Catholicism is not compatible with Christianity

[utilyan]

DHK again your accusing us of claiming to take credit for salvation.
I'm saying wait for us to make that claim first THEN accuse us.

When Jesus WROTE EUCHARIST, Communion. He gave the command "DO THIS" he didn't say "WRITE A BOOK".
He gave an exact particular method to be passed down.

1 Corinthians 11
23For I received from the Lord that which I also delivered to you, that the Lord Jesus in the night in which He was betrayed took bread;


Paul doesn't crack open a bible. What did he receive which he is delivering at that instant?
He then begins to do communion itself! It is self authorized because it was WRITTEN by Jesus Christ.
Jesus chose for communication the most humble method one that even a blind man and all those illiterate of his time could understand.

You've tossed it aside as trash. Because it wasn't to the MAN MADE traditional standard of INK AND PAPER. No where does the bible say INK and PAPER is superior to all communication.

You could accept that God for a moment made the authors of the bible infallible as they wrote. But you can't even accept THE METHOD Jesus Christ our LORD chose himself!

2 Corinthians 3
2You are our letter, written in our hearts, known and read by all men; 3being manifested that you are a letter of Christ, cared for by us, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts.
You would say these MEN who have written in them SPIRIT OF THE LIVING GOD do not exist. Yet scripture itself tells us, WRITTEN NOT WITH INK.

If my neighbor calls me that my house caught on fire, I would rush home. He didn't have to let me know through a newspaper or stamp a letter. Truth is TRUTH regardless of method communicated.

Jesus Christ chose a specific method to send his message. He said "DO THIS". We received his message HIS WAY and we send it HIS WAY.

We are not a church that started last weekend trying to live up to the qualifications of some phantom true church awaiting the one to pull the sword from the stone.

We are the church STARTED by Jesus Christ, He is the HEAD of the church and ONE FLESH with the church(Ephesians 5)
Jesus Christ is CATHOLIC. He's the very first Catholic. No other church has the spirit to make that claim. You ain't ever going to hear from another church "he's one of us", Like your hearing it from me now.

He chose us to deliver to you the same ways Paul delivers to his people.

Kool-Aid and Crackers doesn't cut it brother.

When they got together for communion they were not there to eat FOOD

1 Corinthians 11
20Therefore when you meet together, it is not to eat the Lord’s Supper,
Welcome to church, This is not eating the Lord's Supper.

1 Corinthians 11
27Therefore whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner, shall be guilty of the body and the blood of the Lord. 28But a man must examine himself, and in so doing he is to eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29For he who eats and drinks, eats and drinks judgment to himself if he does not judge the body rightly.

Oh you guys are eating Crackers and Kool-Aid.... I am in the wrong place, because I didn't come here to eat the Lord's Supper.

I am here for the body and blood of the Lord.

 

[Walter]

Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:
--You make graven images of Mary and other "saints." They are likenesses of her and of others, and of Christ Himself. That is idolatry.

Hmmmmm, I wonder how many Baptist churches & Baptist church members sported Nativity Scenes in & around their churches/homes this Decemember? Any guess?

 

[DHK]

Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:
--You make graven images of Mary and other "saints." They are likenesses of her and of others, and of Christ Himself. That is idolatry.

Hmmmmm, I wonder how many Baptist churches & Baptist church members sported Nativity Scenes in & around their churches/homes this Decemember? Any guess?

I don't know. I know I wouldn't.
I also know that none of those Baptists would bow down toward them or pray before them.

 

[Revmitchell]

Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:
--You make graven images of Mary and other "saints." They are likenesses of her and of others, and of Christ Himself. That is idolatry.

Hmmmmm, I wonder how many Baptist churches & Baptist church members sported Nativity Scenes in & around their churches/homes this Decemember? Any guess?

When you see or hear any Baptists praying to Mary or other Saints let me know. Cuz then you will have a legitimate comparison.

 

[Walter]

When you see or hear any Baptists praying to Mary or other Saints let me know. Cuz then you will have a legitimate comparison.

Oh, I know of one for sure, Rev . . . In fact, he is on this very board and still posts in the 'Baptist Only' forums because, in fact, he has not become a Catholic because at his age he feels he needs to stay in his particular Baptist church. Of course, you will probably claim he must surely be senile then, right? Many have debated him in this forum and been frustrated that he won't recant his Cat'lick beliefs.

 

[DHK]

DHK again your accusing us of claiming to take credit for salvation.
I'm saying wait for us to make that claim first THEN accuse us.

You don't have to make any claims. I have access to your baptism. I'll post its heresy for you:

I. What is This Sacrament Called?

1214 This sacrament is called Baptism, after the central rite by which it is carried out: to baptize (Greek baptizein) means to "plunge" or "immerse"; the "plunge" into the water symbolizes the catechumen's burial into Christ's death, from which he rises up by resurrection with him, as "a new creature."6

1215 This sacrament is also called "the washing of regeneration and renewal by the Holy Spirit," for it signifies and actually brings about the birth of water and the Spirit without which no one "can enter the kingdom of God."7

1216 "This bath is called enlightenment, because those who receive this [catechetical] instruction are enlightened in their understanding

. . . ."8 Having received in Baptism the Word, "the true light that enlightens every man," the person baptized has been "enlightened," he becomes a "son of light," indeed, he becomes "light" himself:9

When Jesus WROTE EUCHARIST, Communion. He gave the command "DO THIS" he didn't say "WRITE A BOOK".
He gave an exact particular method to be passed down.

1 Corinthians 11
23For I received from the Lord that which I also delivered to you, that the Lord Jesus in the night in which He was betrayed took bread;

So he did. And it was nothing superstitious. It was an ordinance. He said "Do this in remembrance of me."

Paul doesn't crack open a bible. What did he receive which he is delivering at that instant?
He then begins to do communion itself! It is self authorized because it was WRITTEN by Jesus Christ.

It comes directly from the book of First Corinthians which Paul wrote under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. Paul's directions are there.

Jesus chose for communication the most humble method one that even a blind man and all those illiterate of his time could understand.

And Paul recorded it. The RCC should follow it.

You've tossed it aside as trash. Because it wasn't to the MAN MADE traditional standard of INK AND PAPER. No where does the bible say INK and PAPER is superior to all communication.

You need to either explain yourself or give evidence of what you are saying. You do sound confused. However, the Bible is written in ink and paper if that is what you are referring to. The Bible uses the word "scriptures" many times. In fact Jesus himself used the word many times and read from it when he went into the synagogues. Did Christ do wrong?

You could accept that God for a moment made the authors of the bible infallible as they wrote. But you can't even accept THE METHOD Jesus Christ our LORD chose himself!

The Method:
2 Peter 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
--Holy men of God spoke and wrote what they spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit. They wrote down what God told them to write.

2 Corinthians 3
2You are our letter, written in our hearts, known and read by all men; 3being manifested that you are a letter of Christ, cared for by us, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts.
You would say these MEN who have written in them SPIRIT OF THE LIVING GOD do not exist. Yet scripture itself tells us, WRITTEN NOT WITH INK.

That has nothing to do with scripture. Paul is saying to those in Corinth that he led to the Lord, for he started that church, that inasmuch that they were Christians they were also a reflection of him, for he had taught and discipled them. They reflected both Paul's teaching and the teaching of Christ (both were the same).

If my neighbor calls me that my house caught on fire, I would rush home. He didn't have to let me know through a newspaper or stamp a letter. Truth is TRUTH regardless of method communicated.

Is the truth communicated to you through the Watchtower magazines? The J.W.'s say it is.
We have the truth in the 66 books of the Bible unadulterated and unchanged for the past 2000 years. Therefore it is our guide. It is the scriptures which are inspired and preserved, not anything by word of mouth. Man makes mistakes; God does not.

Jesus Christ chose a specific method to send his message

. He said "DO THIS". We received his message HIS WAY and we send it HIS WAY.

We are not a church that started last weekend trying to live up to the qualifications of some phantom true church awaiting the one to pull the sword from the stone.

We are the church STARTED by Jesus Christ, He is the HEAD of the church and ONE FLESH with the church(Ephesians 5)
Jesus Christ is CATHOLIC. He's the very first Catholic. No other church has the spirit to make that claim. You ain't ever going to hear from another church "he's one of us", Like your hearing it from me now.

Jesus is "The Word." The written Word reveals who Christ is. The written Word repudiates all Catholic doctrine. The RCC started with a pagan ruler called Constantine in the beginning of the fourth century. It had pagan beginnings and is still mixed with paganism.

He chose us to deliver to you the same ways Paul delivers to his people.

The RCC has no message to deliver to anyone. It is ignorant of the message of salvation.

Kool-Aid and Crackers doesn't cut it brother.

When they got together for communion they were not there to eat FOOD

1 Corinthians 11
20Therefore when you meet together, it is not to eat the Lord’s Supper,
Welcome to church, This is not eating the Lord's Supper.

1 Corinthians 11
27Therefore whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner, shall be guilty of the body and the blood of the Lord. 28But a man must examine himself, and in so doing he is to eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29For he who eats and drinks, eats and drinks judgment to himself if he does not judge the body rightly.

Oh you guys are eating Crackers and Kool-Aid.... I am in the wrong place, because I didn't come here to eat the Lord's Supper.

I am here for the body and blood of the Lord.

You need to know the Lord before you partake of anything. You are a badly confused person.
If you were to stand before God right now, and he were to ask you: "Why should I let you into my heaven?" What would you answer?

 

[utilyan]

You don't have to make any claims. I have access to your baptism. I'll post its heresy for you:

So he did. And it was nothing superstitious. It was an ordinance. He said "Do this in remembrance of me."

It comes directly from the book of First Corinthians which Paul wrote under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. Paul's directions are there.

And Paul recorded it. The RCC should follow it.


You need to either explain yourself or give evidence of what you are saying. You do sound confused. However, the Bible is written in ink and paper if that is what you are referring to. The Bible uses the word "scriptures" many times. In fact Jesus himself used the word many times and read from it when he went into the synagogues. Did Christ do wrong?


The Method:
2 Peter 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
--Holy men of God spoke and wrote what they spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit. They wrote down what God told them to write.


That has nothing to do with scripture. Paul is saying to those in Corinth that he led to the Lord, for he started that church, that inasmuch that they were Christians they were also a reflection of him, for he had taught and discipled them. They reflected both Paul's teaching and the teaching of Christ (both were the same).


Is the truth communicated to you through the Watchtower magazines? The J.W.'s say it is.
We have the truth in the 66 books of the Bible unadulterated and unchanged for the past 2000 years. Therefore it is our guide. It is the scriptures which are inspired and preserved, not anything by word of mouth. Man makes mistakes; God does not.


Jesus is "The Word." The written Word reveals who Christ is. The written Word repudiates all Catholic doctrine. The RCC started with a pagan ruler called Constantine in the beginning of the fourth century. It had pagan beginnings and is still mixed with paganism.


The RCC has no message to deliver to anyone. It is ignorant of the message of salvation.


You need to know the Lord before you partake of anything. You are a badly confused person.
If you were to stand before God right now, and he were to ask you: "Why should I let you into my heaven?" What would you answer?

No sir there were no bibles for hundreds of years. The reason the APOSTLES did communion is on the command of communion,

Communion has its own authority. Jesus Christ WROTE IT, and you don't have it because you disagree with the form of communication. You told Jesus "it has to be in ink and paper" , Nothing in scripture says it has to be in ink and paper.

You made up your own rule and placed it ABOVE Christ's rule.




Scripture Alone doesn't cut it

2 Peter 3
16As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.



I hand you a bible. Its in Chinese. The perfect word of God. Can't do nothing with it. You always require someone WITH AUTHORITY to explain how it works, the context, ects.

Which is why protestants can't get their story straight with thousands of differ views and all claim the other is hell bound.


The 66 books did not fall out the sky.

When Jesus quotes scripture we know he quotes from a Septuagint bible. Your new testament accepts the Septuagint, yet has more books. Books Martin Luther got rid of. He almost got rid of James too. For obvious reason its contrary to his faith alone.

On who's authority if ALL SCRIPTURE is God -breathed.


"The Gospel according to MARK" <---we can see the original manuscripts there is no "MARK", no chapter numbers, no verse numbers.......Those were put in....by CATHOLICS.


You do not have a HOLY TABLE OF CONTENTS to even identify a bible.

1 timothy 3
15But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.


Scripture Alone doesn't even come close to that claim^


Matthew 18
15“If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother. 16“But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you, so that BY THE MOUTH OF TWR THREE WITNESSES EVERY FACT MAY BE CONFIRMED. 17“If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.

Notice Jesus doesn't say well crack open a King James bible to settle the matter.

The amount of instances of all commands of Jesus are just ignored or re-written BACKWARDS by you folks is just Laughable.

You don't believe the bible.....not even close.

Jesus says: Matthew 6
14“For if you forgive others for their transgressions, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15“But if you do not forgive others, then your Father will not forgive your transgressions.


So what does DHK believe? easy just run whatever Jesus says BACKWARDS. IF GOD forgives you THEN you can forgive others.

Or just attribute any doctrine Satan gives as Christ's.

Genesis3
4The serpent said to the woman, “You surely will not die!

IE. Eternal Security, OSAS.


Luke 10
25And a lawyer stood up and put Him to the test, saying, “Teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?” 26And He said to him, “What is written in the Law? How does it read to you?” 27And he answered, “YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR STRENGTH, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND; AND YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.” 28And He said to him, “You have answered correctly; DO THIS AND YOU WILL LIVE.”

^ oh well that means DON'T love God because he doesn't want love. That means faith alone.



I could go through the ENTIRE bible and say AMEN that's right. But you call Jesus Christ a LIAR.

 

[utilyan]

I just realized that's what Satan wants huh? The glorification of disobedience. Up who Jesus is but don't do anything he says.

 

[Hark]

Who in the Baptist forum thinks they can lose their salvation? Only those that post down here think that.

There is another way of getting out of saying that, and that is by saying that they were never saved in the first place or that they were false believers.

Nowhere in the N.T. will there be a guideline to condemn a professing believer like that. There are guidelines in exposing false apostles so believers need not follow them or their example, but never to accuse a brother of never having been a brother.

2 Thessalonians 3:1 Finally, brethren, pray for us, that the word of the Lord may have free course, and be glorified, even as it is with you: 2 And that we may be delivered from unreasonable and wicked men: for all men have not faith. 3 But the Lord is faithful, who shall stablish you, and keep you from evil. 4 And we have confidence in the Lord touching you, that ye both do and will do the things which we command you. 5 And the Lord direct your hearts into the love of God, and into the patient waiting for Christ. 6 Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us. 7 For yourselves know how ye ought to follow us: for we behaved not ourselves disorderly among you;

Note how Paul cites these unreasonable and wicked men that have not faith and that they no longer walk after the traditions taught of us and how we are commanded to withdraw from them as brothers still?

One more time... in that same chapter..

2 Thessalonians 3:14 And if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed. 15 Yet count him not as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother.

So there can be false apostles and false teachers, but they are still to be admonished as brothers. No one gets to say they were never saved in the first place.

Then believers err by saying.. well... then we are able to lose our salvation seeing how they do not have faith or believe in Him any more.

No. Because they are still brothers as He is faithful and He still abides.

2 Timothy 2:13 If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.

Brothers that are not abiding in Him are at risk of being excommunicated by God at the pre trib rapture event, but even though the prodigal son gave up his first inheritance for wild living, he will find that he is still son.

 

[utilyan]

When you see or hear any Baptists praying to Mary or other Saints let me know. Cuz then you will have a legitimate comparison.

Catholics don't worship Mary.

But lets say they did, Are you saying GOOD WORKS of Loving God making him the first priority is required for salvation?

In other words why bicker about what the Catholics do "WRONG" if you yourselves claim there is no such thing as a requirement of "DOING RIGHT"?

 

[Revmitchell]

Catholics don't worship Mary.

But lets say they did, Are you saying GOOD WORKS of Loving God making him the first priority is required for salvation?

In other words why bicker about what the Catholics do "WRONG" if you yourselves claim there is no such thing as a requirement of "DOING RIGHT"?

I think you are projecting on me, out of some arguments you have had with others.

 

[DHK]

No sir there were no bibles for hundreds of years. The reason the APOSTLES did communion is on the command of communion,

The book of Revelation was completed ca. 98 A.D. Long before that time, more than 20 years, all the other books (save for John's writings) were all finished. John had access to them all.
First, do you think that the apostles did not teach those first century Christians the contents of those epistles?
Second, do you think that those epistles were not kept by the early Christians and also circulated by them?
Third, by John's time, no doubt the Holy Spirit had already spoken to him and told him which were inspired and which were not. We find that evidence in 2Peter, as the Lord told Peter which of Paul's writings were inspired.

2 Peter 3:15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;
16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
--Peter recognized Paul's writings as Scripture. By the time they reached John, more than 20 years later John would recognize the same thing.

To put it bluntly: Do you think that the Apostles were so stupid that they did not know which books were inspired and which were not, and that they did not pass this information down to the first generation Christians? The first generation Christians therefore had the NT Canon by the end of the first generation..

Communion has its own authority. Jesus Christ WROTE IT, and you don't have it because you disagree with the form of communication. You told Jesus "it has to be in ink and paper" , Nothing in scripture says it has to be in ink and paper.

1 Corinthians 11:23 For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread:
24 And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.
--"You do err not knowing the scriptures neither the power of God."
Paul not only gives instructions here, he quotes Jesus in doing so.

You made up your own rule and placed it ABOVE Christ's rule.

I follow the Word of God. That is here the instruction of Christ are found.

Scripture Alone doesn't cut it

2 Peter 316As.

This is exactly what you are doing--wresting the scriptures to your own destruction.
You are also trying to add to the scriptures, something expressly forbidden by the Word of God.

Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

I hand you a bible. Its in Chinese. The perfect word of God. Can't do nothing with it. You always require someone WITH AUTHORITY to explain how it works, the context, ects.

Then give it to the Chinese people and get yourself an English Bible that you can understand. Duh!

Which is why protestants can't get their story straight with thousands of differ views and all claim the other is hell bound.

Such as??

The 66 books did not fall out the sky.

No, they were inspired by God, delivered to us by the apostles.
2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

When Jesus quotes scripture we know he quotes from a Septuagint bible. Your new testament accepts the Septuagint, yet has more books. Books Martin Luther got rid of. He almost got rid of James too. For obvious reason its contrary to his faith alone.

But you don't know that. They used the Hebrew Bible in the Synagogues. What you say is simple conjecture. You have no evidence. Our NT does not have the Septuagint. Do some Bible history. The KJV translators translated directly from the original languages: the Greek and the Hebrew.
Furthermore, the original LXX written ca. 250 B.C. did not and could not have had the apocryphal books that you are referring to. Only later copies did. You have no evidence that even if Jesus did use the LXX that he used one of these later copies.

On who's authority if ALL SCRIPTURE is God -breathed.

In God's authority. If you question the Scripture you are questioning Christianity of course.
Jesus put his stamp of authority on the scripture by quoting from it, and using it extensively.

He said:
Luke 24:44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.
--Those three divisions cover the entire OT. The law of Moses covers the first five books. The Psalms is more than the book of Psalms, but in the Hebrew OT, it includes all the books of poetry, and the prophets include the rest of the OT. He put his stamp of approval on all the OT.

"The Gospel according to MARK" <---we can see the original manuscripts there is no "MARK", no chapter numbers, no verse numbers.......Those were put in....by CATHOLICS.

That shows the corruption of the Catholic Church. It also shows your ignorance.

You do not have a HOLY TABLE OF CONTENTS to even identify a bible.

Do you honestly think I need one or even use one?? Laugh

1 timothy 3
15But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

Scripture Alone doesn't even come close to that claim^

Of course it does. It is a pastoral epistle, Paul instructing Timothy as a young pastor how to rule and guide the church, a local church which is like a temple (the temple of Diana was in Ephesus where he was and supported by many pillars). The pillars of his church were grounded in the Word of God and upheld the Word of God--the only truth that we have.

Matthew 18:15-19

Notice Jesus doesn't say well crack open a King James bible to settle the matter.

And by the instructions given in the Word of God he was to be disciplined. That is why Jesus wrote those instructions. We go by the Word.

The amount of instances of all commands of Jesus are just ignored or re-written BACKWARDS by you folks is just Laughable.

How would you know the words of Jesus if they weren't written down? None of what you say makes any sense.

You don't believe the bible.....not even close.

It is not me that doesn't believe. You are contradicting yourself at every corner. The only reason you can quote the words of Jesus is that they are written down for us in the Bible. You can't see that??

Jesus says: Matthew 6:14
So what does DHK believe? easy just run whatever Jesus says BACKWARDS. IF GOD forgives you THEN you can forgive others.

--And just where did you get those instructions? How do you know this? From the Word of God, right?
Yes, forgiveness comes from God. Have you received it yet? Do you have a relationship with Christ?

Or just attribute any doctrine Satan gives as Christ's.

Apparently not. The above is blasphemy!

Genesis3
4The serpent said to the woman, “You surely will not die!

And the moment they ate they died--spiritually. But an unbeliever will never see this. They just mock the Word of God as you continue to do.

IE. Eternal Security, OSAS.

Once God killed an animal and blood was shed eternal life was given to them.

Luke 10
25And a lawyer stood up and put Him to the test, saying, “Teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?” 26And He said to him, “What is written in the Law? How does it read to you?” 27And he answered, “YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR STRENGTH, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND; AND YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.” 28And He said to him, “You have answered correctly; DO THIS AND YOU WILL LIVE.”

Do you think that lawyer who was tempting Jesus followed the command of Jesus here.
No he did not. And neither do you. You just committed the sin of blasphemy. You do not love God at all. Instead you make a mockery of Christ and his Word. You are a hypocrite and don't even belong on this board.

^ oh well that means DON'T love God because he doesn't want love. That means faith alone.

Salvation is by faith alone. If you are not saved, God will never accept your love. Your love is a selfish love.

I could go through the ENTIRE bible and say AMEN that's right. But you call Jesus Christ a LIAR.

You don't know the Bible; you don't know God, and you certainly don't know Christ.
If you haven't trusted Christ as your Lord and Savior he will never accept your love. Your love centers around self. God doesn't want your selfish love. You mock God and His Word. I will pray for you.
I trust God will open your eyes to the truth of God's Word.

 

[utilyan]

I'm not here to convert folks to Catholics. I want to see Baptists or whatever denomination reach its highest potential. My basic problem when I throw your own faith back at you is that you don't believe what you say you do. I want you to believe what you say you believe what you say you do. I have no doubt in my mind a Baptist Saint who has his faith with God is a beautiful sight to behold.

 

[utilyan]

I think you are projecting on me, out of some arguments you have had with others.

Sorry about that.

Your probably right.

 

[utilyan]

The book of Revelation was completed ca. 98 A.D. Long before that time, more than 20 years, all the other books (save for John's writings) were all finished. John had access to them all.
First, do you think that the apostles did not teach those first century Christians the contents of those epistles?
Second, do you think that those epistles were not kept by the early Christians and also circulated by them?
Third, by John's time, no doubt the Holy Spirit had already spoken to him and told him which were inspired and which were not. We find that evidence in 2Peter, as the Lord told Peter which of Paul's writings were inspired.

2 Peter 3:15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;
16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
--Peter recognized Paul's writings as Scripture. By the time they reached John, more than 20 years later John would recognize the same thing.

To put it bluntly: Do you think that the Apostles were so stupid that they did not know which books were inspired and which were not, and that they did not pass this information down to the first generation Christians? The first generation Christians therefore had the NT Canon by the end of the first generation..

1 Corinthians 11:23 For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread:
24 And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.
--"You do err not knowing the scriptures neither the power of God."
Paul not only gives instructions here, he quotes Jesus in doing so.


I follow the Word of God. That is here the instruction of Christ are found.


This is exactly what you are doing--wresting the scriptures to your own destruction.
You are also trying to add to the scriptures, something expressly forbidden by the Word of God.

Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Then give it to the Chinese people and get yourself an English Bible that you can understand. Duh!

Such as??

No, they were inspired by God, delivered to us by the apostles.
2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

But you don't know that. They used the Hebrew Bible in the Synagogues. What you say is simple conjecture. You have no evidence. Our NT does not have the Septuagint. Do some Bible history. The KJV translators translated directly from the original languages: the Greek and the Hebrew.
Furthermore, the original LXX written ca. 250 B.C. did not and could not have had the apocryphal books that you are referring to. Only later copies did. You have no evidence that even if Jesus did use the LXX that he used one of these later copies.


In God's authority. If you question the Scripture you are questioning Christianity of course.
Jesus put his stamp of authority on the scripture by quoting from it, and using it extensively.

He said:
Luke 24:44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.
--Those three divisions cover the entire OT. The law of Moses covers the first five books. The Psalms is more than the book of Psalms, but in the Hebrew OT, it includes all the books of poetry, and the prophets include the rest of the OT. He put his stamp of approval on all the OT.

That shows the corruption of the Catholic Church. It also shows your ignorance.

Do you honestly think I need one or even use one?? Laugh

Of course it does. It is a pastoral epistle, Paul instructing Timothy as a young pastor how to rule and guide the church, a local church which is like a temple (the temple of Diana was in Ephesus where he was and supported by many pillars). The pillars of his church were grounded in the Word of God and upheld the Word of God--the only truth that we have.

And by the instructions given in the Word of God he was to be disciplined. That is why Jesus wrote those instructions. We go by the Word.


How would you know the words of Jesus if they weren't written down? None of what you say makes any sense.


It is not me that doesn't believe. You are contradicting yourself at every corner. The only reason you can quote the words of Jesus is that they are written down for us in the Bible. You can't see that??


--And just where did you get those instructions? How do you know this? From the Word of God, right?
Yes, forgiveness comes from God. Have you received it yet? Do you have a relationship with Christ?

Apparently not. The above is blasphemy!

And the moment they ate they died--spiritually. But an unbeliever will never see this. They just mock the Word of God as you continue to do.

Once God killed an animal and blood was shed eternal life was given to them.


Do you think that lawyer who was tempting Jesus followed the command of Jesus here.
No he did not. And neither do you. You just committed the sin of blasphemy. You do not love God at all. Instead you make a mockery of Christ and his Word. You are a hypocrite and don't even belong on this board.


Salvation is by faith alone. If you are not saved, God will never accept your love. Your love is a selfish love.

You don't know the Bible; you don't know God, and you certainly don't know Christ.
If you haven't trusted Christ as your Lord and Savior he will never accept your love. Your love centers around self. God doesn't want your selfish love. You mock God and His Word. I will pray for you.
I trust God will open your eyes to the truth of God's Word.

When I'm talking about Love, I mean Agape. The command set by Jesus Christ, Love God and Love neighbor.

I appreciate your prayers.

Are you saying I require to engage the GOOD WORK of reading the bible? Or the good work of seeking Jesus?

You already counted me with a inability to seek Jesus. So I'M left with YOUR ability and the good work of praying to God. I can dig that. Thank you sir.

 

[DHK]

There is another way of getting out of saying that, and that is by saying that they were never saved in the first place or that they were false believers.

Only God knows the heart. Look at this verse:
2 Timothy 4:10 For Demas hath forsaken me, having loved this present world, and is departed unto Thessalonica; Crescens to Galatia, Titus unto Dalmatia.
--Was Demas saved? We don't know. In James 4:4, James says those that are a friend of the world are the enemy of God, but he also was writing to Christians. He forsook Paul in the ministry because his love for the world was greater. That does't speak much for his salvation.

Nowhere in the N.T. will there be a guideline to condemn a professing believer like that. There are guidelines in exposing false apostles so believers need not follow them or their example, but never to accuse a brother of never having been a brother.

What about Demas? We don't have the whole story. But:
1 John 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
--We do have guidelines.

1 John 2:19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.
--Those that are not faithful. That is a good indication that they were a false believer; were not saved in the first place. John says so: "they were not of us."

Do they exhibit the fruit of the Spirit in their lives? Have their lives been changed by the Spirit? If not it is doubtful they are saved.

2 Thessalonians 3:1 Finally, brethren, pray for us, that the word of the Lord may have free course, and be glorified, even as it is with you: 2 And that we may be delivered from unreasonable and wicked men: for all men have not faith. 3 But the Lord is faithful, who shall stablish you, and keep you from evil. 4 And we have confidence in the Lord touching you, that ye both do and will do the things which we command you. 5 And the Lord direct your hearts into the love of God, and into the patient waiting for Christ. 6 Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us. 7 For yourselves know how ye ought to follow us: for we behaved not ourselves disorderly among you;

Note how Paul cites these unreasonable and wicked men that have not faith and that they no longer walk after the traditions taught of us and how we are commanded to withdraw from them as brothers still?

The tradition is the Word of God taught to them by Paul. It is not an oral tradition.

One more time... in that same chapter..

2 Thessalonians 3:14 And if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed. 15 Yet count him not as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother.

So there can be false apostles and false teachers, but they are still to be admonished as brothers. No one gets to say they were never saved in the first place.

They were not saved because their doctrine was contrary to the Word of God.
Thus are only guide is the Word of God, not oral tradition, not the magesterium, not the Catechism, but only the Word of God.

Then believers err by saying.. well... then we are able to lose our salvation seeing how they do not have faith or believe in Him any more.

That is not true of any believer.

1 John 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

No. Because they are still brothers as He is faithful and He still abides.

2 Timothy 2:13 If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.

Brothers that are not abiding in Him are at risk of being excommunicated by God at the pre trib rapture event, but even though the prodigal son gave up his first inheritance for wild living, he will find that he is still son.

1 John 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
--One not abiding in him is not a believer. A believer will abide in Christ. The Bible doesn't contradict itself;

1 John 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

John 10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
--You have never given a suitable answer to this verse.
Eternal means eternal, not temporary. Is Christ a liar?

 

[Walter]

. DHK said: 'You just committed the sin of blasphemy. You do not love God at all. Instead you make a mockery of Christ and his Word. You are a hypocrite and don't even belong on this board.

You don't know the Bible; you don't know God, and you certainly don't know Christ.
If you haven't trusted Christ as your Lord and Savior he will never accept your love. Your love centers around self. God doesn't want your selfish love. You mock God and His Word. I will pray for you.
I trust God will open your eyes to the truth of God's Word' (God already has through Bible study) It just doesn't match one of your many, many different Protestant (fundamentalist) interpretations (all supposedly guided by a Holy Spirit that only you must conclude is schizophrenic!

And I will pray for you, DHK. Someday you will stand before the Eternal Judge and He will ask you why you persecuted His Church. Wouldn't want to be in your shoes.

And there you go again. Questioning someones salvation which is a blatant disregard of Forum Rules. Ok for you to do but not for others right? The brother (yes, he is a Christian based on his confession of his trust in Christ shed blood for His taking away his sin and he has followed the Lord's command to be baptized). You yourself said if we say we love God and ignore His commands we are hypocrites. What about you? You hate the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church consists of it's membership. So you hate Catholics. If you say you love God but hate your brother doesn't that make you a liar. You have accused me a lying many times on this board. I have proven you wrong convincingly by providing documents to prove it. You never apologize for the false statements you make against the Catholic Church (Catholic priests are never allowed to marry, you are lying Walter!). Now you want to say only a small 'sect' in North America allow married priests despite millions of Eastern Catholics worldwide. You never apologize because 'you are never wrong'. I have apologized on this board for mistakes I have made. Time for you to show an inkling of humility and admit you don't have infallible knowledge of the Catholic Church.

 

[utilyan]

. DHK said: 'You just committed the sin of blasphemy. You do not love God at all. Instead you make a mockery of Christ and his Word. You are a hypocrite and don't even belong on this board.

You don't know the Bible; you don't know God, and you certainly don't know Christ.
If you haven't trusted Christ as your Lord and Savior he will never accept your love. Your love centers around self. God doesn't want your selfish love. You mock God and His Word. I will pray for you.
I trust God will open your eyes to the truth of God's Word' (God already has through Bible study) It just doesn't match one of your many, many different Protestant (fundamentalist) interpretations (all supposedly guided by a Holy Spirit that only you must conclude is schizophrenic!

And I will pray for you, DHK. Someday you will stand before the Eternal Judge and He will ask you why you persecuted His Church. Wouldn't want to be in your shoes.

And there you go again. Questioning someones salvation which is a blatant disregard of Forum Rules. Ok for you to do but not for others right? The brother (yes, he is a Christian based on his confession of his trust in Christ shed blood for His taking away his sin and he has followed the Lord's command to be baptized). You yourself said if we say we love God and ignore His commands we are hypocrites. What about you? You hate the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church consists of it's membership. So you hate Catholics. If you say you love God but hate your brother doesn't that make you a liar. You have accused me a lying many times on this board. I have proven you wrong convincingly by providing documents to prove it. You never apologize for the false statements you make against the Catholic Church (Catholic priests are never allowed to marry, you are lying Walter!). Now you want to say only a small 'sect' in North America allow married priests despite millions of Eastern Catholics worldwide. You never apologize because 'you are never wrong'. I have apologized on this board for mistakes I have made. Time for you to show an inkling of humility and admit you don't have infallible knowledge of the Catholic Church.

Well the first reaction when something makes you look dirty is to demonize and make the other guy dirtier then oneself.

The Pharisees would call Jesus prince of devils. Notice how even though Jesus was at odds with them he still respected their religion.

Matthew 23
1Then Jesus spoke to the crowds and to His disciples, 2saying: “The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves in the chair of Moses; 3therefore all that they tell you, do and observe, but do not do according to their deeds; for they say things and do not do them.


Notice that Chair of Moses, Traditional seat of authority. You won't find how it works anywhere in the bible........Because its a tradition, one Jesus respects.

We Christians have our own modern day Pharisees. "DO not DO them" Folk easy to spot.

 

[DHK]

. DHK said: 'You just committed the sin of blasphemy. You do not love God at all. Instead you make a mockery of Christ and his Word. You are a hypocrite and don't even belong on this board.

You don't know the Bible; you don't know God, and you certainly don't know Christ.
If you haven't trusted Christ as your Lord and Savior he will never accept your love. Your love centers around self. God doesn't want your selfish love. You mock God and His Word. I will pray for you.
I trust God will open your eyes to the truth of God's Word'

(God already has through Bible study) It just doesn't match one of your many, many different Protestant (fundamentalist) interpretations (all supposedly guided by a Holy Spirit that only you must conclude is schizophrenic!

And I will pray for you, DHK. Someday you will stand before the Eternal Judge and He will ask you why you persecuted His Church. Wouldn't want to be in your shoes.

Don't worry. You are not in my shoes. Be concerned for your own salvation. Anyone who believes in baptismal regeneration is trusting in their baptism rather than Christ for their salvation, will not make it to heaven. Sad to say Walter but that is the truth. Jesus is the only way. I am not questioning any one's salvation. I am telling the truth regarding salvation.

I suggest you look at this post:
http://www.baptistboard.com/threads...-with-christianity.97458/page-10#post-2205835

Your friend, uliyan, said: "maybe theres still hope I will be saved!"Devilish
But that is not all.

Your two questions:

Do you believe in the Lord Jesus Christ?
YES.

Do you believe that God raised Him from the dead?
YES.

I asked the Devil those two questions and he said YES TOO!Devilish

By what he posts on here, no I don't believe he is saved, and I post to one who is unsaved.
Not only does his profile say Catholic, it says "bad Catholic."

And there you go again. Questioning someones salvation which is a blatant disregard of Forum Rules. Ok for you to do but not for others right? The brother (yes, he is a Christian based on his confession of his trust in Christ shed blood for His taking away his sin and he has followed the Lord's command to be baptized).

Actually his confession says the opposite. His words say the opposite. They mock God, the Bible, and Christ. And yes he committed blasphemy. But you don't believe. Did you actually read his post? Do you know what blasphemy is?

You yourself said if we say we love God and ignore His commands we are hypocrites. What about you? You hate the Catholic Church.

Its organization and its doctrine. If I hated its people I obviously would never pray for the people within, like my own relatives. Thus your arguments make no sense.

The Catholic Church consists of it's membership. So you hate Catholics.

See above. You make no sense.

If you say you love God but hate your brother doesn't that make you a liar. You have accused me a lying many times on this board. I have proven you wrong convincingly by providing documents to prove it. You never apologize for the false statements you make against the Catholic Church (Catholic priests are never allowed to marry, you are lying Walter!).

Actually it is a lie Walter. The context is The Roman Catholic Church, which in conversation I always refer to as the RCC. None of those links you gave are part of the RCC. Therefore you are simply being deceitful by saying that Armenian Catholics are part of the RCC. They aren't. That is a lie.

Now you want to say only a small 'sect' in North America allow married priests despite millions of Eastern Catholics worldwide. You never apologize because 'you are never wrong'. I have apologized on this board for mistakes I have made. Time for you to show an inkling of humility and admit you don't have infallible knowledge of the Catholic Church.

Those sects are not part of the RCC Walter, and you know it. It is time to fess up, and tell people the truth.

 

[DHK]

I'm not here to convert folks to Catholics. I want to see Baptists or whatever denomination reach its highest potential. My basic problem when I throw your own faith back at you is that you don't believe what you say you do. I want you to believe what you say you believe what you say you do. I have no doubt in my mind a Baptist Saint who has his faith with God is a beautiful sight to behold.

1. It is obvious you don't know what a saint is. Every person that has a relationship with Jesus Christ is a saint. The RCC redefined this word. For example, when Paul wrote his epistles, he wrote to believers in Christ, and they were all saints:

Romans 1:7 To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.

1 Corinthians 1:2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours:

Ephesians 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus:

We believe the Bible, not the traditions of men. You may not see what you want to see when you are being contentious or are posting heresy on this board, especially the latter.

How can you expect to "throw our faith back at us" when you don't know what it is. Sounds ridiculous to me.