Can a Baptist be Charismatic?

[exscentric]

Hey, rick_uk, I was reading your post and had to look to see who wrote it - sounded so much like me I thought maybe I had posted it and forgotten about it

Have a friend in the midwest that has been faithfully preaching great, Bible centered sermons for years and his church is just a small work that barely supports him. His church is surrounded by the feel good type churches that are thriving.

Always figured if Christ is the head of your church you don't need to worry about numbers cuz it is He that buildeth the church not your methods, mechanics and feely good tactics.

 

[Mark Bishop]

"Can a Baptist be Charismatic?"

short answer is.... Yes.

 

[dianetavegia]

A type of Christianity that emphasizes personal religious experience and divinely inspired powers, as of healing, prophecy, and the gift of tongues.

 

[atestring]

Originally posted by dianetavegia:
A type of Christianity that emphasizes personal religious experience and divinely inspired powers, as of healing, prophecy, and the gift of tongues.

I think that was the type of Christianity that the Apostle Paul was involved in.

 

[pastorjeff]

I don't think Paul ever put the emphasis on any of those things, Only on God being glorified. I don't think Baptist distinctives and true charismatic beliefs line up. The majority of Charismatic leaders in the nation believe in added revelation which many times is taken as authoritative above scripture. My views on the miraculous sign gifts may differ from most fundamentalists, but I know that they are not necissary for the edification of the Body. Most Charismatics demand that they be used, and by all believers. Doesn't line up with sound doctrine. Your church may be different, but I wouldn't call it charismatic if it is.

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

As a matter of fact, Paul actually de-emphasized the gifts (tongues, prophecy) in I think it was 1 Corinthians 13.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[pastorjeff]

Yes That is exactly what 12-14 speak about. I take the exhortation seriously not to forbid speaking in tounges, but I also understand that it is not necissary for the edification of the Body. I saw that was mentioned as a purpose of the gift on another thread, but these 3 chaps. would show otherwise.

 

[Phillip]

As I mjentioned before, the church of Corinth had a LOT of problems with mixing old religions into their church. Paul was very strong with major doctrines.

Personally, I feel that the tongues were being abused, much as in Pentecostal churches today and Paul didn't want to discourage them by slamming the door, so he compromised and put some strict rules in how to use them. (For example: there must be an interpreter. etc.) When these rules are followed it becomes less of a problem.

Partially because they probably did less due to the strict rules.

Pentecostals like to use Corinthians to back up their "tongues" use, but in reality, Paul was spending some time trying to straighten out a church that had gone off the beaten path.

Just my opinion and thoughts on the matter.

 

[Rich_UK]

Originally posted by exscentric:
Hey, rick_uk, I was reading your post and had to look to see who wrote it - sounded so much like me I thought maybe I had posted it and forgotten about it

Have a friend in the midwest that has been faithfully preaching great, Bible centered sermons for years and his church is just a small work that barely supports him. His church is surrounded by the feel good type churches that are thriving.

Always figured if Christ is the head of your church you don't need to worry about numbers cuz it is He that buildeth the church not your methods, mechanics and feely good tactics.

I agree. Don't get me wrong, its great to see a sound church increasing in numbers but I'd rather see 100 Small faithful, meat fed fellowships than 2 or 3 mega churches that are force fed diluted milk.

 

[atestring]

Originally posted by pastorjeff:
I don't think Paul ever put the emphasis on any of those things, Only on God being glorified. I don't think Baptist distinctives and true charismatic beliefs line up. The majority of Charismatic leaders in the nation believe in added revelation which many times is taken as authoritative above scripture. My views on the miraculous sign gifts may differ from most fundamentalists, but I know that they are not necissary for the edification of the Body. Most Charismatics demand that they be used, and by all believers. Doesn't line up with sound doctrine. Your church may be different, but I wouldn't call it charismatic if it is.

Charismatic people and what you have mentioned as "major Charismatic Leaders" would not be open to revelation that would contradict the Written Word of God.

 

[atestring]

Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:
As a matter of fact, Paul actually de-emphasized the gifts (tongues, prophecy) in I think it was 1 Corinthians 13.

Joseph Botwinick

Did Paul deemphasize tongues in Acts 19:1-6?

 

[Soulman]

Tounges in the bible were earthly languages used so men could give the gospel in other languages. It was not the so called heavenly gibberish excercised in charasmatic and pentacostal churches today.

There are so many stripes of Baptists that it is completely possible for them to have a charasmatic flare. Not my type of Baptist, but they are out there. I think they are called Bapticostals.

 

[Dr. Bob]

Logic demands "NO" to the original question can a Baptist be charismatic, although Baptists may be anything they choose!

Maj. Premise: All Baptists believe ONLY the Bible is the revealed Word of God

Min. Premise: Charismatic doctrine believes tongues/word of knowledge/prophecy/revelation are also the revealed Word of God

Conc: All Baptists are excluded from those holding Charismatic doctrine

It doesn't get much simpler. My first year philosophy class can handle this one!

 

[Matt Black]

Except your minor premise contains an assumption which is inaccurate in many cases to the point of being majorly flawed: no charismatic I know (myself included) believes that charismata are in any way the revealed Word of God, anymore than inspiration for a Baptist pastor to preach, which is equally a spiritual gift, is the revealed Word of God.

Yours in Christ

Matt

 

[LadyEagle]

Agreed, Matt Black!

Dr. Bob sez: "Maj. Premise: All Baptists believe ONLY the Bible is the revealed Word of God."

Ah-ha! Which version?

 

[Matt Black]

Is this the first time we've agreed? Break out the bubbly! (Or, alternatively, it means the Second Coming really is nigh -is that the sound of four sets of hooves I hear? )

Yours in Christ

Matt

 

[pastorjeff]

The point is that it is a widely held Charismatic belief that there is added revelation today. They also rely heavily on experience as a test of faith and over the testimony of the Word of God. Copeland, Oral Roberts, Hagin, all hold so called " modern revelation" to be as athoritative, if not overriding, the Word of God.

 

[untangled]

So, in being a "baptistcostal" how far do you go on the loss of salvation issue? Some say each time you sin while others say only when someone rejects Christ. What do most baptistcostals believe? It probably is an open ended question since pentacostals vary on the issue too. Being from some Church of God background I've seen some say that you lose your salvation as soon as you do wrong while others say when you stop going to church regularly, still others say if you reject Christ as Savior.

 

[Matt Black]

Originally posted by pastorjeff:
The point is that it is a widely held Charismatic belief that there is added revelation today. They also rely heavily on experience as a test of faith and over the testimony of the Word of God. Copeland, Oral Roberts, Hagin, all hold so called " modern revelation" to be as athoritative, if not overriding, the Word of God.

I can only speak for the UK scene, but here its not 'widely held' at all; the only sorts who think that are those on TBN (which we get here as the GOD Channel) whom you quoted and they're Word of Faith, not mainstream charismatic, and most charismatics regard them as nutters and people who watch the GOD Channel as weirdos. To say that WoF is representative of the charismatic movement here is like saying that KJVO-ism is representative of the American Baptist movement.

Yours in Christ

Matt

 

[Matt Black]

Originally posted by untangled:
So, in being a "baptistcostal" how far do you go on the loss of salvation issue? Some say each time you sin while others say only when someone rejects Christ. What do most baptistcostals believe? It probably is an open ended question since pentacostals vary on the issue too. Being from some Church of God background I've seen some say that you lose your salvation as soon as you do wrong while others say when you stop going to church regularly, still others say if you reject Christ as Savior.

Again, I can only speak as a Brit, but you'll find the same variation amongst charismatic Baptists (I don't use the term 'Bapticostal' as its not used here and I'd never come across it until seeing it on these boards) on this subject as you will amongst Baptists generally - some will be OSASers, others of a more Arminian soteriological persuasion. I've certainly never come across anyone who says you lose your salvation the moment you sin or stop going to church!

Yours in Christ

Matt