Christian "Rock"?

There is no such thing as Christian rock if you are referring to what some call music. However I believe that Jesus Christ is somewhere in Scripture referred to as a Rock. I know, I know; 1 Corinthians 10:4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

 

So let’s just go ahead and keep this completely unbiblical logic working. Let me first say your erroneous application of scripture is appalling to say the least. Now back to your logic.

In America we wear certain types of acceptable clothing (suits, etc.).
This standard is certainly set by the “world’s” standards (this is evidenced by the differing dress of cultures).
If you get saved and you are still wearing a suit you are conforming to the “world’s” materialistic standards.
You certainly look like the world, move like the world (you do walk upright I would assume), act like the world, and look like the world (you have on clothes that are suitable to “our” standards).

If you are so interested in nonconformity to the “world’s” standards then why do you dress like them? Why don’t you research biblical dress and dress like that despite the objections and glares of society?

Don’t you realize the difference between content and tempo? Did the hymns not conform to the musical styles of their time?

I’ll try this again. The difference between good and evil is content, not tempo. An unsaved man is composed differently then a saved man; they both still have eyes, arms, clothes and walk upright, but they are different in content.

Romans 12:2 Do not conform any longer to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God's will is—his good, pleasing and perfect will. NIV

Romans 12: 2And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, so that you may prove what the will of God is, that which is good and acceptable and perfect. NASB

Romans 12: 2And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. KJV

Are you seeing a pattern here? Renewing of your MIND; it’s a content issue not a tempo issue.

He's another problem with your assertion. You are working under the unproven assumption that your music is acceptable in God's eyes and CCM is going to be cast into the lake of fire for declaring His name, but not meaning it.

 

Then it's settled, we should all become Amish

 

I wonder if they have an online store.

 

Become Amish? Only if Amish Rock comes standard.

 

Amish rock is fun...

Unfortunately...there's nothing to plug the amps into...

 

Here you go

As I walk through the valley where I harvest my grain
I take a look at my wife and realize she's very plain
But that's just perfect for an Amish like me
You know, I shun fancy things like electricity
At 4:30 in the morning I'm milkin' cows
Jebediah feeds the chickens and Jacob plows... fool
And I've been milkin' and plowin' so long that
Even Ezekiel thinks that my mind is gone
I'm a man of the land, I'm into discipline
Got a Bible in my hand and a beard on my chin
But if I finish all of my chores and you finish thine
Then tonight we're gonna party like it's 1699

We been spending most our lives
Living in an Amish paradise
I've churned butter once or twice
Living in an Amish paradise
It's hard work and sacrifice
Living in an Amish paradise
We sell quilts at discount price
Living in an Amish paradise

A local boy kicked me in the butt last week
I just smiled at him and turned the other cheek
I really don't care, in fact I wish him well
'Cause I'll be laughing my head off when he's burning in hell
But I ain't never punched a tourist even if he deserved it
An Amish with a 'tude? You know that's unheard of
I never wear buttons but I got a cool hat
And my homies all I agree I look good in black... fool
If you come to visit, you'll be bored to tears
We haven't even paid the phone bill in 300 years
But we ain't really quaint, so please don't point and stare
We're just technologically impaired

There's no phone, no lights, no motorcar
Not a single luxury
Like Robinson Caruso
It's as primitave as can be

We been spending most our lives
Living in an Amish paradise
We're just plain and simple guys
Living in an Amish paradise
There's no time for sin and vice
Living in an Amish paradise
We don't fight, we all play nice
Living in an Amish paradise

Hitchin' up the buggy, churnin' lots of butter
Raised a barn on Monday, soon I'll raise another
Think you're really rightous? Think you're pure in heart?
Well, I know I'm a million times as humble as thou art
I'm the pious guy the little Amlettes wanna be like
On my knees day and night scorin' points for the afterlife
So don't be vain and don't be whiny
Or else, my brother, I might just have to get medieval on your heinie

We been spending most our lives
Living in an Amish paradise
We're all crazy Mennonites
Living in an Amish paradise
There's no cops or traffic lights
Living in an Amish paradise
But you'd probably think it bites
Living in an Amish paradise

 

[satire] Well, boy you guys showed me....thanks!! [satire ended]

It changes nothing if the "foot starts a stompin' or the hips start a swaying before the heart starts a workin' then I question the music of whether it is Godly or not even so called hymns".

There have always been perversions of many 'Christians' to ascertain that God didn't say don't smoke or chew tobacco so I can do these things...this is your same logic on this matter. You ask for "a scriptural basis" for my belief and I provided it yet you immediately discredit it. How much more does God need to say it...be not conformed to this world...be not unequally yoked...come out from among them.

It is sad that 'modern day Christians' want a relationship with God that allows them to relate more to the world. Jesus' ministry showed that we can be in the world but not of the world...I question not your conviction but your distinction of this seperation. So if MTV starts to make an hour available on Sunday morning for a 'worship time' it is sad but many 'Christians' would probably condon this as "God's working" and I hate to tell you this but the Devil knows the Bible to and can manipulate it to justify anything we want.

In regards to Romans 12:2...the renewing of your mind causes a transformation which comes after the seperation. Content is very important I totally agree but why do you consider just the words as content why not the musical chords or the testimony or the appearance of the musician? Is this not part of the content?

PS. Please stay off the "don't shower" "don't eat Mcdonalds" "don't drive a car" or whatever you insult both of us with this idiotic logic...God wants us to be seperated from the ifluences of the world but he doesn't want us to be hermits.

 

MrCoon, that can just as easily be attributable to the heart of the listener. Didn't huge crowds follow Jesus? Didn't they shout "hosanna"? But they quit following...why? Because of a deficiency in Jesus' message? Of course not...it was because of a deficiency in their walk.

When we rock out to Crowder's "No One Like You" or reflect by singing "I Am Not Skilled to Understand" (very old and very new music), I cannot answer for the immature believer or lost person who "gets lost in the music." I guess they are about like the baptist deacon that sings "Victory in Jesus" and then goes out and treats his family like garbage...that is a heart problem, NOT a music problem.

You are using "Be not unequally yoked" out of context. How is singing modern music antithetical to "separation?" I see worldly men in 3-piece suits. I know worldly people that listen only to classical music. We have an arrogant racist pig in our church. He is hateful and vindictive. His fare? Southern gospel. WORLDLY is not about musical style...it is an attitude of the heart, that is reflected in what we do. And I hate to be blunt, but my hollister-wearing worship leader is one of the Godliest individuals I've ever met.

Now: since you brought it up...show me FROM SCRIPTURE how musical chords can be evil. Also, show me FROM SCRIPTURE about what constitutes "evil appearance." And, just for points of agreement...I'll give you modesty. We have that in our "worship leadership covenant" that all of our worship leaders must sign.

Yes, I do get exercised with this topic. We have seen, in my tenure here, over ninety students come to Christ. They didn't become Christians because of what songs we sung, but God used our worship of Him to draw others to Him. And please, please don't insinuate that our worship is not authentic or pleasing to God.

You are saying we should be separate. Granted. But you have yet to prove from scripture that the musical style is something we should separate from.

 

Here you go

As I walk through the valley where I harvest my grain
I take a look at my wife and realize she's very plain
But that's just perfect for an Amish like me
You know, I shun fancy things like electricity
At 4:30 in the morning I'm milkin' cows
Jebediah feeds the chickens and Jacob plows... fool
And I've been milkin' and plowin' so long that
Even Ezekiel thinks that my mind is gone
I'm a man of the land, I'm into discipline
Got a Bible in my hand and a beard on my chin
But if I finish all of my chores and you finish thine
Then tonight we're gonna party like it's 1699

We been spending most our lives
Living in an Amish paradise
I've churned butter once or twice
Living in an Amish paradise
It's hard work and sacrifice
Living in an Amish paradise
We sell quilts at discount price
Living in an Amish paradise

A local boy kicked me in the butt last week
I just smiled at him and turned the other cheek
I really don't care, in fact I wish him well
'Cause I'll be laughing my head off when he's burning in hell
But I ain't never punched a tourist even if he deserved it
An Amish with a 'tude? You know that's unheard of
I never wear buttons but I got a cool hat
And my homies all I agree I look good in black... fool
If you come to visit, you'll be bored to tears
We haven't even paid the phone bill in 300 years
But we ain't really quaint, so please don't point and stare
We're just technologically impaired

There's no phone, no lights, no motorcar
Not a single luxury
Like Robinson Caruso
It's as primitave as can be

We been spending most our lives
Living in an Amish paradise
We're just plain and simple guys
Living in an Amish paradise
There's no time for sin and vice
Living in an Amish paradise
We don't fight, we all play nice
Living in an Amish paradise

Hitchin' up the buggy, churnin' lots of butter
Raised a barn on Monday, soon I'll raise another
Think you're really rightous? Think you're pure in heart?
Well, I know I'm a million times as humble as thou art
I'm the pious guy the little Amlettes wanna be like
On my knees day and night scorin' points for the afterlife
So don't be vain and don't be whiny
Or else, my brother, I might just have to get medieval on your heinie

We been spending most our lives
Living in an Amish paradise
We're all crazy Mennonites
Living in an Amish paradise
There's no cops or traffic lights
Living in an Amish paradise
But you'd probably think it bites
Living in an Amish paradise </font>[/QUOTE] I love it!

 

MrCoon, that can just as easily be attributable to the heart of the listener. Didn't huge crowds follow Jesus? Didn't they shout "hosanna"? But they quit following...why? Because of a deficiency in Jesus' message? Of course not...it was because of a deficiency in their walk.

When we rock out to Crowder's "No One Like You" or reflect by singing "I Am Not Skilled to Understand" (very old and very new music), I cannot answer for the immature believer or lost person who "gets lost in the music." I guess they are about like the baptist deacon that sings "Victory in Jesus" and then goes out and treats his family like garbage...that is a heart problem, NOT a music problem.

You are using "Be not unequally yoked" out of context. How is singing modern music antithetical to "separation?" I see worldly men in 3-piece suits. I know worldly people that listen only to classical music. We have an arrogant racist pig in our church. He is hateful and vindictive. His fare? Southern gospel. WORLDLY is not about musical style...it is an attitude of the heart, that is reflected in what we do. And I hate to be blunt, but my hollister-wearing worship leader is one of the Godliest individuals I've ever met.

Now: since you brought it up...show me FROM SCRIPTURE how musical chords can be evil. Also, show me FROM SCRIPTURE about what constitutes "evil appearance." And, just for points of agreement...I'll give you modesty. We have that in our "worship leadership covenant" that all of our worship leaders must sign.

Yes, I do get exercised with this topic. We have seen, in my tenure here, over ninety students come to Christ. They didn't become Christians because of what songs we sung, but God used our worship of Him to draw others to Him. And please, please don't insinuate that our worship is not authentic or pleasing to God.

You are saying we should be separate. Granted. But you have yet to prove from scripture that the musical style is something we should separate from. </font>[/QUOTE]

 

A. Please take a look at the grammatical composition of Romans 12: 2And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. KJV As you can see when your mind is changed (to one of God) you obtain nonconformity not the other way around. You are transformed by the renewing of your mind; many heretical faiths “separate” themselves from this world, but they are no closer to God then the unsaved man.
B. If MTV showed an hour of solid Biblical teaching every week then yes I would say it’s great that people are being exposed to a strong gospel message, even if it’s just for a short period of time.
C. You may not like my analogy, but it is more then relevant and you didn’t answer the question. Instead of giving a rebuttal to my analogy, you gave an off topic assertion that discredits your earlier statements.
D. I assume because you didn’t answer my post because you either couldn’t or decided against it; either way that’s your choice.
E. I do consider the instruments part of the content. You have yet to prove why having a guitar, piano, harmonica, etc is wrong. By this standard one can sing CCM so long as no instruments (or only approved instruments) are involved.

 

Great post RBell.

 

I'm not asking for you to quote scripture, I'm asking for you to provide a list.

You said "Christian Rock and Roll is deceiving." What are the Christian rock and roll groups that are decieving. What about the other Chrisitan groups; Country, Pop, Jazz, Blues, Classical, Easy Listening, Gospel?

 

Brice I was going to post something about the ridiculous exegisis that is being performed on Romans 12 here in this thread... but you beat me to it.. Some are conformed to legalism, and their out of date opinions..

Christian Rock exists as much as Christian legalists exist.

Go ahead think on that statement for a while..
Can a person be a Christian and a Legalist?

What musical style does God approve of?
Bible proof please.
Either you have one, or you can not be a Baptist, because all Baptists base everything we believe on the Bible...
so admit it is your opinion... Nothing wrong with having an opinion unless you equate it with scripture.

 

You have already condemned each and every one by your blanket statement earlier. And, now you claim that you don't know each and every one. How can you make a judgement on what you don't know.

I agree only God knows and he knows us all. We all have our faults. Is having faults mean we are decievers?