Arizona Gov. Jan Brewer signs immigration law 124 years after great-grandmother's jou

[Bone]

I'm not sure of what to mark up there since half of my ancestors didn't come to America, they were here first. The other half came here in the late 1800s or early 1900slegally!

 

[just-want-peace]

He started off as the voice of reason, values, core conservative values that germans held dear. He used the people mistrust of the financial systems, jews, Roma illegals, etc... to pass laws that gave him more power and before long Nazis rulled germany with an iron hand and all rights were eventually taken away because of reactionism.

There are laws on the books that COULD solve this problem IF the feds would do their job, but-----!!

Also the description of what you list as Hitler's tactics seem to fit perzactly what the feds have been doing for years; and recently highly accelerated! [Liberal D's, R's, and I's]

A few examples:
(done)
Health Care
General Motors/Chrysler
Freddie/Fannie

(attempting)
Banks
Wall street
Legitimate opposition forces (Tea Party, Fox News, Any con. talk show host, etc etc)

Oh, also it's hard to "take away rights" (-"all rights were eventually taken away-") that never existed!

Of course you have to think in terms of "ILLEGAL" for this to make any sense.:thumbsup:

 

[Revmitchell]

The law just passed in Arizona is no different than the Federal law already in existence.

 

[Thinkingstuff]

There are laws on the books that COULD solve this problem IF the feds would do their job, but-----!!

Also the description of what you list as Hitler's tactics seem to fit perzactly what the feds have been doing for years; and recently highly accelerated! [Liberal D's, R's, and I's]

A few examples:
(done)
Health Care
General Motors/Chrysler
Freddie/Fannie

(attempting)
Banks
Wall street
Legitimate opposition forces (Tea Party, Fox News, Any con. talk show host, etc etc)

Oh, also it's hard to "take away rights" (-"all rights were eventually taken away-") that never existed!

Of course you have to think in terms of "ILLEGAL" for this to make any sense.:thumbsup:

exactly I think its a part of the bigger plan and conservatives won't win in the end if they keep just reacting. We should be consistent with our values expressed in the constitution and the declaration of independence and not say "well, one group has to suffer if we want move on in safety." Never, ever compromise our rights guaranteed by the Constitution! I agree we should enforce laws already passed and enforce border protection. Stop migrant workers welfare benefits. Pass prison sentences on exectutive of companies knowingly highering illegals beef up the drug war and even help mexico on this front.

 

[Crabtownboy]

exactly I think its a part of the bigger plan and conservatives won't win in the end if they keep just reacting. We should be consistent with our values expressed in the constitution and the declaration of independence and not say "well, one group has to suffer if we want move on in safety." Never, ever compromise our rights guaranteed by the Constitution! I agree we should enforce laws already passed and enforce border protection. Stop migrant workers welfare benefits. Pass prison sentences on exectutive of companies knowingly highering illegals beef up the drug war and even help mexico on this front.

One of the best ways to solve this problem is to really come down hard on companies that employ illegal aliens. Arizona is going after the wrong group and probably has lost 99.9999999% of the Hispanic vote.

 

[Revmitchell]

One of the best ways to solve this problem is to really come down hard on companies that employ illegal aliens.

That much is certain

 

[Bob Alkire]

No the argument is this. I am a US CITIZEN! I've Served this country for over 20 years! And my rights are being violated in that with "no cause" other than I look hispanic.

Yes it could be a problem, but if you are like me I have my SS card, drivers license, TWIX card and voter reg. on me at all times in my wallet. I guess if you have been checked as many times as I have, it isn't a big thing, just the line of work I'm in.

If they were checking tall grey haired men with a southern accent, I would expect to be checked.

Police are not even allowed to look in your car with out a warrent unless you give them permission or they have probable cause. Probable cause has never been they look like a certain race. I may have to be subject to interrogation and public humiliation based on my heritage.

I'm checked every time I go in to a port, military base, many places of business by government folks and by police at scales and any other time they wish to pull me over to be checked. I don't get humiliated very easily. I love to see government folks work, so if they are checking me, I see my tax dollars at work. Parts of the above is an every day deal for me, so what is the big deal?

 

[Bob Alkire]

One of the best ways to solve this problem is to really come down hard on companies that employ illegal aliens.

That is for sure. I think it should be a fine of one million dollars for the first time and twenty years in prison.

Also when they catch an illegal aliens and he hasn't broken any law except not caring for our laws and came in illegal send them back and if they are caught again give them prison time and then send them back.

 

[Bone]

This new Arizona law does not promote racial profiling as some people claim. The bill is very specifically against racial profiling. Before this law, the police were not allowed to verify a persons legal immigration status; they could only pose the question to ICE and let them investigate the matter. Now, police have the authority to verify a persons legal status in the course of questioning or apprehending a person in the course of their investigation, i.e. during a traffic stop. Again, police are not given permission, under this new legislation, to walk up to someone who "looks illegal" and ask for proof of citizenship.

 

[targus]

Many people showed up at Ellis Island with no papers and today would be declared illegal. If they had a skill that was deemed good they were given papers with a big WOP stamped on them. WOP meant Without Papers.

They were entering legally under the immigration laws of that time.

So you are comparing apples and oranges. Totally different circumstances, totally different laws. Thus she probably is spitting in the face of lady liberty that the governors ancestor faced.

Yes, laws change.

Do you follow the laws of the country that you happen to find yourself in as your travel? Or do you break laws and then when caught point to other countries laws and claim that those are the laws that your follow?

Do you follow the laws on the books today or do you only follow the laws on the books a hudred years ago?

What is a Christian's obligation concerning obedience to laws?

Certainly the ancestor did not have the threat of being challenged by any policeman who did not like the way she looked to prove she was legal. That is the real spitting into the face of liberty today.

And where is this happening other than in your imagination?

What do you not understand about civil rights?.

There is a civil right to crossing international boarders secretly - under cover of darkness or hidden in the back of a truck?

When you travel abroad do you present your passport or do you sneak in?

Do you have your great-grandparents papers proving they were legal ... realizing that is was very difficult to be illegal back then.

Why is it necessary for you to go to the absurd with such regularity?

 

[just-want-peace]

Why is it necessary for you to go to the absurd with such regularity?

If I may be permitted to answer for Crabby --

"Because I have no logic to refute the facts!"​

 

[Thinkingstuff]

Yes it could be a problem, but if you are like me I have my SS card, drivers license, TWIX card and voter reg. on me at all times in my wallet. I guess if you have been checked as many times as I have, it isn't a big thing, just the line of work I'm in.

If they were checking tall grey haired men with a southern accent, I would expect to be checked.




I'm checked every time I go in to a port, military base, many places of business by government folks and by police at scales and any other time they wish to pull me over to be checked. I don't get humiliated very easily. I love to see government folks work, so if they are checking me, I see my tax dollars at work. Parts of the above is an every day deal for me, so what is the big deal?

There is a difference between going on a closed military base and being a regular civilian. There are places that require that kind of security. But this should not happen to regular civilians just walking down the road or going shopping or what ever they are doing. Else throw out the constitution burn it up because our freedom has been sold. Ben Franklin had the right of it. If you're willing to give up a little bit of freedom for some security you don't deserve nor apt to get either. Might as well say what every one is thinking it's ok to send legal responsible hispanics to the gulag or labor camp if it gets rid of the illegal immigrant problem. I pray to God we have people like Bonhoffer in our churches. It happen in Russia, and Germany, and it looks like it will happen here. I thought we were making progress since the civil rights movement in the 60's. I guess not. Unlike you I may actually be falsely accused of not being a citizen. A cop with a head too big for his shoulders may throw out my legitamate ID I usually carry own me saying its fake just so he can beat me around a bit simply because I look hispanic. And I'm certain people veiwing a cell phone film about it might say something like "spic deserved it" even though someone will show (like my attorneys) that I've been a legitamate citizen all my life and don't even speak spanish. But looking the part is all that matters right? Don't say that type of thing doesn't happen. All you have to do is look at the Maryland cops who beat a college kid into a coma because he was excited about his basketball team. I've dealt with racism in Tennessee because of my last name and coloring. It happens. And though this may not be the intent of the law its certainly the direction its going. And everyone is ok with it because illegal hispanics are a problem. Doesn't matter if there are legal hispanics. But when you are the person type that is targeted what then?

 

[targus]

Has anyone here who is opposing the Arizona bill actually read it?

Do you really know what the law provides?

Perhaps you could follow the link and then cut and paste on this thread the portions that you find objectionable.

http://www.azleg.gov/FormatDocument...1070_04-19-10_astransmittedtogovernor.doc.htm

 

[Bob Alkire]

There is a difference between going on a closed military base and being a regular civilian. There are places that require that kind of security. But this should not happen to regular civilians just walking down the road or going shopping or what ever they are doing.

I have never faced what you have faced. I have been checked by the police for walking down the street in many places to get something to eat or just walking where I was unloading. It was parts of town where very few whites are, they ask to see some ID and what you are doing, might tell you it isn't the best place to be. It has never been a problem with me, as I said I love to see government folks working.

You might want to read the bill, too. There will be training for the officers to go through so it is done correctly. I'm sure we will disagree with this, but I see no problem with it.

I've never understood why I get drug test 5 or 6 times a year and most government workers don't, but that is life. I've never understood why when I got my CDL, I've oked the government to check my truck anytime or place they want, but that is life.

 

[Mexdeaf]

So, when you visit Arizona will you carry your papers to prove you are legal?

When did your ancestor arrive?

Actually IT"S THE LAW! When I go to Mexico I am required to have a VISA and have it on my person at ALL times. So why are the poor ILLEGALS whining? Because they don't have VISAS!

Ship 'em back!

 

[rbell]

One of the best ways to solve this problem is to really come down hard on companies that employ illegal aliens.

How 'bout that. Full agreement.

Arizona is going after the wrong group and probably has lost 99.9999999% of the Hispanic vote.

I'm assuming you mean "AZ Republicans" have lost 99+% of the Hispanic vote.

One, they never had very much of it. Especally the more radical "professional minority" groups. Kooks like La Raza.

Secondly...the Dems are doing their best to get as many illegals the right to vote as they can. Of course...folks here illegally, if given amnesty, are going to reward the party that panders to them.

If the D's can get amnesty through, they will receive thousands upon thousands of votes. Might even keep them in power. Dirty trick? Not for the donkeys!