Being slain in the Spirit?

[Ray Berrian]

My experience in seeing people fall under the power of the Holy Spirit is that no one was there to break their fall. And when people got up they were never rubbing their back as though they had hurt themselves. Personally, I believe God deals with this in a more than careful way. I saw a woman fall at Calvary Temple in Allentown which you can see from Route 22 and she did not hurt herself.

A beloved pastor that I knew while in Bible College returned to preach at said church. My wife went up to the altar as this man of God prayed for each one placing his hand on their head. My wife never knew about this experience so I stood next to her and behind her when the pastor prayed for her in this way. I could see that she was going to fall and I gently held her so she would not fall.

Brian30755 I read with interest your posting.

 

[Ray Berrian]

Brian30755,

I think Christians use the word 'slain' because when it happens to you it is swift. It is not something that a Christian can stop or control.

Ray

 

[Bible-boy]

Originally posted by Brian30755:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />1. In reading through the entire Bible what would you say were God’s basic reasons for speaking to men in an audible voice or by means of a Divine vision (by men I mean mankind)?

Bible-boy.....since no one has answered you, why don't you go ahead. (I honestly don't know the answer to your question.) </font>[/QUOTE]Thanks Brian30755 I appreciate your honesty here. I also notice that now this new thread has been hi-jacked off topic and degenerated into a discussion of faith healing and Benny Hinn etc.

I started this topic because it came up in the "Speaking in tongues" thread and drove that thread off topic. I was seeking to give the topic of "Being Slain in the Spirit" its own place to be discussed. Yet as Brian30755 correctly points out no one has actually attempted to answer my original question and the discussion thus far has centered on faith healing and Benny Hinn.

These are fine topics to discuss. However, they are not the topic or intent if this thread. Speaking as a Moderator of this forum I am asking you all to return to the stated topic. If you want to discuss/debate faith healing and/or Benny Hinn please start another thread for that purpose. If this thread continues to be hi-jacked off topic I will close it. Please stay on topic.

I am going to honor Brian30755's request and give an answer to my own original question.

As I read through the entire Bible I see three basic or primary reasons why God speaks to mankind.

1. For the progressive revelation of Himself to His creation.

2. For the progressive revelation of His Word (so certain parts of the Bible could be written).

3. To guide and direct His people to do (or not do) what He wants/expects (or does not want or expect) them to do.

Can we agree that these are three basic or primary reasons why God chose to speak to men (either by His audible voice or via Divine visions) in the Bible?

[ December 23, 2005, 12:40 AM: Message edited by: Bible-boy ]

 

[Bible-boy]

Originally posted by Ed Edwards:
It seems to me you may mean that
I cannot have the experience of holding my
shoes on with velcro for the
Scripture doesn't mention it.
Why can I have the experience of holding
my shoes on with shoe strings - the scripture
doesn't mention that either. In fact, the
Amish don't use shoe strings but use latches
for in the 17th Century (1601-1700) that is
the way they did 'Scriptural things'.
Actually, if we stick to the scripture we
will only wear flip-flops (AKA: sandals).

Hello Ed,

No that is not at all what I am saying. Clearly there are things that the Bible simply does not address. DHK has correctly pointed out that such things are not unbiblical, just extra-biblical. However, I am not talking about such germane things and we do not typically attempt to build doctrinal positions on such things either.

 

[Ray Berrian]

If being 'slain in the Spirit' is a theological misnomer, why have several on this board admitted to experiencing a deeper life in the Spirit of God?

 

[Bible-boy]

Originally posted by Ray Berrian:
If being 'slain in the Spirit' is a theological misnomer, why have several on this board admitted to experiencing a deeper life in the Spirit of God?

Hello Ray,

I am trying to engage in a orderly discussion to determine that very thing. However, before we can come to a conclusion or answer your question we have to establish the fact that our experiences do not trump the authority of the Word of God, that we properly understand our experiences based on a right and solid understanding of the Word, and so on. We can't just run off chasing rabbits and ever hope to arrive a the proper understanding and/or conclusions.

Now, can we agree on the three basic or primary reasons I listed above for why God chose to speak to mankind (in His audible voice or by Divine visions)?

 

[Ray Berrian]

Bible-boy,

Yes, I readily agree with your premise on the three points. Where do you want to go next with these points?

As to the Bible being the only test for faith and practice, we too, believe that this is the only foundation to trust because the truths in God's Word come from Him.

Neither can you chase the 'rabbit' by saying that the 'gifts of the Spirit' coming from God the Spirit were only used by the Lord for the first century. This is the result of an original very poor exegetical novice.

This is why the church is divided on this issue.

Berrian, Th.D.

 

[Bible-boy]

Originally posted by Ray Berrian:
Bible-boy,

Yes, I readily agree with your premise on the three points. Where do you want to go next with these points?

As to the Bible being the only test for faith and practice, we too, believe that this is the only foundation to trust because the truths in God's Word come from Him.

Okay, I am glad that we agree on the primary reasons why God chose to speak to mankind by His audible voice or by Divine visions, and that the Bible is the final authority.

Now, can we agree that points 1 and 3 (above) are directly interconnected to point 2? If so, then can we agree that the progressive revelation of His Word is likely the chief or foremost reason for God choosing to speak to mankind in His audible voice or by Divine visions?

Originally posted by Ray Berrian:
Neither can you chase the 'rabbit' by saying that the 'gifts of the Spirit' coming from God the Spirit were only used by the Lord for the first century. This is the result of an original very poor exegetical novice.

This is why the church is divided on this issue.

Berrian, Th.D.

The focus of this thread is "Being Slain in the Spirit" it is not talking about spiritual gifts, faith healing, Benny Hinn, or any of those things. I have a point and a direction I am heading with this discussion. I'll get there by means of us coming to agreement on certain things. So just follow along with my reasoning and address my questions as I ask them please.

[ December 23, 2005, 02:20 AM: Message edited by: Bible-boy ]

 

[DHK]

Originally posted by Bible-boy:
I see three basic or primary reasons why God speaks to mankind.

1. For the progressive revelation of Himself to His creation.

2. For the progressive revelation of His Word (so certain parts of the Bible could be written).

3. To guide and direct His people to do (or not do) what He wants/expects (or does not want or expect) them to do.

Can we agree that these are three basic or primary reasons why God chose to speak to men (either by His audible voice or via Divine visions) in the Bible?

I see no reason why I can't agree with the above three statements.

 

[Bible-boy]

Thanks DHK,

I assume that every evangelical Christian who has read through the entire Bible would be willing to agree that those are the basic or primary reasons why God spoke to mankind by His audible voice or via Divine visions.

Furthermore, I maintain that points 1 and 3 are so interconnected with point 2 that it is reasonable to say that the progressive revelation of His Word is likely the chief or foremost reason for God choosing to speak to mankind in His audible voice or by Divine visions.

Can we all come to agreement on this?

 

[Brian30755]

I can agree with that, Bible-boy.

 

[tamborine lady]

DHK said:

Acts 9:4And he fell to the earth…
Not being able to bear the light, and still less the divine glory and majesty which he perceived was present; and therefore, in great confusion, amazement, and fear, he fell with his face to the ground, and lay there prostrate and so did also those that were with him, (Acts 26:14)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

JOHN GILL
*********************************

Tam says: John Gill was not there. I don't know where he came up with this, it is not scriptural.

Here is what Acts 9-4 really says: 4 And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?


What happened to using the bible as our source? Let's put all our little books away and just use the bible shall we? Here's what the bible really says about Saul(Paul) falling to the ground!

Acts-26-14 And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.

I don't see anything there about "falling forward".

Peace,

Tam

 

[tamborine lady]

I have seen a vision of the Lord, and He spoke to me, but not in an audible voice.

This vision was given to me to warn me about something.

Peace,

Tam

 

[Ray Berrian]

Bible-boy,

Yes, I too agree that 1 and 3 dovetail easily into number 2. Here we go! What is your next step? I am glad we agree on your fomat of three facts.

Ray

 

[Ray Berrian]

tamborine lady,

My vision of Satan or one of his minions was like seeing only this wicked and ugly face, but I could not see other things around me in the room. The same was true of me--there was no audible voice. I believe the Lord wanted me to know back in the 60's that there is really are demonic beings totally opposite of His holy Being. This solid event was one of the beams that built my spiritual life, and was true because it agrees with what the Bible tell us.

 

[DHK]

Originally posted by tamborine lady:


I don't see anything there about "falling forward".

Peace,

Tam

I don't see anything there about falling backward either. Can you provide evidence that he did. Every person in the Bible that worshiped God did so either on their knees or prostrate, falling forward--never backward. It seems that that would be a pagan practice.
DHK

 

[Ray Berrian]

DHK,

I worship and pray to God sometimes driving down the highway. I must remember that when I drive in reverse not to try to worship God. Anyone going backward is of the Devil. Now there is a deep thinker!

Do you ever pray or worship while lying on your back. We better watch out not to do this because you have guided our thinking on the right track.

I must remember, ANY WORSHIP DONE IN A BACKWARD DIRECTION = not of the Lord.

Did Dr. Van Til instruct you in this or some favorite expositor of the Word who you trust without personally thinking for yourself?

 

[DHK]

Originally posted by Ray Berrian:
DHK,

I worship and pray to God sometimes driving down the highway. I must remember that when I drive in reverse not to try to worship God. Anyone going backward is of the Devil. Now there is a deep thinker!

Do you ever pray or worship while lying on your back. We better watch out not to do this because you have guided our thinking on the right track.

I must remember, ANY WORSHIP DONE IN A BACKWARD DIRECTION = not of the Lord.

Did Dr. Van Til instruct you in this or some favorite expositor of the Word who you trust without personally thinking for yourself?

You strain at a gnat. If you are honest with yourself and those on the board you will frankly admit that there is no Biblical evidence for being "slain in the spirit." It is not listed as a gift of the spirit." It is not found anywhere in the Bible.
DHK

 

[Ray Berrian]

Justification by faith is not a 'gift of the Spirit' either. You are saying we should say this experience of falling out because the Spirit of God touches certain people is wrong and not one of the 'gifts of the Spirit.' Do you want us to deny that justification by faith or sanctification are wrong too, just because they are not 'gifts of the Spirit?'

Your argument is very weak plus illogical.

You have been given Act 9 and Revelation chapter one but 'play it off' with you personal erring interpretations.

We rest our case.

 

[Me4Him]

Ro 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

Our "old man" is "slain "BY" the spirit", but how did Jesus describe this "event".

Joh 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

Joh 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

Jesus described this "event" as "NOT" being "SEEN" by the "natural eye".

"That which is flesh, is "NATURAL",
"That which is Spirit, is "SPIRIT".

Just "WHO" is putting on the "SHOW" for people to "SEE"???