Biblicism

[Dave G]

I don't think that's Armenianism, because it is salvation that cannot be lost. Armenianism usually has loss of salvation possible.

I had a Baptist preacher tell me that some 20 years ago, when I asked him about loss of salvation... that it was "Arminianism" for that very reason. But to me it's a bit more complicated than that. You see, there are 4 other "points" in 5 point "Arminianism" besides loss of salvation, and it's been my experience that most who call themselves "Baptists" teach all 4 of these:

"Freed to Believe" ( Prevenient Grace )
"Atonement for all" ( Unlimited Atonement , Jesus died for all of humanity )
"Conditional Election" ( God chooses those who freely choose Him )
"Total Depravity" ( which they define as spiritually dead but enabled to believe by God when the Gospel is preached ).

In addition, all 5 point "Arminians" hold to this 5th one:
"Security in Christ" ( defined as secure as long as they are resting / actively abiding in Christ's commands and seeking to obey Him ). <---in other words, salvation can be lost.

Here's a link to what "Arminians" confess to:

The FACTS of Salvation: A Summary of Arminian Theology/the Biblical Doctrines of Grace - Society of Evangelical Arminians

The FACTS of Salvation: A Summary of Arminian Theology/the Biblical Doctrines of Grace By Brian Abasciano (For a pdf file of the present article, see here.) The distinctive tenets of Arminian theology may be presented using the acronym FACTS. The opposing theology of Calvinism is well known for...

evangelicalarminians.org

 

[Dave G]

Arminianism...you must keep up good works or you could lose salvation.

Yes, that is what they teach.
I have "Bible Missionaries" for neighbors, and they would confess this.

Calvinism... if you aren't 'enduring to the end' with good works, you 'weren't saved in the first place'.

I've found that "Calvinists" see this "enduring"as being evidential, not conditional.
If one isn't holding on to Christ ( and showing the work of God's grace within them over their lifetime ) and walks away from the Lord, then they were never His in the first place.

Where His elect are, His work on their minds and in their hearts is present, and they will be preserved by Him ( 1 Peter 1:5 )...
"If Saved, Always Saved".

In other words, the Lord has promised that Christ will lose none of the sheep ( the "wheat" that He will gather into His "warehouse" ) that His Father has given Him...
But that there are also "tares" in the visible body of Christ ( Matthew 13 ) that can and do walk away from a God who never did "call" them, who never did actually save them.

I agree with them on this, as that is what I see the Scriptures declaring.

 

[JonC]

I had a Baptist preacher tell me that some 20 years ago, when I asked him about loss of salvation... that it was "Arminianism" for that very reason. But to me it's a bit more complicated than that. You see, there are 4 other "points" in 5 point "Arminianism" besides loss of salvation, and it's been my experience that most who call themselves "Baptists" teach all 4 of them;

Here's a link to what "Arminians" confess to:

The FACTS of Salvation: A Summary of Arminian Theology/the Biblical Doctrines of Grace - Society of Evangelical Arminians

The FACTS of Salvation: A Summary of Arminian Theology/the Biblical Doctrines of Grace By Brian Abasciano (For a pdf file of the present article, see here.) The distinctive tenets of Arminian theology may be presented using the acronym FACTS. The opposing theology of Calvinism is well known for...

evangelicalarminians.org

Not only that, but the 5th Article does not conclude that salvation can be lost (it is a non-issue within Arminianism as people within that category differed on the topic).

 

[JonC]

Well, not sure what you are saying here, but when you let the Bible (66 books) interpret itself, comparing like with like)..you get the truth of God's Word. It's not that mysterious.

For eg.. there is the phrase 'God heareth not sinners'

Do we take that as it is?

No, because it was said by an unsaved man, talking to Pharisees and Scribes.

Context shows the real story.

I have been wondering, for some time, who so many cannot allow Scripture to interoret Scripture but instead use God's Word as a reference from which verses are extracted to support theories.

The verse-chapter divisions we have do help study, but at the same time they have contributed to sects ripping apart the Bible.

 

[360watt]

Yes, that is what they teach.
I have "Bible Missionaries" for neighbors, and they would confess this.

I've found that "Calvinists" see this "enduring"as being evidential, not conditional.
If one isn't holding on to Christ ( and showing the work of God's grace within them over their lifetime ) and walks away from the Lord, then they were never His in the first place.

Where His elect are, His work on their minds and in their hearts is present, and they will be preserved by Him ( 1 Peter 1:5 )...
"If Saved, Always Saved".

In other words, the Lord has promised that Christ will lose none of the sheep ( the "wheat" that He will gather into His "warehouse" ) that His Father has given Him...
But that there are also "tares" in the visible body of Christ ( Matthew 13 ) that can and do walk away from a God who never did "call" them, who never did actually save them.

I agree with them on this, as that is what I see the Scriptures declaring.

Well,of course there are false converts, but if some one has believed on Jesus, they are saved at that point. If later they deny Jesus, that doesn't mean their belief was false.

A father's son could say to the dad they are no longer their dad, but that doesn't undo their birth into that family.

But yeah.. probably saying the same thing, I agree .. if saved always saved.

It's whether you back load or front load works into salvation to begin with that would make it questionable.