Are Old Fashioned Baptist Churches shrinking?

Yeah, what the funny looking guy said above...
It is also about fighting our personal giants in life by the power of God.

Once we realize that all we do in life, whether we win or lose, should be done to glorify God we are ready to face the giants.
All we have to do is give it our best, and leave the rest up to God.

Something like that... I don't want to ruin it for ya!

 

I am glad you told me that, I Am Blessed. Not being a football fan myself, I admit rbell almost lost me there for a sec!

On the other hand, I loved Chariots of Fire and I am not a track fan...

 

BTW amity...have Kleenex handy.

Now I didn't cry...I, er, um, had something in my eye. Both eyes.

 

Oh no, don't tell me the good guys LOSE!

 

I um..had something in my eyes... too....
No, you will cry when you see God blessings.

And then apply them to thoughts of your own life.

Anyway, that is what I've been told the reason OTHERS cry.

 

I would say that progressive was David putting on the armor given to him by Saul as this was the new thing. Conservative was David using the sling that had been proved or already been tried.

 

The FIVE smooth stones are grace. Five is the number of grace. I am not a big numerologist, but I got that much!

 

He didn't keep it on long though. It just didn't feel right to him. :laugh:

I think David took 5 stones because Goliath had 4 brothers...

 

I don't know about it being against our set up; I'd sure like to see a church house full of gospel-thirsty brethren every Sunday morning, but I do agree with you about our size. We have tended to remain pretty consistent in size over the last few centuries. You would be hard-pressed to find a Primitive Baptist church with membership over 100. There are several out there, but they are few and far between. The average is probably somewhere around 25 members, which has always been typical of Primitive Baptist churches.

Yep.

 

The thing is, when you don't use instruments in church, modern songs sound traditional. It would be hard to have a bass guitar, drum, and keyboard instrumental in a song while singing a cappella.:laugh:

 

Amen! Praise God, we saved sinner's are not as other men, and contend with one another of what was said. Some make remarks, as that is human nature, which makes it interesting revealing how each judge among the brothers.

 

Evidently this is a nice clean movie suitable for the whole family.

I love football and a movie with a good story line, and I'm sure anytime the Word of God goes forth, it will not return to Him void.

 

Ituttut, borrow or rent this movie when you get a chance. You'll really enjoy it. :wavey:

 

And I am uncomfortable with your view, and fully understand there will be creative additions by man injected into worship. But I look at it from another view. If we step back a little we get a much better view of the entire Bible. You spoke of object lessons, as well as being creative. I am not against that but we had better understand what we are doing, and see what others are doing. God address' both these subjects in the beginning hoping we would pay attention.

The first is Adam and Eve being creative in what they believe to be the correct attire. Lesson? He sets the standard.

The second is the offspring of sinful man that wishes to be creative. Enter Cain who decides to be creative for he rejects what he has been told. He rebelled and in his will, brought sacrifice that he just knew God would be happy with for it was so beautifully arranged, so colorful, presented with clean hands, free of that awful looking, stinking sticky stuff called blood. The world will reject what God requires. The blood was repulsive to Cain so he determined God was wrong for what God found precious, Cain rejected in his creativeness.

Lesson? We in our creativeness had better not ever leave out what is most precious to God. No preaching of the Cross - believing on our Lord Jesus Christ, is devoid of blood, and rejected by God. Blood must be mentioned for the world cannot make the connection without explaination. I believe "books, shows, programs" are from creative minds of man if this gospel is not central. These appeal to our own human nature, and we tell ourselves how much better off we are now as someone has been so creative to present to the secular world a very beautifully arranged, so colorful, and presented with clean hands, free of that awful looking, stinking sticky stuff called blood.

All I'm saying is we must be careful in our creativeness, and recognize it is so many times just that - Our Creativeness. I stand on the creativeness of God, and His lessons, and not man's. When I write such things as the above I am accused of arrogance, and being dogmatic. I don't mind this for the above is scripture narrowly defined, correctly divided and those that incorrectly judge do not accept assertions that are proved.

Wife has found some more things for me to do - will answer rest of your post tomorrow (God willing).

 

If I want to be creative I'll take an art class.

We really ought to try following the Biblical pattern first. Let's do things God's way. The Bible is a thorough furnisher.

 

It's not "either-or."

Creativity is a part of worship. Otherwise, there is no music, no sermon--other than the Scripture being read--no vocalized prayer, etc.

No one here is saying, "Hey, let's be creative at the expense of God's way."

And remember...we don't have an AD 60 bulletin from The First Baptist Church of Philippi. We don't know each and every element of the oldest of old-school worship. We do know we're admonished to sing, to pray, to listen to (and do) the Word, and other stuff. God's not up there going, "YOU REPROBATE...you did the offering in the wrong part of the service!!!" (insert lightning zap here)

If our creative input overshadows or diminishes God's message, then we have a problem. But if we use our creativity to illustrate God's message, I see absolutely no problem.

You're describing sin and its consequences. Creativity and sin are not the same thing.

 

The point is, if you design a worship service whose object is to give vent to human creativity, then that can only come at the expense of overshadowing the word of God. I have not been to very many churches outside of my own faith in decades, but when I have been it has generally been an enormous shock. I have been entertained! That is really too bad. A worship service should not be choreographed.

I suppose whatever I say is bound to fall on deaf ears because you have never known it any other way. That is about all there seems to be out there these days.

 

Not to be flippant but to answer again can we apply correctly the Word of God and know when was the beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God. Had John and Messiah been included in Prophecy? What was that gospel, and to whom it was preached? Mark 1:1-5. We need to go to Matthew to flesh out to see the whole message in the gospel of Jesus Christ. We see in chapter 3 verse 2 the gospel told that the "kingdom is at hand", as well as in Mark, and Luke.

Can we agree then that the gospel of Jesus Christ was that of John the Baptist? I believe Mark, Matthew, and Luke can be trusted in this, just as the "great commission" can be trusted as shown in Matthew, Mark, and Luke.

We see this same gospel being preached on the day of Pentecost and was in prophecy, but "the kingdom is at hand" has been dropped. So then the gospel changed to that "Kingdom will come", and no longer "it is at hand".

As we progress to the purpose of God, we see this same gospel is given to Peter to preach on the day of Pentecost, Acts 2:38? We notice this is all still in prophecy for proselytes can still come, but still can't enter into the inner court of the Temple.

With this information shown in His Word, which we believe in, Mark 9 perhaps can be better explained. What happened in Mark 9, took place in prophecy. It happened before Jesus shed His blood (Jesus said the Gentile, other than by proselysation is not included in that "Kingdom gospel), and then Pentecost came, and there were none outside of that group that could cast out Devil's, for surely scripture would tell us this was happening in that day.

What I am trying to get across is, if we believe the Bible and Christ Jesus from heaven, as well as on earth, we are to believe scripture for it tells us things that are not in prophecy or any where else. His Word says He had hidden from man since the beginning His Purpose of reconciling the world unto Himself. This cannot be in prophecy so that which happened in Mark 9 cannot be applied today. Is it the same gospel of the Cross that came after Acts 9, and was there a change in whom could now be included in this new gospel, and who could also be preached to? The gospel had to be changed from the "Kingdom gospel", to the "Body gospel".

The above is the reason we cannot make applicable today what is shown in Mark 9, as this is a specific incident occurring in that day only. That "Kingdom will come" is all that is known in Mark 9, but the reference was not available after Pentecost, and certainly not after Acts 9.

"Judge not that you be not judged." You take great liberty in you condemnation, and in your blessings. No where have I stated "That's not of God". Those are your words. I quote scripture understood.

Please answer (I've furnished you with this information) what is of God. Did Jesus while on earth preach a Gospel? What was it, and where did it come from? To whom did He preach? Was there a "Kingdom at hand", and is not the next thing on the agenda when He left this earth that the "Kingdom will come"? Tell me if this information is from God. If it is then you greatly err in condemning HIS WORD.

I believe the above, and I understand it. I also now know next on the agenda is the rapture so that "Kingdom can come". I know today Christ from heaven gave to my Apostle, and yours and every creature on this earth today another gospel. It is the gospel, and the only gospel that will get us into the "BODY OF CHRIST".

How do we enter in? Just as scripture tells, and not until God reveals what "He had hidden", was it possible to do so. Our gospel today is believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and we will be saved. Is this all, and if so HOW and WHEN is it made possible. Only when it appears in His Word. It first appears in writing where it can be understood, and also WHEN it can be understood. Ephesians 2:4-9, "But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
5. Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved
6. And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:
7. That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
8. For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9. Not of works, lest any man should boast."

Tell me if this of God or things I have made up, as some endeavor to convince other's.

 

I'll check it out. I like a good story line.

 

I've said it before to you. WoW!