard; and it shall come about, that everyone who is bitten, when he looks at it, he will live."

But the reality is that there is no synergism in salvation. Only God can save and the condition He has set is that we believe.

 

[Rye]

Only later, upon further reading of scripture do you find out how much God was pursuing you and how like Paul says in Philippians chapter 3 you were "apprehended" by Christ.

I agree that at first it seems like we did make the choice. However, I do not believe God has to pursue anyone, if He wants to save someone He will save them.

But since you seem to be new to this since this happened in 2024 keep in mind that the same Calvinist writers who seriously believe in predestination also teach that we must strive to enter in at the strait gate and that Heaven is taken by storm.

I don't try to be a fruit inspector because I can't see into anyone's heart. If someone has a genuine faith they will get into Heaven and it doesn't depend on holding to any form of systematic theology.

 

[Rye]

Ask yourself why would they rejoice or praise God if they did not believe the message?

Simply worshipping God doesn't save anybody. They came to believe after the fact.

Acts 16:14 - And a certain woman named Lydia, a seller of purple, of the city of Thyatira, which worshipped God, heard us: whose heart the Lord opened, that she attended unto the things which were spoken of Paul.

As was the case with the Lydia, the Gentile's hearts still had to be opened to come to a point of faith.

 

[DaveXR650]

I agree that at first it seems like we did make the choice. However, I do not believe God has to pursue anyone, if He wants to save someone He will save them.

I don't try to be a fruit inspector because I can't see into anyone's heart. If someone has a genuine faith they will get into Heaven and it doesn't depend on holding to any form of systematic theology.

They call this the "cage stage". You will probably lose most of your still unenlightened friends. Someday you will moderate your views, or maybe not.

The reason you need to be a fruit inspector is because you can't see into anyone's heart, especially yours, which is the only one you're supposed to be looking at anyway. You can ask yourself if you really believe, which is legitimate, but even that has the limitation of the deceptiveness of the human heart. The fact is, over time, and given freedom, we tend to do what we truly believe. That can be observed and evaluated, prayerfully. Any type of Calvinism that does not teach that should be run from, and quickly. Any group that so camps on the sovereignty of God that they dismiss and discard the admonitions in scripture on how to live a holy life is a worthless group to be in and is dangerous to your soul.