As Long as Music is About Jesus/ SBC remarks

have to disagree with anyone that says "hymns" are outdated or culturally irrelevant....It is well with my soul, Old Rugged Cross, Amazing Grace, etc etc can never ever be outdated to someone who is saved by that same grace! You may not like a certain style of music but the old hymns should never be forgotten....the M&M's are destroying many many churches and the devil is rejoicing..(M&M's----Music & Money)...I'll revert back to my original post....If the Correct Gospel Message can be clearly heard over the music, then it's all Praising Him, the rest boils down to personal tastes that sometimes us Baptists like to disguise as "Convictions"

 

Hymns are not outdated, it's how they are played that makes them more appealing to those listening. It all depends on the individual and what speaks the most.

karen

 

Not really mate At old Church our Sunday school was mostly made up of children from non-Church families. I introduced hymns to them by going through the hymn line by line, explaining what they meant. The children loved them. I'm looking forward to doing the same with new Sunday school, although the way these younguns are they will be teaching me a thing or two

Pete

 

I never said that ALL hymns were outdated, just many. There are also many good hymns that should still be sung, such as the ones you mention. And it's not the ideas that's the problem, usually it's the use of outdated words and the "funeral" music that too often accompanies them.

 

Alcott,

Thanks for your insights,athough you may have misunderstood me a little. We do stay out of it...but we have had it pushed on us,we happen to love many different kinds of music,but there are some songs we feel are more God-honoring than others and we do not want to lose those out of our lives or our children's...there would be such a loss there. We are in a church where we are very like minded with the music pastor and his choices of music....so instead of causing a stir in our former church that was going into the contempo route,we found a church where we were more like minded with the people...do we ever sing a chorus,yes,is the worship stoic and boring,no...it is believers singing unto the Lord great doctrinal truths,deep songs of great meaning rooted in scripture...now our music pastor is very discerning about his song choices,there are many newer songs he would never lead us in,but some are okay. Our services are worshipful and reverent...not happy clappy light songs about what makes man feel good...our worship seems very focused on God and his Holiness,which I have not witnessed in contemporary churches.

And,yes,we stay out of it and we trust our music pastor. He is over us in authority and he is very wise!

Molly

It seems those who want the contempo band like praise and worship over the hymns(which people say are non relevant) are usually the loudest most vocal group who HAS to have it that way...and does not care what anyone else thinks.

 

I have to disagree with that, from what I have seen. I have not actually heard anyone express such a thought as: "Let's shun all the hymns and sing only contemporary songs and choruses." Such people are around, I am sure; but just not in any of my circles. But I have heard many express the opposite: "Let's shun the contemporary and sing only classical/traditional hymns."

Now, you rightfully devalue insisting it be all your own way, so I have to wonder: if the music was close to half-&-half, of hymns from the book and contemporary praise, would you accept this, or would you, for this reason, look for another church in which the music is all your own way.

 

Since this is a Baptist Board, perhaps the answer is that if it honors the Lord and the people that are there are there because they wish to sing newer songs, then utilize it as a worship tool and go on with your business.

If your church is large enough, have a service with it and a service with traditional, older music. If not, vote on it and if the vote doesn't swing in your favor then find another congregation.

I think the overriding question that gets people to fussing at one another in a rather unsavory and unscriptural manner is whether it's okay to have new music at all. Times change. Music changes. Would you have been typing on a computer message board fifty years ago? How about twenty years ago? Yet we do it now and everybody here at least seems okay with it, even though it is a result of exponential technological change that has occurred in a relatively short period of time. Well, music changes too. New arrangements and ideas cause it to change all the time yet that is a problem? Music, like computers, can be used for good and for things other than good. Shall we say that in order to uphold the glorious tradition of the past we should quit using computers and rely on handwritten messages delivered on horseback or read in the town square aloud? Yet, people get bent when they hear a song that praises the Lord that doesn't sound like it was written before 1960 (or in some cases 1860). I suppose I just don't get it.

Now, let me say that my favorite style of worship music is not the "hand waving sing along" style that a great many fellow believers seem to enjoy. Quite frankly, I would much rather sit and enjoy listening to others sing in church than actually get up off my duff and participate, but that's just me.

Should I be forced to stand and sing if I get more out of worship by listening? Is there a necessary prerequisite that I've missed that says I have to participate chorally? Please, if there is, somebody let me know. Otherwise, can't we just be good baptists and leave this topic out of the realm of discernment if the music praises the Lord? (And don't say all modern music doesn't attempt to do that because it's just not true.)

And if you haven't heard the songs "Testify" and "Unashamed" by Ramsie Shick then you are missing out on a blessing. These songs were recorded in 1997 and mean more to me than a great many famous hymns that I have heard over the years.

 

Probably for the same reasons you don't just enjoy your music but try to portray those who like diversity in musical styles as somehow doing something wrong.

Really? What songs?

(Not that you'll answer but I just thought I'd ask, anyway.) </font>[/QUOTE]First of all Mike, I have never said those who like diversity in their musical styles were doing anything wrong. I said I preferred the traditional hymns.

Secondly, I did not get saved until I was 32 and, yes, I have heard songs that cursed Jesus (notice I did not say hymns)!

The point I was trying to make when I made that statement was, "If it has Jesus in it, it gets me excited." is not factual. There are some very unChristian songs that mention Jesus...

Questions answered satisfactorily???

Sue

 

I have to disagree with that, from what I have seen. I have not actually heard anyone express such a thought as: "Let's shun all the hymns and sing only contemporary songs and choruses." Such people are around, I am sure; but just not in any of my circles. But I have heard many express the opposite: "Let's shun the contemporary and sing only classical/traditional hymns."

Now, you rightfully devalue insisting it be all your own way, so I have to wonder: if the music was close to half-&-half, of hymns from the book and contemporary praise, would you accept this, or would you, for this reason, look for another church in which the music is all your own way. </font>[/QUOTE]Actually the church we are in now has some choruses,but there are chosen based on biblical content,not on popularity or the style of it...we do not have a band,or praise group,we have a music pastor and the choir sings about once a month. The style is reverent and thought provoking....not light. My problem is not with new songs,but the content and style being reverent and set apart with the content being in depth and thought provoking to help us learn biblical truths....these are foundational to music choices and we desire to be in a church that says this is important...not just what is on the christian radio station for the moment.

I will say again,that you can defintely tell a difference in a church that has a high view of God,as opposed to a high view of man and his desires. Man centered worship is not what I want to be a part of...and we have seen a lot of this.

 

And if you haven't heard the songs "Testify" and "Unashamed" by Ramsie Shick then you are missing out on a blessing. These songs were recorded in 1997 and mean more to me than a great many famous hymns that I have heard over the years. [/QB][/QUOTE]


woohoo! Amen Chargrove!

Ramsie is a dear friend of mine and her appearance would blow a bunch of fuses on this bulletin board!

Did you see Tom Dooley's "Summer Songfest"? Ramsie followed a "church lady" who was all dressed in white sequins.

It was a stark object lesson on "religion vs relationship" because Ramsie has no pretense. She was naked before the Lord....and lots of people are uncomforable with their own fig leaves.

But that same performance would be inappropriate at most Baptist churches and herein lies the crux of the discussion.

I am a worship leader. My job is to worship and let the Holy Spirit minister...sounds tough, huh?

When I first began at the congregation where I presently go, EVERYONE wanted to tell me what to do...and EVERYONE had a different idea.

I listened to them all and realized that there was no way I could make everyone happy but I wanted to be sensitive to the personality of this body....yet the Lord has to be pleased over any of them.

Most people enter worship with something comfortable. Yet, if I make them "too comfortable" then rigor mortis begins to set in.

I believe we need to constantly be growing...the Lord deserves a new song from each of us every day! He gives fresh manna if we will let Him.

So, we introduce 2 or 3 new songs everyweek in a songlist of 8 to 10 with at least half of the list being VERY familiar songs. This keeps me learning and it keeps the congregation growing....and expecting something fresh from the Lord.

I also try to do at least one song outside of our particular cultural expression to remind us that the language of worship is international.

I like some of the old hymns but that isn't fresh manna unless it is updated. (Bet that statement wins me a lot of friends here)

I find many of the contemporary songs to be "me" centered and will usually do no more than 1 of those in a set....and even though these kinds of songs are what most of the congregation said they wanted, I find that EVERYONE appreciates the diversity and unpredictability of our worship services now. Those who were unhappy that I was given the position are expressing their gratitude for challenging their perspective. They didn't really know what they wanted until they heard it.

It's a challenge that I take seriously from week to week.