Are the majority of those on the BB hostile to the IFB's?

Well Brother, this appears to be your unsupported opinion and you are welcome to it. However, because you have presented no rationale or argument in support of your opinion, you have no stronger claim to validity than the pastor in the pulpit or Jack Hyles whom you used as illustrations. Now, can you give some Scriptural support for your opinion or do we reach for the delete key? :smilewinkgrin:

 

If you are right, then a preacher is prevented from making practical applications of what he preaches. So, each man does what is right is his own eyes. Ummmmmmmmm......sounds a little like Israel when they had no judge. What do you think?

 

First, I have never known nor heard of anyone who claims the Holy Spirit told them it was ok to listen to Ozzy.

Secondly, you again insist on using the most extreme of examples. Why don’t you use Doris Day or Roger Whitaker in your examples? Is it because most would see it as ridiculous?

Thirdly, why would the Holy Spirit tell one IFB’r that Calvinism is wrong but tell another IFB’r that it is truth? Why would He tell one Pre-mill pre-trib is truth but tell another A-mill is truth and tell another neither is truth?

Why would you assume the Holy Spirit would not convict some one of this? I will say if the Holy Spirit isn’t convicting them on this issue, then your “hard preaching” against it sure won’t.

Can you point to anyone who said or believes that one can do whatever they want?

You hear that in a sermon?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rocky_Mountain_High

Ever read Newsweek or Sports Illustrated or Kiplinger’s or the Wall Street Journal or ever watch college football on ABC etc……If so you are making a lot of sinners a little wealthier. Ever eat at Pizza Inn or Arbys or Subway? Ever buy chewing gum or Pepsi or soap? If so you are taking God's money and making sinners a little wealthier.

A little dramatic don’t you think?

 

You’ve got to be kidding right? I used to listen to Jack Hyles and Curtis Hudson and many other Sword of the Lord types. I’ve probably heard more Jack Hyles sermons than most IFB’rs. Are you denying Jack Hyles didn’t stand in the pulpit and tell women how they should dress? Are you telling me he never stood in the pulpit and told people how long their hair should be? Are you telling me he stood in the pulpit and never told anyone what version of the Bible to use? If this is what you are saying then you never heard Jack Hyles. By the way, you can’t delete my messages.

I think you are in over your head. The problem is the application they are making and the twisting of scripture to make that application. See: http://www.godhatesfags.com/ for examples.

 

Are we getting way off topic or what?:wavey:

 

Maybe a little.:laugh:

But I think we are getting to the answer of the original question.

 

Once again, who said such a thing? Did you see me advocate such a foolish notion?

Both. I doubt you will find many in conservative churches who think Doris Day has led us to the brink of Hell. But who knows, Que Sera Sera

Are you equating “hard preaching” with the words of the Prophets? We don’t need Prophets, we have their words and the NT prophets words in a Book. We don’t need “preachers”, we need teachers. The Word isn’t a hammer to beat on the head, it’s a sword that will cut the heart. Just teach people the Bible, and the Holy Spirit will do the rest.

Unfortunately, I’ve heard many preachers stretch the truth or repeat an urban legend to prove a point.

The “John Denver was high” claim sounds much like one. Unless of course you can verify. If you have ever been to the Rocky Mountains I don’t think you would question John Denver’s “state” when writing this song.

Well, if you use windows you’re supporting Bill Gates. I believe Gates is pro-gay, therefore you are supporting the gay agenda. See how foolish that is? It like saying listening to John Denver or Doris Day is promoting a sinful life.

You need chewing gum and Pepsi? Ever see any objectionable Pepsi commercials? Perhaps we would agree on the extreme example, but you can't use the extremes to formualte a standard. Just because some music is bad doesn't make it all "sinful".

I’ll let the IFB’rs answer that, but my guess would be yes, either directly or indirectly. In fact, I know of one preacher who singled out a young man in the service about the length of his hair. The young man left and never returned and is now a middle aged man serving in another Baptist Church where he is not judged about the length of his hair. In fact I don’t even know how long his hair is now.

They don’t need to be “preached” at all, just teach the Bible and the Holy Spirit will work on each individual in His time. But stick with what's in the Bible not personal convictions one might have.

This is what the IFB’rs think, but it is not true. Perhaps it is true among some people and this is why they feel comfortable in an IFB Church. They constantly need to be told how sinful they are and how God is unhappy with them because of their choices. No thanks, not for me, been there. I am well aware of how sinful my heart is without some pulpit pounding, crew cut, screaming preacher telling me. Thank God for the Grace of God and that He chooses to love me anyway. When you get hold of that, then your desire for the ungodly things begin to disappear. I’ve still got a ways to go.

To be perfectly honest, yes. Perhaps not in the vile way of Phelps, but there are similarities in style. And yes, he is an extreme example I used to make a point. I bet he would agree with your views you have expressed on this thread, especially the Elton John ones. I have not seen anyone on this board that really comes close to Fred Phelps though.

 

So lets lump them all together right?

Lets see, if there was no John R Rice there would be no Jack Hyles and if there was no Jack Hyles then there would be no Fred Phelps. Logical I guess.

Sure, but use scripture. Don’t condemn because what you think scripture says. Somehow IFB’rs always get back to the length of hair.

I win! I win! :applause: :applause: :applause:

Yea, I’m glad Christians have never disappointed me.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rocky_Mountain_High

http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/exposes/hyles/errors.htm

http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/exposes/hyles/sin.htm

http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/exposes/hyles/testim.htm

If I remember right he was about to join the Military and let his hair grow out.

Bingo! We have a winner. The answer to the original question. Your statement is exactly why people have problems with the IFB churches. Yet you can’t even see it.

It just keeps getting better. You think they took John the Baptist serious? Did Jesus have a good Jewish crew-cut?

Ah yes, more hypocrisy:


1Co 14:34 Your women in the assemblies let them be silent, for it hath not been permitted to them to speak, but to be subject, as also the law saith;
1Co 14:35 and if they wish to learn anything, at home their own husbands let them question, for it is a shame to women to speak in an assembly.

Of course I’m sure in all IFB churches you never hear a women’s voice. Why don't you have your pastor preach this sunday and see how many amen's you get. And of those who amened, see how many got their wife to cook them sunday dinner.

Come on, you really never have listened to Hyles? This is right out of his playbook.

 

You don’t think Jack Hyles is a fair representative of the IFB movement? He has influenced a lot of IFB preachers whether you wish to acknowledge it or not. And Phelps is the offspring of legalism without Grace, and judgment without compassion.

Good, but your beliefs seem to line up perfectly with theirs.

Not what you said:

However, if someones been a member of a church for a long time, and is either so dense or unwilling to notice that everybody else around him does not look or act like him, then someone needs to say something.

You seemed to suggest that if anyone didn’t look, dress, or act like you then they had spiritual problems. Thus, you are able to judge a man by his haircut.

.

There wasn’t. But if length of hair is an indicator of ones spiritual life, then you should applaud what the pastor did.

And if those of the 50’s could see the IBF preachers of today, what do you think they would say about their hair?

Hmmm, where in the passage does it say anything about usurping the authority or leadership of man? Where does the passage say anything about meddling? NOWHERE.


1Co 14:34 Your women in the assemblies let them be silent, for it hath not been permitted to them to speak, but to be subject, as also the law saith;
1Co 14:35 and if they wish to learn anything, at home their own husbands let them question, for it is a shame to women to speak in an assembly.

Why don’t you interpret this verse the same way you did I Cor. 11:14? It is quite clear, women are not to speak.

Perhaps this is how your pastor would preach this verse:

Silence women! Shame on any women who speaks in an assembly! Real women of God keep their mouth shut! If you have a question you be silent till you get home! Don’t you take 1 Cor 14:35 seriously!

How’s that for a good IFB sermon? Can I do a Revival with that?Do women talk in your Sunday school class or church?

As I stated earlier, Hyles is the face of IFB to many of us. FYI, all of my mothers side of the family were raised in IFB Churches. All have left for these very reasons. My wife was raised in IFB Churches, I have rescued her from this “stuff”. My in-laws are still IFB members. My brother in law was raised IFB and married my wife's sister who also left the IFB circles. His dad was an IFB preacher and will die IFB. Yes, I’ve met plenty of IFb’rs. Great people but horribly brainwashed with this legalism.

We agree. :thumbs: But at least I thoroughly answered your opening question.

Somehow this doesn’t surprise me. I think I have just been lumped together with Ozzy Osborne and Elton John.

Find help here: http://www.emmanuelenid.org/sermons/Romans/

This might be a good one to start with: http://www.emmanuelenid.org/sermons/Romans/Romans11.htm

Or perhaps this one: http://www.emmanuelenid.org/sermons/Kiss/Kiss30.htm

They did wonders for me.

 

Perhaps this is how your pastor would preach this verse:

Silence women! Shame on any women who speaks in an assembly! Real women of God keep their mouth shut! If you have a question you be silent till you get home! Don’t you take 1 Cor 14:35 seriously!

How’s that for a good IFB sermon? Can I do a Revival with that?Do women talk in your Sunday school class or church?

[/quote]

Actually, i was raised in a IFB church where the women were not allowed to speak. Only men could conduct business, Only men were to hold offices, Only men could speak in SS, Only men could get behind the pulpit for anything....

It was a Hyles like church....I am so glad God moved me from that craziness

 

But if I believed the Church had taken the wrong course, I would want to return to the past. Why don't you, since you seem to feel the Church has taken the wrong path?

If it was wrong that men and women sit together in the early Church, why is it not wrong today?

I'm curious, do you believe it is wrong for a women to ask a question in a Bible study class?

 

Grasshopper, you would do best to stop stereotyping people. I go to a IFB church. Jack Hyles never comes up in our church yet you seem obessed with him. As for legalism that would be when we say something is a sin that the Bible doesn't call a sin. For example some churches say a woman wearing something other then a dresses is a sin. Well, they are wrong. What is ok to call a sin is woman not dressing modest. I have been to churches that this happens every Sunday. Women with to low of neck lines in the tops and pants so low they show of their thongs. Yet the leadership of the church never said a peep. Also let me list some other myths about IFB churches.

1. They all are KJVO.
2. They all think drums are evil.
3. They all refuse to witness to sinners in a loving manner.