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Baptism - How long?
- Thread starter Salty
- Start date
Originally posted by Roy1:
But that is down to them to decide. If we baptized in rivers, streams, lakes or seas, instead of heated pools, some may want to hold off until it is warmer.
Another thought would be if you or I had to prepare Fill – empty, heat, each pool depending on the individual Church, that may dampen our anger at every three months or so.
New believers in the NT did not hold off baptism even though the public display in the rivers made them a mark for persecution, including death. This is one of my major points. We are spoiled. We worry more about the inconvenience or expense of filling and heating pools of water made for the comfort of men by men. We forget what baptism is about. It is publically identifying ourselves with Christ.
We all say how worried we are that the church is too worldly. We complain about Christians who won't stand up for what the Bible teaches. Then we get a new babe in Christ and postpone and downplay the significance of publically identifying themself with their new Savior and Lord! They are taught young, that since works don't save you, they aren't all that important! Works, including baptism, do not save. However, a Spirit filled believer will be led to do works that bring glory to God. They will also be led to follow in baptism and identify themself as a believer.
In short, I fear that we are so afraid that people will believe falsly that we overcompensate by de-emphasizing the importance of following the Lord in such things as baptism. I do not think we should ever force anyone to be baptized, but if someone is being led by the Spirit to follow Him in baptism, who are we to postpone it?
Jim asked what is the rush? That is not a scriptural response. Philip did not reply to the Eunuch, "what's the rush, it's just an act of obedience." No, since he found no reason why the Eunuch shouldn't be baptized, he went down in the water and did it that very moment. None of these incidents below ever received the comment "What's the rush?" There is no scriptural basis to put it off, if the person who truly believes wants to be baptized.
In Acts 2:41, they were baptized that day.
In Acts 8:12, it says when they believed they were baptized.
In Acts 9:18, Paul received his sight, got up and was baptized.
In Acts 10:47-48, Peter pointed out that the saved Gentiles had no reason to be kept from being baptized. He "ordered" that they be baptized.
In Acts 16:33, The jailor and his family were baptized "immediately".
In Acts 18:8, The Corinthians believed and were baptized.
In Acts, 19:5, the disciples were baptized upon hearing the words of Paul.
I agree!
~Lorelei
I agree!
~Lorelei </font>[/QUOTE]Lorelei, I agree with your entire post, so why did you agree with Roy1 when he says that it is reasonable for the person to take a year to understand baptism? If a person can understand salvation then baptism should not take more than a very few minutes. Anyone refusing or hessitant is NOT showing obedience and is actually showing marked rebellion and I would have serious doubts about their commitment to Christ.
I agree!
~Lorelei </font>[/QUOTE]Lorelei, I agree with your entire post, so why did you agree with Roy1 when he says that it is reasonable for the person to take a year to understand baptism? If a person can understand salvation then baptism should not take more than a very few minutes. Anyone refusing or hessitant is NOT showing obedience and is actually showing marked rebellion and I would have serious doubts about their commitment to Christ. </font>[/QUOTE]You are right, I should not have agreed with the comment as it was stated. I actually did so becaue I too, would question their commitment to Christ if it took them a long time to understand. I wouldn't want them baptized if they weren't sure what "salvation" was.
Putting off baptism for a person that just can't understand baptism doesn't save you, is putting off baptism of a person who doesn't yet understand "savlation". We are only to baptize true believers, if they can't "get it" yet, I think we should make sure they at least understand that. So I was actually thinking in terms of making sure they were saved, more than making sure they "understood baptism."
But then again, if they ARE saved, they should "get it" rather quickly and be baptized in a timely manner. If they AREN'T saved, once they do "get it" they are just now actually "saved" and therefore can be baptized rather quickly from that moment on. So, you are right, agreeing with that statement makes no sense. I was wrong.
~Lorelei
Perhaps if conversion itself was a matter of life and death in our present society, then baptism would be in the same context, and I might consider walking the aisle abd baptizing the same instant.
There is too much "easy believism" and "easy baptisms" to satisfy me. Thank you very much, I shall await until the person has proved themself as one in the Lord. I have seen too many stray cats; they come good whilst the moon is shining, but the rest of the day they want to sleep.
Cheers,
Jim
There is too much "easy believism" and "easy baptisms" to satisfy me. Thank you very much, I shall await until the person has proved themself as one in the Lord. I have seen too many stray cats; they come good whilst the moon is shining, but the rest of the day they want to sleep.
Cheers,
Jim
I know that this is a serious discussion, but when I saw the topic, "Baptism - how long?" it brought to mind a comedy skit I heard many years ago concerning baptism, not so much as to the time (how long) between salvation and baptism, but how long you submerge them.
Anyway, the skit went something like along these lines, "...do you dunk forwards or do you dunk them backwards. Do you dunk them once, twice, three times, or do you just hold them under until they really repent?"
Oh well, I thought it was funny. I now return you to the serious side of this discussion.
God Bless!!!
Adam
Anyway, the skit went something like along these lines, "...do you dunk forwards or do you dunk them backwards. Do you dunk them once, twice, three times, or do you just hold them under until they really repent?"
Oh well, I thought it was funny. I now return you to the serious side of this discussion.
God Bless!!!
Adam
From Artimaeus
“Marked rebellion,” is a strange phrase to use of a new born babe!!
Some measure of compassion, grace and patience is needed. ONCE again, baptism in the N.T was familiar, it was common, and the background work was done.
May I ask how long were you saved before you were baptised? I then take it you were practically perfect instantly? You understood all and were obedient to all.
There is no argument that baptism is a matter of obedience, you may see it, I may see it, but everyone does not grow at the same rate, and backgrounds may vary. It took me a year to understand baptism, simply because the Church I attended at the time did not practise believers baptism (forgive me for that), I had to see it for myself in the scripture, then I went out and was baptised leaving this church behind.
All I ask is a measure of Grace for each individual.
Artimaeus, Look at my post I did not say that it was reasonable to wait so long. But I am willing to wait rather than cut someone off for not understanding baptism. Another question may be how long did the Lord labour and wait until you trusted in Him? But you expect everyone to understand this matter of baptism instantly!!! Come on show some Grace.
“Marked rebellion,” is a strange phrase to use of a new born babe!!
Some measure of compassion, grace and patience is needed. ONCE again, baptism in the N.T was familiar, it was common, and the background work was done.
May I ask how long were you saved before you were baptised? I then take it you were practically perfect instantly? You understood all and were obedient to all.
There is no argument that baptism is a matter of obedience, you may see it, I may see it, but everyone does not grow at the same rate, and backgrounds may vary. It took me a year to understand baptism, simply because the Church I attended at the time did not practise believers baptism (forgive me for that), I had to see it for myself in the scripture, then I went out and was baptised leaving this church behind.
All I ask is a measure of Grace for each individual.
Roy1, Baptism is not a deep theoplogical concept requiring a course of study. I am talking about people who understand the concept of salvation, they understand that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the Living God. They have repented and received Him as their Lord and Saviour. They acknowledge Him as the Lord of their life and then the first thing He asks them to do (get Baptized) they balk at.
By "marked", I mean noticeable, clearcut, and undebateable, not necessarily mean or strong emotion. Someone is saying, in effect, "Jesus is Lord of my life but,l I will not do what He says." Do we do the same thing with church attendance? Do we give them a few months to decide whether reading the Bible and praying is the right thing to do? Of course not, we teach them the truth and tell them NOW is the time to begin doing these things
Patience with a rare unusual case is one thing but, making it the policy is another. Baptism is not exactly a foreign concept is our culture and if the foundation of salvation has already taken place then this first act of obedience is quite simple.
Actually, I don't remember for sure, I think it was somewhere between a few weeks and a few months.
That was over 30 years ago, but, I am pretty sure I wasn't perfect instantly.
You had to discover it for yourself because no one was there to teach you the truth, as soon as you learned the truth, you obeyed. I thought the purpose of this discussion was on what the Pastors, or leaders of the church should do not, on what the "babe" should do. How long (after someone is saved) should baptism take place? Aside from minor logistics (preparing the pool, asking friends and relatives if you like) there is no need for nor wisdom in delay.
Roy, I fully understand. I too grew up in the Church of England and as far as we were concerned, we were already baptized. It does take time to understand the difference between sprinkling and immersion and the right candidate.
Those who grew up in Baptist Churches will never understand those who grew up in other churches, despite the fact they were equally spiritual churches which taught the gospel.
I do not coerce new converts to be immersed straight off either. I would rather wait until their conversion is convincing by their works and fruit. When they are ready, they will come and seek that which is right.
Reminds me of the fighter pilots who mark their planes with the numbers of planes they shot down.
Cheers,
Jim
Those who grew up in Baptist Churches will never understand those who grew up in other churches, despite the fact they were equally spiritual churches which taught the gospel.
I do not coerce new converts to be immersed straight off either. I would rather wait until their conversion is convincing by their works and fruit. When they are ready, they will come and seek that which is right.
Reminds me of the fighter pilots who mark their planes with the numbers of planes they shot down.
Cheers,
Jim
Oh, also...the woman that runs my Bible study on Wed. night said she would mentor me prior to my baptism...I am assuming this would be a process that could span weeks or even months. Not sure, never been mentored in that way before.
She also said she would find out if any other children were ready to come forward and she would plan a group class for the kids...again, sounds lengthy.
Samantha
She also said she would find out if any other children were ready to come forward and she would plan a group class for the kids...again, sounds lengthy.
Samantha