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Cheap Grace

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by bound, Mar 12, 2007.

  1. James_Newman

    James_Newman New Member

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    I think I do preach a kind of antinomianism, at least in so far as I don't believe in keeping commandments to be saved. I don't believe the goal of a Christian is to earn eternal salvation and/or keep salvation through keeping commandments. The goal of a Christian is to win a crown, to reign with Christ in His coming kingdom. Becoming like Christ must happen after becoming born again, and being born again is a requirement for entering the kingdom of God.

    Traditionally, most of Christianity seems to be on either side of the truth, teaching either that one must be good to be saved or that our works have no effect on our standing with God. Both are true in their proper context. As an unsaved sinner, one must believe on Christ alone to be saved. It is not of works, but is a free gift. Once a person is saved, now you are entered into the race and God does require us to run. If we do not, we will not inherit the kingdom of God. But we are still saved, with a promise to be raised up on the last day.
     
  2. Aaron

    Aaron Member
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    I want a preacher who will follow Paul's example and preach repentance toward God and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ.
     
  3. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    yea, me too. Search on.
     
    #23 Brother Bob, Mar 12, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 12, 2007
  4. Jon-Marc

    Jon-Marc New Member

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    Personally, I wouldn't go back to that church if it was me. That kind of attitude means that you can live as you please because God doesn't care.
     
  5. StraightAndNarrow

    StraightAndNarrow Active Member

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    Sounds like a "Grace only" Calvinist church to me. One in which being born again is immaterial and you don't even have to know if you've been saved. Any change in your life after salvation is counted as salvation by works. In short, entirely of Satan.
     
  6. Brother Randall

    Brother Randall New Member

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    Keep searching...

    Unfortunately, finding a church that preaches the bible can be hard to find. I searched for months here in MA. Finally, settled on a SBC church, but I have to drive 37 mins to get there.

    Suggestion - Go over to SBC.net and plug your address into the church search engine and it will give you list of SBC churches in your area.
     
  7. pinoybaptist

    pinoybaptist Active Member
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    Why does it need to be a "Grace Only" Calvinist church and not an antinomian Arminian church where his salvation happens because he knew about it and he and not Christ did something about it and not because God decided on it ?
     
  8. reformedbeliever

    reformedbeliever New Member

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    Yeah.......... all those satanic calvinists. How dare them say that one does not have to be born again.............:laugh:

    Is there one (smiley) for rolling on the floor laughing?

    I pray everyone has a super great day in the Lord. We all need a good laugh at times. :godisgood:
     
  9. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    [​IMG]




    [​IMG]

    Remove the *
     
    #29 Brother Bob, Mar 12, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 12, 2007
  10. Steven2006

    Steven2006 New Member

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    "Now those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. If we live by the Spirit, let us also walk by the Spirit."
    Galatians 5:24,25
     
  11. reformedbeliever

    reformedbeliever New Member

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    Thank you brother. Good to see you back. Nice talking with you and your wife the other day. We are keeping you guys in prayer.
     
  12. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    You made my day when you called and pleased my family also. We all thank you very much for your prayers and caring. I went to Wal-Mart today for a little while.
     
  13. reformedbeliever

    reformedbeliever New Member

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    Now that is exercise........lol. You have to stay on your toes to keep from being run over in Wal Mart around here. You are a brave man brother. :laugh:
     
  14. bound

    bound New Member

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    God Bless you bapmom!

    Great to see you online again! Actually I didn't pursue further inquiry with the Paster as I felt it was going in the wrong direction and I wanted to show some respect for the man and not jump to conclusions. I do have his email address and I am pursuing further dialogue with him but I thought it would be wise to throw it up here and get some feedback from my online community.

    I'll PM you my location. Thanks!

    PS: It's so nice to run into you again! God Bless!
     
  15. bound

    bound New Member

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    Grace and Peace James_Newman,

    I don't believe one 'needs' to draw a line between Legalism and Antinomianism. Either extreme, in my humble opinion, is blasphemy of the Holy Ghost. The Grace of God is not a license to sin and I can't see how one who 'truly' loves Jesus and has claimed Him as their Lord and Saviour can rationalize continuing in a life of sin unabated by the Grace given to them by the Holy Ghost or to hold an attitude which is accepting of a life of sin as normative to the Christian Life of the Spirit. Salvation isn't 'mental ascent' but accepting the salvific grace won on the Cross for us by the Death and Resurrection of Christ. This isn't a 'cheap' Grace nor is it a 'dead' Grace but a 'living' Grace in the Spirit to become 'living and loving' Children of God, salt and light for the World. If our Salvation isn't alive in the Spirit and we are not witnesses to the Spirit working righteousness within us I am highly suspicious of such a 'salvation' being 'salvific'.

    I don't believe this is a question of 'being good enough'. That is a red herring to me. In Christ, we are given the freedom from sin and death and empowered by the Holy Ghost to become everything God created use to be, truly Human in the fullest sense. Grace is a 'living' relationship with God in the Spirit. I simply have a great deal of trouble believing that such intimacy with God leaves room for our continued life in the flesh in bondage to Sin.

    Your thoughts are very much welcomed...
     
  16. James_Newman

    James_Newman New Member

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    I would not say that a life of sin is normative to the Christian Life of the Spirit. But I would say that very few saved folks are living that Christian Life of the Spirit. Every child of God has the grace available to walk in the Spirit, it has already been given to them and all they need to do is avail themselves of it. But that doesn't mean they will. Does that mean they have a license to sin? Not if my view is correct. The bible tells me that a man reaps what he sows, and saved people are no exception. A man may be saved on the last day, based on faith in Jesus Christ, and yet reap corruption at the judgment seat of Christ because he sowed to the flesh.

    Intimacy with God comes from walking with Him in obedience to His word.
    John 15:10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
    Believers who never experience this intimacy with Jesus will not inherit the kingdom of God, but the eternal benefit of Christ's death is extended even to those lukewarm believers.
    John 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
    Reigning with Christ during the kingdom is a reward for faithful service. Being raised up on the last day is a free gift to any who will believe. We make a mess of grace and works when we fail to resolve the distinction between the free gift and the reward. God is able to preserve His grace without diminishing His holiness and justice. He is able to kill a man and raise him back up again.
     
  17. bound

    bound New Member

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    Grace and Peace James_Newman,

    I'm really glad you've taken the time to discuss this with me and take no offense nor be argumentative. It has really helped me understand your position better and to a large extent agree with you. This has been 'really' helpful for me. Thanks a lot!

    Okay this has gone a long way to clearing up my concerns but why don't we preach 'spiritual athleticism'? What I think I dislike about 'feel-good' sermons is there lack of preaching a fulfilling life in the Spirit and seem to present a Christianity on life-support only with no intimacy with God and not salt and light for the World. Very much a 'dead' faith.

    I want to be taught how to live as an 'Athlete in Christ' not how to just barely get in to the Kingdom... you know what I mean?

    Thanks again and God Bless.
     
  18. James_Newman

    James_Newman New Member

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    I'm not much into feel-good preaching either. Preachers should be challenging us to continually examine ourselves for ways to draw nearer to Christ, to purge the sin from our lives. We should remember that we are not so much going to be judged on what we did for Jesus, but what we could have done. I think of the words of Paul:
    Philippians 3:13-14
    13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,
    14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.
     
  19. StraightAndNarrow

    StraightAndNarrow Active Member

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    Christ did something for all of our salvations. Noone knows about it in advance. They are saved because they accept Christ as their Savior. The result of their salvation is always a changed life or it was not genuine.
     
  20. StraightAndNarrow

    StraightAndNarrow Active Member

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    So you're claiming that salvation can be achieved without being born again (changing one's life)?
     
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