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Choose ye this day whom you will serve
- Thread starter J.D.
- Start date
Brother Bob
New Member
Ok, that settles it! :thumbs: :applause:
webdog said:
...besides the Scipture I posted on the last page?
You mean the one verse you repeated a dozen times that says, "Fear God" and "put away the gods your fathers worshipped"?
Yeah, the words "choose to serve YHWH" really jump right out at you in Josh. 24:14, don't they? How could I have missed them?
Thank you for proving my point for me. Joshua commanded the Israelites to abandon paganism and serve the true God. He didn't offer it as a choice.
...besides the Scipture I posted on the last page?
You mean the one verse you repeated a dozen times that says, "Fear God" and "put away the gods your fathers worshipped"?
Yeah, the words "choose to serve YHWH" really jump right out at you in Josh. 24:14, don't they? How could I have missed them?
Thank you for proving my point for me. Joshua commanded the Israelites to abandon paganism and serve the true God. He didn't offer it as a choice.
Let me restate my question again, but in another way. I'm looking for the non-calvinist answer to it, since I already know the calvinist answer and I've never seen a non-calvinist answer to it. Please, no debate over what Joshua said - I regret using that example now. Here is the question with a sencario:
A group of young men attend a church service. They all hear the gospel preached for the first time. Out of ten young men, two of them are moved in their hearts to believe and receive the Lord as their Savior. The remaining eight were not so moved - in fact, they found the whole thing quite amusing as their scoffing jokes revealed.
WHAT WAS IN THE TWO THAT BELIEVED THAT WOULD CAUSE THEM TO REPENT AND RECEIVE THE LORD?
LIKEWISE, WHAT WAS IN THE EIGHT THAT BELIEVED NOT THAT CAUSED THEM TO REJECT THE LORD?
A group of young men attend a church service. They all hear the gospel preached for the first time. Out of ten young men, two of them are moved in their hearts to believe and receive the Lord as their Savior. The remaining eight were not so moved - in fact, they found the whole thing quite amusing as their scoffing jokes revealed.
WHAT WAS IN THE TWO THAT BELIEVED THAT WOULD CAUSE THEM TO REPENT AND RECEIVE THE LORD?
LIKEWISE, WHAT WAS IN THE EIGHT THAT BELIEVED NOT THAT CAUSED THEM TO REJECT THE LORD?
And to think that putting away false gods is not an option. Wow. What does verse 15 say? If they didn't follow this "command", then what? They could actually CHOOSE to worship false gods? Man, let Bible interpret Bible and let go of your manmade theology!
Kinda like your "command" word, huh?Yeah, the words "choose to serve YHWH" really jump right out at you in Josh. 24:14, don't they? How could I have missed them?
Funny how the word "choose" IS found in verse 15 though. Of course you will say that a "choice" is the ability to choose between false gods and false gods, which negates the very definition of "choice".I proved nothing for you, you just can't see through your pride.
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Brother Bob
New Member
God made them J.D. to know good and evil and to be able to choose which one they wanted. He made us humans so we could think, what about that. We are not like computers but man can really think. That is great!!!! amen
Brother Bob said:
Actually, he made them innocent and they were tempted to sin, after which when they sinned they knew good and evil.
That aside, am I to assume that your answer to my questions is:
Bob: These two THOUGHT about the gospel and therefore received it.
Bob: These eight didn't THINK about the gospel, and therefore rejected it.
Is that correct?
Brother Bob
New Member
No, they made of thought about the gospel but decided they loved darkness rather than light.
webdog said:
Webdog - congratulations, you have correctly answered the question "Why and how could anyone in their right mind DECIDE to love darkness rather than light?"
Now tell me this, why and how can a man that has that same sin nature turn right around and DECIDE to love light rather than darkness?
Since there is no room for "I don't know" or "mystery" (what calvinism calls unconditional election, btw), you must have an infinite mind, or at the very least, received some special revelation from God in regards to soterieology. I'm glad you have it all figured out...J.D. said:
I want to repeat my questions here to see if I can get another round of answers from any non-calvinists that may be there. After a while, I'll open the questions up to calvinists to compare the answers. And since I goofed up the OP apparently, I will accept "I don't know", it's a mystery, and it's not in the bible, type of answers. Sorry for buzzing you Webdog.
WHAT WAS IN THE TWO THAT BELIEVED THAT WOULD CAUSE THEM TO REPENT AND RECEIVE THE LORD?
LIKEWISE, WHAT WAS IN THE EIGHT THAT BELIEVED NOT THAT CAUSED THEM TO REJECT THE LORD?
And an added question from a previous post:
Why and how can a man that has that same sin nature turn right around and DECIDE to love light rather than darkness?
WHAT WAS IN THE TWO THAT BELIEVED THAT WOULD CAUSE THEM TO REPENT AND RECEIVE THE LORD?
LIKEWISE, WHAT WAS IN THE EIGHT THAT BELIEVED NOT THAT CAUSED THEM TO REJECT THE LORD?
And an added question from a previous post:
Why and how can a man that has that same sin nature turn right around and DECIDE to love light rather than darkness?
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Brother Bob
New Member
Fear of God will do it every time.
And to think that putting away false gods is not an option.
"Put away the gods that your fathers served beyond the River and in Egypt, and serve the LORD." (Josh. 24:14)
To think that when your leader speaks in the imperative mood, it's not an order.
If they didn't follow this "command", then what? They could actually CHOOSE to worship false gods?
Get serious. You don't actually think that Joshua was sincerely offering them a choice to do what the Law forbade, do you?
"Put away the gods that your fathers served beyond the River and in Egypt, and serve the LORD." (Josh. 24:14)
To think that when your leader speaks in the imperative mood, it's not an order.
If they didn't follow this "command", then what? They could actually CHOOSE to worship false gods?
Get serious. You don't actually think that Joshua was sincerely offering them a choice to do what the Law forbade, do you?
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Ransom said:And to think that putting away false gods is not an option.
"Put away the gods that your fathers served beyond the River and in Egypt, and serve the LORD." (Josh. 24:14)
To think that when your leader speaks in the imperative mood, it's not an order.
If they didn't follow this "command", then what? They could actually CHOOSE to worship false gods?
Get serious. You don't actually think that Joshua was sincerely offering them a choice to do what the Law forbade, do you?
I can see where Joshua really put his foot down, and told them!
Jos 24:15 But if it doesn't please you to worship the LORD, choose for yourselves today the one you will worship: the gods your fathers worshiped beyond the Euphrates River, or the gods of the Amorites in whose land you are living. As for me and my family, we will worship the LORD."