Can a Reformed deny Lordship salvation and endorse the sinners prayer?

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Dispensationalist. So am I, but Reformed in Soteriology.

Wrong again...:tongue3:

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Isn't it a wonderful plan for your life when God redeems His elect?

I would think so:thumbsup:

 

[evangelist6589]

Thanks for answering me here. While I am familiar with Lutzer I have not read much of his works and haven’t gotten that impression of him. It is amazing that some preachers seem to indicate that God’s wonderful plan culminates in material gain in this life time - particularly when so much of the comfort and encouragement in the New Testament was written to an audience that was to be persecuted and many die for the faith. It would have been difficult for them to “count it joy” if they expecting earthly success and wealth. I don't know Lutzer's stance on Calvinism (that's why I used Enns as an example).

No Lutzer does not preach this, but the book I mentioned he may. I do not know and why I will be reading it, for he may lean in that direction. Who is Enns?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

First...may I ask you Evan since you have identifyed yourself as Reformed, allow me pose some quantifing questions.

1. Are you an Absolutist?
2. Your position on Lordship salvation
3. Your position on Fullerism?

Note, I'm not here to be critical...I just wanta understand your mindset and prospective.

Thanks

 

[JonC]

No Lutzer does not preach this, but the book I mentioned he may. I do not know and why I will be reading it, for he may lean in that direction. Who is Enns?

Paul Enns serves as a prof and director of the Tampa Extension, Southeastern Baptist Seminary. He was one of the translators for the updated NASB. He taught at Northwestern College and at Dallas and Talbot Theological Seminaries. He authored The Moody Handbook of Theology - that's were I got his bio.

 

[Yeshua1]

This is the second time that you objected to such a message. What exactly is the “God has a wonderful plan for your life” message that Lutzer preaches? I had always thought that God did have a wonderful plan for our lives, and certainly that notion can be found throughout Scripture. But I think that you are speaking of something else. If you don’t mind, will you please give me an example of this in Lutzer’s work so that I can better understand your objection?



For the record, yes they can reject Lordship salvation and remain Reformed. Enns, for example, notes that the issue is “whether or not one can become a Christian simply by believing the gospel, or whether or not one must surrender to Christ as the Lord of one’s life. Part of the answer lies in a misunderstanding of Romans 10:9. Confession of Christ as Lord identifies Christ as deity; the issue is not concerning His lordship. In addition, if surrendering one’s life to Christ as Lord is necessary for salvation, then there could be no carnal Christians, yet Paul makes it clear that the Corinthians whom he speaks of being ‘in Christ’ wee indeed carnal (1 Cor. 3:1). Lordship is based on application of the knowledge of Scripture, and the knowledge of Scripture comes with spiritual maturity, which in turn follows salvation. Lordship is important, but it cannot be a condition for salvation; that is adding to the gospel.” (Enns, The Moody Handbook of Theology, 343).

Think that MOST of the reformed would abide by Lordship salvation though, as that view dovetails into the perservation of the saints, as the life style would confirm and show off the legit salvation to them!

 

[JonC]

Think that MOST of the reformed would abide by Lordship salvation though, as that view dovetails into the perservation of the saints, as the life style would confirm and show off the legit salvation to them!

I agree…depending on how one defines Lordship. This is not unique to the Reformed. The hard part comes in with Lordship Salvation. I have seen it presented as submitting all areas of your life to Christ as Lord in order to be saved - which is debatable (there are carnal Christians in the NT). Is Lordship a submission, i.e., belief, which results in a greater Lordship - or do we conform to Christ and are then saved. It depends on how you define Lordship.

 

[Yeshua1]

Paul Enns serves as a prof and director of the Tampa Extension, Southeastern Baptist Seminary. He was one of the translators for the updated NASB. He taught at Northwestern College and at Dallas and Talbot Theological Seminaries. He authored The Moody Handbook of Theology - that's were I got his bio.

used his handbook a lot in school, as gives good concise positions of various christian theologies!

 

[Yeshua1]

I agree…depending on how one defines Lordship. This is not unique to the Reformed. The hard part comes in with Lordship Salvation. I have seen it presented as submitting all areas of your life to Christ as Lord in order to be saved - which is debatable (there are carnal Christians in the NT). Is Lordship a submission, i.e., belief, which results in a greater Lordship - or do we conform to Christ and are then saved. It depends on how you define Lordship.

well, cannot be confirming to omage of jesus in order to ern/merit salvation, that smacks of Church of rome infusion of grace stuff!
Would see it as having desire and bent from the Holy spirit to have Him mature us into more of being like Jesus by His work in and thru as we submit and yield to Him, not us working it up ourselves!

 

[evangelist6589]

Wrong again...:tongue3:

Primitive Baptist.