Cheney-Edwards Debate

[Joseph_Botwinick]

I am giving this debate to Cheney. He did very well. Especially on foreign policy and on Kerry's record of being on the wrong side of national defense and economic policy for the past 30 years.

I would have liked to hear more about the good things that are happening in the past 4-5 days in Iraq. But, other than that, I think he did very well in style and substance.

Edwards did a good job pressing on the jobs issue. I think Cheney held his own defending the record. I call the second half of the debate a draw with a slight advantage to Edwards.

Cheney did tonight what Bush needed to do last Thursday. He was engaged, sharp, and substantive. He won the part of the debate that meant the most to voters this year: Foreign Policy.

The one thing that Cheney discussed tonight that I think helped a lot was the fact that since he has no interest in running for president in '08, he is a loyal advisor to the president who doesn't need his approval when he tells him what he really thinks about certain policies. He also doesn't need the approval of special interests group when he helps to make policy with the president. This is a definite strength for him as a leader.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[LadyEagle]

A few good slam dunks by both sides. A nasty below-the-belt gibe by Edwards on the Cheney family matter, which only made him look immature. Nice calls by Cheney on all the Senate votes Kerry & Edwards have missed, I thought.

Basically, I saw it as the pot calling the kettle black on all counts. Tit-for-tat. Both did their homework.

 

[The Galatian]

I figure barely Cheney, or maybe a tie. Not good enough to counter Bush's unfortunate performance.

This makes it all the more urgent that Bush win convincingly next debate. He has a format in which he can play to the crowd, which should give him an advantage.

 

[askM]

Originally posted by Ray Berrian:
Generally speaking Edwards is not like even in North Carolina; if he was not V.P. candidate he would have to go back to the practice of law. Chaney will have all the basis covered, but Edwards will still prattle his half truths/half lies eloquently.

Dr. Berrian

You are quite correct my friend. I am a North Carolinian born and raised here, and NO John Edwards is absolutely not liked in my neck of the woods, or in the majority of NC. 1976 was the last time a democrat won this state.

 

[askM]

I too am giving this one to Cheney. Absolute victory, no holds barred, knock out. John Edwards did what he's good at- grinned with a smidgeon of fake southern charm and avoided as much as he could squirm his trial lawyer booty out of. The one and only good thing that could come from John Edwards being VP is that us folks in NC would get rid of him and ship him off to D.C. with the rest of the beaurocrats! Cheney nailed it on substance and style, though very dry as he always is. Edwards is wet behind the ears and just simply could not hold water against Grandpa Cheney. I was grinning from ear to ear.

 

[Craigbythesea]

As much as I find displeasure in Cheney, I almost felt sorry for him. Considering his vast knowledge and experience, I expected to him to be at least a little presidential rather than a worn out rug.

Whether we are Republicans or Democrats, the Vice President that we are going to elect to serve for the next four years must have enough life in him to be able to hold his head up without using both hands. If Bush were to be re-elected and die in office, I do not think that there is even a small chance that Cheney would have the physical or mental strength to be the President of the United States for four years. Has anybody taken a look at the guy who is next in line?

Personally, I am not going to vote for a man who tonight looked as though he may very well be dead by the time my vote is counted.

 

[Daisy]

I thought it was fairly even, once I got past Edwards' eager-boyness - sort of like Dan Quayle with brains. Perhaps it's my old fogeyness coming out, but I prefer Cheney's subdued style.

In substance, I give Edwards the edge, particularly on second & third viewing. While Edwards was often misleading, Cheney was often flat-out wrong.

Check out FactCheck.org for a detailed assessment of facts.

C-Span mentioned that this debate was refered to as Shrek vs Breck.

A nasty below-the-belt gibe by Edwards on the Cheney family matter, which only made him look immature.

I thought he was respectful towards Cheney's daughter. Cheney seemed to think so.

 

[The Galatian]

Polls are starting to come in. Bush needed a knock-out to stop Kerry's resurgence.

He didn't get it. In fact, polls seem to show most people thought Edwards won. I don't agree with that, but perceptions seem to be running the other way.

 

[Pastor Larry]

I only watched the first little bit of it. Some of the rest I watched with the sound down since I was on the phone. I thought Edwards came off at the beginning as very unprofessional and willing to do anything to try to score points. His blatant personal attacks were completely out of line. He did not even try to be gentlemenly about his disasgreements. I think this is part of KErry's new game plan to go on the attack all the time and keep throwing this stuff out and hope it sticks. In the first few exchanges I saw, I thought Cheney did a much better job of showing Edward's false statements and Edwards seemed to have no reply to them except to say that Cheney was "not being straight." (To start the debate off that was was unconscionable.")

I did not see enough to see how Cheney responded throughout. I read the factcheck page and thought both sides appeared to have their factual problems.

I thought in terms of body language, Cheney was far and away the most "presidential." He appeared much more calm and in control, where I think Edwards appeared much more like a used car salesman. But I didn't hear the content of what was being said.

 

[RockRambler]

I missed the below-the-belt comment by Edwards about Cheney's family...what was it???

I think my prediction pretty much came true...both did about what I expected, with not as clear a winner as last week.

Interesting sidenote, the local TV station was reporting this morning that Sen. Elizabeth Dole, R-NC, went to Cheney after the debate and reminded him that she had introduced Edwards to him some time ago.

Bottom line is though, this debate will be forgotten by the time Bush-Kerry II is over Friday night. History shows very few people every base their vote for President on the No. 2 man.

 

[The Galatian]

Yeah, I thought Edwards was right about Cheney's daughter. It shouldn't be an issue. And Cheney was good enough to thank Edwards for saying so.

It was a nice touch to have the families come out and share the stage, BTW.

 

[RockRambler]

MSNBC showed Cheney and Edwards sitting next to each other on a dais at a prayer breakfast. In addition, Tim Russert said that they were both on his show a couple of yearrs ago. When Cheney finished his segment on MEET THE PRESS he shook hands with Edwards.

I did admire Cheney though for sticking to his guns so-to-speak on the gay marriage issue. He disagrees with Bush and his party on the issue, but he's not afraid to say so. That's unusual for any politician on any issue this day and time.

 

[Pastor Larry]

I think that shows that Bush does tolerate dissent. He is not afraid to hear opinions that differ from his wown.

 

[tragic_pizza]

I think of all the things politicians have to do in a given term, and the idea that Edwards and Cheney shared a table at a single breakfast, yet Cheney forgot about it, isn't surprising.

Unless, I suppose, you;re looking to discredit someone. Then it's a HUGE deal...

 

[RockRambler]

I think of all the things politicians have to do in a given term, and the idea that Edwards and Cheney shared a table at a single breakfast, yet Cheney forgot about it, isn't surprising.

Having been a more political breakfasts than I care to admit, I'd have to agree with that statement. Many times its such a meet-and-greet thing that a week later, especially after you've been to 5 more that week, they tend to run together.

I am surprised though he didn't remember Elizabeth Dole introducing him to Edwards. I've had dealings with her since 1987 and she is very unforgettable!!! Edwards is Mr. Personality in a social setting also, so I think both at the same time would be hard to forget.

Just goes to show that "mis-statements" can occur to the best of them when they ad-lib during a debate.

 

[tragic_pizza]

Well, it'll be interesting to see if this becomes as big a non-issue as the "Kerry-and-his-pen" thing was after the Presidential debate.

 

[Gina B]

How is she unforgettable? Does she slurp her soup? Use the wrong fork for salads? Kick people under the table? DISH!

Gina

 

[The Galatian]

Cheney also swore Edwards in. Seems that should stick in his memory. Apparently, there are a good number of photos from various events, showing them in close proximity.

Either Cheney got flustered by being confronted about his collaboration with terrorist states, or he just has a really, really bad memory.

 

[Pennsylvania Jim]

Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:
...

Edwards did a good job pressing on the jobs issue. I think Cheney held his own defending the record. ...

I "missed" the debate, but if Cheney did a good job defending the net loss of 2,700,000 manufacturing jobs during his tenure, he is a master indeed.

 

[Pennsylvania Jim]

Originally posted by Pastor Larry:
I only watched the first little bit of it. Some of the rest I watched with the sound down since I was on the phone. I thought Edwards came off at the beginning as very unprofessional and willing to do anything to try to score points. His blatant personal attacks were completely out of line. He did not even try to be gentlemenly about his disasgreements. I think this is part of KErry's new game plan to go on the attack all the time and keep throwing this stuff out and hope it sticks. In the first few exchanges I saw, I thought Cheney did a much better job of showing Edward's false statements and Edwards seemed to have no reply to them except to say that Cheney was "not being straight." (To start the debate off that was was unconscionable.")

I did not see enough to see how Cheney responded throughout. I read the factcheck page and thought both sides appeared to have their factual problems.

I thought in terms of body language, Cheney was far and away the most "presidential." He appeared much more calm and in control, where I think Edwards appeared much more like a used car salesman. But I didn't hear the content of what was being said.

Larry, I'm really surprised to see that you had the most positive impression of Cheney. You're predictable, I'll give you that.