Baptist Crossing Themselves in Prayer

"I DO think, however, that the number of the RCC's saved is considerably lower. "
"
The RCC as a movement certainly goes for quantity instead of 'quality' when it comes to it's adherents.

 

Kiffen, actually Baptists are NOT protestants...but seem to get lumped in with protestants when speaking of anything "not catholic". Baptist were not born out of the reformation....Baptist have been around since the early church. Check out Dave Cummins books on Baptist History. They are full of information. Anyway, this is a topic for a different thread anyway!!

thanks,
Todd

 

You mean they're Orthodox?

Yours in Christ

Matt

 

Todd
"Baptist were not born out of the reformation....Baptist have been around since the early church."
"
The term complete and utter nonsense come to mind.

"Check out Dave Cummins books on Baptist History."
"
The charlatan...

 

Baptists sound a lot like Church of Christ members in claiming this.

 

Mioque.... I think its been shown a million times on this board already that baptist were not born out of the reformation...and were not
considered protestants. I have asked several IFB preachers if they consider themselves protestants born of the reformation and 3 out of 4 have said NO, is that really up for argument?

And when I say early church.. I don't mean necessarily under the term "baptist", but those who strictly held close to some "baptist" theology much earlier than the reformation period.


Whatever. Not much to argue. I'm glad you thought my post was utter nonsense.

Todd


Anyway, regardless of what you think of Dave Cummins... he is more knowledgable "IMHO" than most writers I've seen on the subject, and clearly shows why in his books.

 

On any forms you fill out where you are asked to list a religion, you are given two choices: catholic or protestant.

That is the only time Baptists are protestants.

 

I wouldn't bother to ask 3 our of 4 IFB preachers what time it is! When I want to know something, I ask people who are likely to have the correct answer. Are Baptists Protestants? Ecclesiologists say that they are. But what do they know?

 

Todd
"Mioque.... I think its been shown a million times on this board already that baptist were not born out of the reformation...and were not
considered protestants."
"
It has been claimed a million times, but shown? Never!
Baptists who claim that their denomination can be traced back all the way to early Christianity simply suffer from the Christian equivalent of (I cannot believe what I just deleted!). They desire the sort of ancient roots denoms like the Kopts and the Greek Orthodox have and can't stand the fact they don't have them, so they make them up.
Especially contemptable are those who not only falsely claim origins going back to the dawn of the church age for themselves, but also deny that other churches that actually do have such origins have them.

[deleted words that I do NOT want to see again on this board!]

[ February 25, 2005, 09:20 PM: Message edited by: dianetavegia ]

 

Unbelievable post Mioque... Unbelievable. Can't believe you can get away with that post.

 

He won't. His post has been reported and will be edited shortly.

How sad.

 

I don't see anything wrong with crossing oneself. I don't think it is necessary, but it could be strange to people who aren't used to it. If I liked to cross myself, I'd probably not do it where it made people think I was a papist.

What is that document-- apostolic traditions, or apostolic constitutions, by Hippolytus around 200 AD encourages crossing oneself. He was really into doing everything liturgically the way he had recieved it. If I recall, he wanted people baptized naked with no rings and encouraged household baptism, including those who were too young to make a confession of faith for themselves.

Lifting up hands--Evangelism in the Early Church hints at the theory that pagans lifted up their hands from the elbow up, not lifting up their whole arms (like Muslims do when they pray) and that Christians lifted up their arms and hands above their head. I recall the position was similar to what people do today, with hands pointed a little more inward perhaps, from the art in the book. Some people raise their hands that way. I've seen hands pointed inward and outward. I don't think it is a big deal. The Bible says for men to raise their hands. It doesn't specify how.

 

I Am Blessed 16
"She won't. Her post has been reported"
"
Corrected your spelling

Link
"Evangelism in the Early Church hints at the theory that pagans lifted up their hands from the elbow up"
"
It's called the Orante position. When displayed in art it signifies prayer.

"and that Christians lifted up their arms and hands above their head"
"
Early Christian art suggests otherwise at least some of the time.
http://www.bethlehem-stjohn.org/cata-orante.jpg
http://www.klosterkirche.de/zeiten/osterzeit/img/orante.jpg
http://digilander.libero.it/altromond/images/Orante.gif
http://www.kirche-norf-rosellen.de/pics/gr-orante.jpg

 

I have no idea what you wrote that's so inflamatory, but I suspect that Martin Luther would never be allowed to post anywhere on the board.

BTW, since it came up in earlier posts, I can hardly believe that Baptists don't consider themselves Protestants. Do people still think that Baptists can trace their lineage back to the apostles? Baptists arose out of English Separatism.

Sometimes this stuff is little more than semantics. Technically, no believer today is a Protestant in that we (at least most Baptists) were not personally in the RCC and are not protesting its abuses. Each one who is a follower of the Lord Jesus is one who was spiritually dead and has been given life. Nevertheless, Baptists are a part of the larger group of Protestants.

Maybe it just sounds more spiritual for Baptists to claim they are not Protestants. I cannot help but think that this claim arises from the radical individualism of Baptists and a complete disregard for the communion of saints throughout history (I write as a Baptist pastor with a PhD in church history).

To the point of the thread, I have not seen Baptists crossing themselves in prayer, but doing so would be no more unbiblical that a lot of things Baptists do, such as circle prayers (as mentioned above), altar calls, and asking Jesus into one's heart.

Blessings,
Bill

 

I went to Roman schools for about 1½ years.

I have no worries with the symbolism of the sign of the cross and if a Baptist chooses to do it I would not argue that they are really closet Romans

Problem is when it is done on auto-pilot, but the same could be said for bowing in prayer.

 

Nah, waste of time, I'm already settled being an Anna-Baptist that were are NOT protestant. we didn't "come out of the cattlelicks".

 

That's a fellowship forum---this is a debate forum.

Blessings,
Bill

 

Nah, waste of time, I'm already settled being an Anna-Baptist that were are NOT protestant. we didn't "come out of the cattlelicks". </font>[/QUOTE]I have to disagree with you, Ralph. I know only four or five "Anna"-Baptists.

Blessings,
Bill