Bacon eaters! Do you see?

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

DHK: What will you do with your free gift of salvation?

HP: This question to me is preposterous if in fact there are no conditions to salvation. If I was required to do something, that would be the fulfilling of a condition, of which you say there are none. Asking the question would appear to me simply more of those "creative semantics."

 

[billwald]

When I inherited a few bucks from my mother I didn't have to "do anything with it" but I could have refused to cash the check - or formally refused the the inheritance by writing the lawyer.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

BW: When I inherited a few bucks from my mother I didn't have to "do anything with it" but I could have refused to cash the check - or formally refused the the inheritance by writing the lawyer.

HP: We do not inherit salvation as one would inherit a few bucks. We are granted the hope of salvation when, and not before, we fulfill the stated conditions of repentance and faith. We are not given salvation to reject. We are offered the hope of receiving salvation IF we will be obedient to the conditions of repentance and faith.

 

[BobRyan]

Originally Posted by BobRyan
Well at least you got that banana part right - but again the fiction you engage in is of the form that says "If you are given a home in a well-off subdivision free of charge - all expenses paid for as long as you live there - it is NOT a gift if you must be a good neighbor, treat the property responsibly and care for it - rather you fully EARNED that home no matter what the costs and expenses paid for you by the donor".
Bob

I went through this in real life recently Bob. I was an asset, an expensive gift. The condition was not "as long as I keep it and maintain it." The condition was not: "as long as I am a good neighbor, etc."
Your example is way off the mark.

You see, the gift was free, unattached without any conditions.
I could destroy it, give it away, maintain it, sell it, do what I want with it.
It was given to me as a free gift. Even if I decided to be a bad neighbor and bother him, that would be my choice--not a good one but still my choice. It is was my gift and I could do what I wanted to no conditions attached. It was a free gift. I did not earn it.

If I decided to keep it, then there may have been some responsibilities attached in keeping it. That is different.

I am not arguing that there is no such thing as being irresponsible when someone gives you something - my argument is that the requirement to BE responsible in the scenario I provided would NOT be translated even in real life as "EARNING" the 2 million dollar home and property. It would still be viewed as a GIFT as long as it was given to you and all future expenses paid.

The idea that a person "mowed the grass this week so I earned this 2million dollar property" would not be a well-reasoned idea that anyone would accept in this life - or in the age to come.

Thus the Eph 2:8-10 text showing that as Christians we have both purpose and responsibility does not turn salvation into something other than a free gift.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[quantumfaith]

HP: Could creative semantics in theology be related to using catch phrases like freewill, choice, believe, accept, repent, exercise faith, etc. when the inconvenient truth is that none of these things in actuality involve our will in the formation of intents, at least according to some due to the denial of any and all required conditions for salvation?

Could an inconvenient truth be when we hear some preachers calling for men to repent and exercise faith, that in reality they do no believe that needs to be accomplished 'in order to be saved,' but rather IF they repent and believe they have in reality been saved all along (for they were predestined as saved) they just have not before came to the knowledge of their true predestined salvation?

HP: I (IMHO) your list of "freewill, choice" etc. I do not consider to be creative semantics, but as I read the scriptures they appear to very clear principles and properties with regard to our relationship with God.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

QF: (IMHO) your list of "freewill, choice" etc. I do not consider to be creative semantics, but as I read the scriptures they appear to very clear principles and properties with regard to our relationship with God.

HP: I agree whole heartily. :thumbsup: I believe God has laid down crystal clear conditions of salvation, without which we shall not see the Lord.

 

[DHK]

This thread needs to be closed as it has far exceeded its limit.