Christian be a Union rep.?

Posted by exscentric:
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rivers1222 said "Cant find much about workers banding together for the common good, "

Doesn't seem you found anything about demanding of the employer a list of wants either.

Doesn't seem you found anything about throwing a tantrum if you don't get what you want either.

Doesn't seem you found anything about acting hatefully when you are doing your demanding (strike) either.

Doesn't seem you found anything about extracting dues from people that aren't even in the union either.
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exscentric,
Thanks for your reply. As for demanding from my employer a list of wants, it's called negotiation. We give them our wish list, (wage and benefit increases), they give us theirs, (wage and benefit decreases).

As far as throwing a tantrum when I or we dont get what we want, I have been through 3 strikes in 20 years. Hate em. The owners of the company I work for are personal friends of mine. As stated before previously, they hired me, my loyalty is to them. However before they were the owners, they were in the union and know the benefits to the worker and to the company. You cannot go out on the street and just pick up good tradesman in this area. The union supplies a pool of craftsmen. My company CHOOSES to stay union.

Doing hateful things when striking? Actually I was either doing a side job or golfing. With whom? The owner of my company.

Extracting dues from people who arent even in the union? When I was hired to this company over 2 decades ago I was very anti-union. My dad was a non-union G.C. and I had a lot of bias. They stated in no uncertain term: join the union or you cant work here. It's what is known as a closed shop. Different states have different laws. There were many non-union shops in the area I could have gone to. For half the wages.

On a final note: It seems to me that some believe that the union worker would like to see his or her company fail. In fact some otherwise rational people feel this way. Why would any worker, (union or non-union), want that? The more successful a company is, from our small shop all the way to G.M. and Ford, the more wages, benefits, and job security we earn.
Thanks again for your reply.

 

Thankfully I've never been involved in a lock out. But from watching the news and reading the paper, never seen one of those handled in a Christian way either.

 

Aaron writes:
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First of all, the word servant is a broad term not meaning slaves only (by law bound to and the property of another), but all household servants whether for hire or apprenticeship. And so you see this exhortations to servants:

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Aaron,
Thanks for the reply. I think I see the reason for our disagreement. To you, the word servant is a broad term. To me it is not. I serve my God, my Savior, the members of my congregation. and my family. I am EMPLOYED by my EMPLOYER. I give him an honest 8 hours and he compensates me well.

 

In one of my first jobs I was in a union.
At the next job I attempted to bring in a union and ultimately, the three of us at the core of the matter all lost our jobs. Our boss called us into a private meeting and strongly attempted to persuade us to drop the matter. At the time we were working 16 hour shifts, weren't being given breaks half the time, and the performance based raises maxed at a dime.
From both experiences, I believe it's a good thing. It benefited me in the past in one workplace, and would have benefitted me in the second.
From what I've heard lately though, the original intentions of the union have been contaminated and the power it can have is often abused. That is a shame.

 

A friend of mine just retired as a union rep. and won many to Christ in that position. That was his main ministry in the Church. Depending on how you handle it, the union can be adversarial or provide dependable workers with high morals.

 

Hummmmm.

"Media is bias, it seems so are you."

Seems you are incorrect.

"I think from reading your post you have a grudge against unions."

Again, you are incorrect.

"Now what is your gripe?"

Tain't got one fer as I know.

Now, why don't you cut yer assumin down a tad

Now, we all know the media is biased, but when I see someone smashing a windshield, or spitting on people or all the other things I see on strike coverage, I don't think they are making it up.

I am so glad you love unions and can tell stories about how great they are but I'm not seeing much to convince me that a Christian should be a part of them due to the violence and tactics of the unions that I have seen.

Just because you have one thought on them does not mean I am automatically wrong, nor because I have seen some terrible sides to them doesn't mean you are wrong - just chewing on the subject - as I have said before and waiting to see some evidence that "in general" unions are a place for believers.

I have no problem with believers being in them if they can maintain their Christian stand through all aspects including a strike as some of you seem to have been able to do.

That does not set the stage for all believers in all unions and I think the thread was started out as a rather general question rather about specific unions.

The original was "I know some preachers who just hate unions. They blame the fall of america on unions.

"I just finished serving as Union rep. for almost three years. I did not run again and will reserve why not for later.

Go ahead and voice your opinions. Can Christians, or should christians be involved in unions? "

 

I hate to post long quotes, but it's difficult to pin down your meaning here. You didn't answer at all any of the Scriptural reasons I gave you that striking against an employer is an immoral act. Maybe you should start there.

Your point seems to be that striking is not illegal, so it's right. Surely you can see the folly in that sentiment.

 

If both sides are honest and wish success for the company in the future, neither making unreasonable demands, then there is no problem working for a solution. If GM does not respect their workers, and the workers do not respect GM, then I would say there is no hope of this company to continue. For your sake I hope both will be willing to give it a try.

 

ituttut writes:

3) Child labor laws. No 10 yr old kids making Martha Stewart sweaters and missing school.

I grew up during the depression and was earning money at age 7. I’m so thankful there were no Child labor laws when I was growing up. I don’t believe all four-letter words are dirty. I believe we were put on this earth to work, and not to be sluggards. It’s nice we can give our children allowances, if we can afford it, but many a child would like to have the opportunity to make a little extra money on their own of perhaps picking oranges, or doing some of the work that we Americans today are above. We could solve the threatening danger of the immigration situation that plaques us today.

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ituttut,
Thanks for your response. Of the four statements made in response to my post, this one concerns me most. The generation who grew up in the depression are the ones who built this country into what it is today. That includes you and my late father. One thing he told me that always stuck in my head is this: A parent always wants his kids to be better off than he is. This is passed on from generation to generation. I have a 15 yr old daughter who works for Kroger as a cashier, (ironically, she is in the union), after school, as long as her grades are good. This is for extra money. This is not in place of school, to help feed her family, or sweating her butt off sewing sweaters instead of being in class. We could go a long way in the fight against the threatening danger of immigration by holding the same standards of decency and morality to immigrants as we do our own children.
Work is not a four letter word. Servitude of minors is.

 

Appreciate your response and candor. I see your Dad brought up a sensible and industrious son, which qualities seem to have been instilled in your daughter.

Points you make are good if they applied to what I said. I never missed a day of school, and I was not forced to work. What you alluded to was during the days of slavery in the 1800’s, and that all began to fade after the Civil War in 1865. It was the slave’s children that were put in servitude, which was most definitely wrong, for we brought them (the parents) here for the purpose of slavery. The Unions did not bring about the abolition of servitude of minors.

As to the immigrant situation I should have made clear the danger is the “illegal immigrant” that is breaking the law. I don’t know if you are including them in your reply, but these people should not even be here, but whatever they are making they are happy for to them they are being paid more than they are worth. They have enough to take care of themselves and send money back home. We didn’t bring these people here as we did in slavery, so a justifiable comparison cannot be made with the 1800’s.

I can’t go along with the idea of lawbreakers making the minimum wage, but I can for our children, if they wish during the summer, and/or after school. They are United States citizens too and should have first choice. I would venture to say this summer there will be school kids that would like to, or need to work, but will not be able to find work for illegal immigrants already have those jobs. Christian faith, ituttut Galatians 1:11-12

 

You didn't explain anything. You just said you weren't a servant though I explained you were. You didn't answer the argument.

Reread my post. I explained that the word servant includes more than slavery. It includes the employer/employee relationship as well.

You owe them obedience, loyalty, and diligent labor as unto the Lord.

They owe you wages, but you are the servant, not the master.

Perhaps you could start by showing me how it is a moral thing to hold your employer hostage until he agrees to your demands.

 

rivers1222 is strangely silent.