Belief

So what you are saying is as a baby in the womb he can be saved and then if the baby inside the womb wants to it can fall away and walk away from the free gift?

I agree with you on the fact that once saved does not mean always saved. But for a fetus?

 

Why not? An child in the womb is in just of much need of the Gospel as a person out of the womb. Besides like I said we know from the Bible that a child in the womb is aware of the goings on of the outside world Lk 1:41.</font>[/QUOTE]Chemitz, I dont mean to insult your theology, but how can you take this to mean that a baby inside the womb has an understanding?

 

ok, lets say this. How can a baby call upon the Name of the Lord if he cannot speak. How can a unborn baby confess with his mouth that Jesus Christ is Lord knowing nothing about him? How can an unborn babe be born again. What does a unborn babe have to repent about?

If this were the case and babies were saved in the womb we would have NO problem convinceing the Jews that Jesus Is God. THey would pop out with the truth instilled in their minds.

 

ok, lets say this. How can a baby call upon the Name of the Lord if he cannot speak. How can a unborn baby confess with his mouth that Jesus Christ is Lord knowing nothing about him? How can an unborn babe be born again. What does a unborn babe have to repent about?

If this were the case and babies were saved in the womb we would have NO problem convinceing the Jews that Jesus Is God. THey would pop out with the truth instilled in their minds.</font>[/QUOTE]and as far as your question I think the bably leaped b/c he was in the presence of the Lord. Its just one of those connections that John and Jesus had I guess.

But I dont mean to say this the wrong way so dont take it that way, but your theory is very week. You have no other scripture to back it up.

 

What does verbal ability have to do with salvation?
An unborn babe is born again in the same way an old man is born again via the Spirit.
What is repentance? It is the simply a complete change in focus. It doesn't require verbalization. By the baby's sinful nature it is already dead to God.

They are taught they can earn God's grace. They are not exposed to the Gospel.

An assumption on your part because to admit that John was cognizant of the situation would put serious holes in the denial of baptism to infants among other things.

I didn't realize there was a numerical requirement for doctrinal formation. Strange concidering the fact that scriptural evidence for the Trinity far outweights that for oneness yet you still defend the oneness theology.</font>[/QUOTE]

It has alot to do with salvation. The bible says to confess with thy mouth...

Call upon the Name of the Lord.....

Ne ways I guess this is going to be another one that I cant convince you and you cant convince me.

BTW when we are born we are not born sinners. We are born with the nature to Sin b/c thats all that we are surrounded by since the moment we were brought into this world. In other words its like saying " We are not born bad, but we are born bad off."

God bless

DHK, did you want to get back to the orginal question?

[ July 18, 2002, 10:14 AM: Message edited by: ONENESS ]

 

So I guess all the mutes and mentally handicaped are up a creek with out a paddle?</font>[/QUOTE]Nope they can still call upon the Name of the Lord with their mouths, they can still confess with their lips, it may not sound the same but they have an understanding b/t right and wrong.

 

So how is that any different with infants?</font>[/QUOTE]B/c an infant has no understanding of who God is. And an infant has no understanding b/t right and wrong. That is something that has to be taught.

 

What does understanding have to do with faith? Faith is a gift of God not something of our own doing. Again I guess that means tough luck for the mentally handicaped. Besides you are assuming that infants cannot understand, particularly since it is quite obvious John knew who Mary was and he wasn't even out of the womb.</font>[/QUOTE]Ok tell me one time you remember about beng inside your mothers womb. Faith does come from God. But faith comes by hearing and hearing from the word of God.

Does a new born baby know right from wrong or an unborn baby?

 

So just because nobody can remember their time as an infant you assume that they cannot understand? That is a pretty big assumption to play around with when salvation is on the line.

As much as society tries to deny it everybody is born with intrinsic knowledge of right and wrong because Adam and Eve ate of the tree of the knowledge of right and wrong. It is because of the sinful nature of mankind that we assume that infants do not understand right and wrong.</font>[/QUOTE]So how many babies do you know that have turned away from God in the womb? How would they do that?

Proverbs tells us to train up a a child in the way he should go and when he is old he will not depart from it.

If a baby has knowledge when he is in the mothers womb why is it that they need to be taught?

And would you mind explaining to me how one is born again?