Are there NT Churches apart from Baptist Churches then?

[JesusFan]

Would you consider churches such as Methodist, Evangelical free, Presbyterian etc as also real NT Churches then?

 

[Salty]

Sounds like a loaded question!

 

[JonC]

Would you consider churches such as Methodist, Evangelical free, Presbyterian etc as also real NT Churches then?

Probably just as much as Baptist churches. Much of what separates these denominations involve interpretation, philosophy and tradition. None of them probably look exactly like which ever church in the NT you choose (there were differences between churches mentioned in the Bible).

But it depends....

What do you mean by "NT church:?

 

[JesusFan]

Probably just as much as Baptist churches. Much of what separates these denominations involve interpretation, philosophy and tradition. None of them probably look exactly like which ever church in the NT you choose (there were differences between churches mentioned in the Bible).

But it depends....

What do you mean by "NT church:?

As many Baptists, but not myself, define that term means pretty only Baptists are really churches modeled after those in Acts

 

[JonC]

As many Baptists, but not myself, define that term means pretty only Baptists are really churches modeled after those in Acts

Then I'd have to say those churches are just as much as NT church as are Baptists (Baotists do not exactly modle their churches like the ones in Acts...but I think we try to in regard to things we find important).

 

[JesusFan]

Then I'd have to say those churches are just as much as NT church as are Baptists (Baotists do not exactly modle their churches like the ones in Acts...but I think we try to in regard to things we find important).

Agree with you on that, jut have found some fellow Baptists would say if churches were not believers baptism being practiced, not a true church

 

[JonC]

Agree with you on that, jut have found some fellow Baptists would say if churches were not believers baptism being practiced, not a true church

Every group has its "if you aint" claim (and its always something they identify with strongly).

 

[David Lamb]

Would you consider churches such as Methodist, Evangelical free, Presbyterian etc as also real NT Churches then?

It would depend what that individual church believed. For example, I once attended a Christmas Day service at a Methodist church. The "sermon" consisted of inviting the children present to come to the front and show off the Christmas presents they had received. Jesus was not even mentioned, although I seem t remember that Father Christmas/Santa Claus was! On the other hand, some Evangelical Fee churches (at least here in the UK) seem to differ from Baptist Churches only in name.

 

[Salty]

I grew up in a GARBC (very strong Evangelical, Fundamental) well, when I got to Germany - I went to the Air Force chapel. I was very surprised, that he - as a Methodist - preached the Gospel - like any Baptist preacher!

 

[Dr. Bob]

There are churches that hold the same basic polity and doctrine that opt NOT to call themselves "Baptist". Trying to think of a "denomination" per se, that would follow the NT as closely as a typical Baptist church. And a lot who CALL themselves "Baptist" don't qualify!!

Many Bible Churches, IFCA (Independent Fundamental Churches of America), some Berean churches, some Evangelical Free churches would fit the mold. But no mainline denomination is anywhere close in doctrine or polity. Sadly.

What would I be if I wasn't a Baptist?

Ashamed.

 

[JonC]

There are churches that hold the same basic polity and doctrine that opt NOT to call themselves "Baptist". Trying to think of a "denomination" per se, that would follow the NT as closely as a typical Baptist church. And a lot who CALL themselves "Baptist" don't qualify!!

Many Bible Churches, IFCA (Independent Fundamental Churches of America), some Berean churches, some Evangelical Free churches would fit the mold. But no mainline denomination is anywhere close in doctrine or polity. Sadly.

What would I be if I wasn't a Baptist?

Ashamed.

I think we have to view congregations individually (kinda like Jesus does in Revelation) rather than as a formal group.

I have attended many SBC churches that would strive to hold to the same policy and doctrine, and many that fo not. Where I currently live I can think of one IBF church that would qualify (except perhaps not working in a shared ministry as is described with the support Paul sought) and several that would not.

So I think we jsve to look at each congregation....which, obviously, is impossible.

 

[37818]

I think we have to view congregations individually (kinda like Jesus does in Revelation) rather than as a formal group.

No. Jesus first addressed the messanger of each congregation individually.

 

[JesusFan]

It would depend what that individual church believed. For example, I once attended a Christmas Day service at a Methodist church. The "sermon" consisted of inviting the children present to come to the front and show off the Christmas presents they had received. Jesus was not even mentioned, although I seem t remember that Father Christmas/Santa Claus was! On the other hand, some Evangelical Fee churches (at least here in the UK) seem to differ from Baptist Churches only in name.

EFC would be very close to free will Baptists in doctrines and practices

 

[JonC]

No. Jesus first addressed the messanger of each congregation individually.

What I mean is he addressed the congregations as individual congregations (not who was being spoken to).

Jesus was not telling the messenger that the messenger was lukewarm, for example.

 

[37818]

Jesus was not telling the messenger that the messenger was lukewarm, for example.

On the contrary Jesus was saying the messenger was who was lukewarm.
Revelation 3:15-16, . . . I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.So then because thou art lukewarm, . . .
. . . thy . . . thou . . . thou . . . thou . . . . Second person singular.

 

[37818]

Jesus writes to the seven messengers.

Revelation Revelation 2:1-2, Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write; These things saith he that holdeth the seven stars in his right hand, who walketh in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks; I know thy works, . . .

Revelation 2:8-9, And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive; I know thy works, . . .

Revelation 2:12-13, And to the angel of the church in Pergamos write; These things saith he which hath the sharp sword with two edges; I know thy works, . . .

Revelation 2:18-19, And unto the angel of the church in Thyatira write; These things saith the Son of God, who hath his eyes like unto a flame of fire, and his feet are like fine brass; I know thy works, . . .

Revelation 3:1, And unto the angel of the church in Sardis write; These things saith he that hath the seven Spirits of God, and the seven stars; I know thy works, . . .

Revelation 3:7-8, And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write; These things saith he that is holy, he that is true, he that hath the key of David, he that openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth; I know thy works: . . .

Revelation 3:14-15, And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God; I know thy works, . . .

 

[JonC]

On the contrary Jesus was saying the messenger was who was lukewarm.
Revelation 3:15-16, . . . I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.So then because thou art lukewarm, . . .
. . . thy . . . thou . . . thou . . . thou . . . . Second person singular.

Ah....I misunderstood your meaning. Sorry but thanks for clarifying.

I absolutely disagree. The messenger was to being that message to the church. That is why one gives information to a messenger.

For example, if I write to a messenger of my Congressman of veteran concerns then I am actually writing to my Congressman rather than that messenger. The messenger....here a secretary or intern....is the one from who the Congressman will recieve the message.

 

[JonC]

Jesus writes to the seven messengers.

Revelation Revelation 2:1-2, Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write; These things saith he that holdeth the seven stars in his right hand, who walketh in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks; I know thy works, . . .

Revelation 2:8-9, And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive; I know thy works, . . .

Revelation 2:12-13, And to the angel of the church in Pergamos write; These things saith he which hath the sharp sword with two edges; I know thy works, . . .

Revelation 2:18-19, And unto the angel of the church in Thyatira write; These things saith the Son of God, who hath his eyes like unto a flame of fire, and his feet are like fine brass; I know thy works, . . .

Revelation 3:1, And unto the angel of the church in Sardis write; These things saith he that hath the seven Spirits of God, and the seven stars; I know thy works, . . .

Revelation 3:7-8, And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write; These things saith he that is holy, he that is true, he that hath the key of David, he that openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth; I know thy works: . . .

Revelation 3:14-15, And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God; I know thy works, . . .

Why have messengers?