Christians and the Law

[Mikey]

Examples?

The law definitely has its use in this age:

Romans 3:19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

ok how would you use it with Christians?

if a Christian is sinning, what do you use to show what they are doing is wrong?

 

[Mikey]

No, as the ceremonial/civil aspect of the law just was in use during the Old Covenant relationship between God and Israel!

Why do you believe that Civil and Ceremonial law are connected to Israel but the Moral Law is connected to us?

 

[John D. Wright]

It depends on what you mean by being under the law. We are not bound to any of the civil or ceremonial laws as they were directed specifically to the nation of Israel. I do believe the moral law of God is unchanging so what was moral in the old testament is moral today. The law though is there to show us we are unable to please God without the saving blood of Jesus Christ.

While I consider the principle that we should take a day of rest is a good one and God pleasing, I do not believe we as Christians are bound to any particular day as the Israelites were. So working seven days a week without ceasing is not good and likely is a sin, cutting the grass on Sunday afternoon though is not.

 

[John D. Wright]

Another deficiency of the Law as written not as it exists as God's Holy standard, is any written law is bound to be subverted by sinful man. We now have the Holy Spirit which guides and convicts us and leads us to follow not only the letter of the law but the spirit of the law. The Pharisees were very big on trying to define a very specific and exact letter of the law so that they could break the spirit but not the letter. For Christians we do not have that excuse. We answer to the Holy Spirit.

 

[Mikey]

It depends on what you mean by being under the law. .

I think this is exactly the issue. All Christians would agree that they should not do those things, It is the reasons why/motivation or how the law is used that is the issue

It depends on what you mean by being under the law. We are not bound to any of the civil or ceremonial laws as they were directed specifically to the nation of Israel. I do believe the moral law of God is unchanging so what was moral in the old testament is moral today. The law though is there to show us we are unable to please God without the saving blood of Jesus Christ.

While I consider the principle that we should take a day of rest is a good one and God pleasing, I do not believe we as Christians are bound to any particular day as the Israelites were. So working seven days a week without ceasing is not good and likely is a sin, cutting the grass on Sunday afternoon though is not.

why do you believe that only the Civil and Ceremonial laws were given to Israel only but the Moral law is universal?
what scriptural evidence is there that there was such a threefold distinction in the OT law?

I don't think it would be necessarily a sin if one worked consecutively for 7+ days. there are many reasons that one needs do this, eg emergency situation, But that it is beneficial one to have regular days off from work and should be the normal weekly practice.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

why do you believe that only the Civil and Ceremonial laws were given to Israel only but the Moral law is universal?
what scriptural evidence is there that there was such a threefold distinction in the OT law?

There is a ton of evidence. Start with the fact that the 10 Commandments (digest of the moral law) was written by God Himself (Deuteronomy 5:22), while the rest of the law was mediated to Moses by angels (Acts 7:53 etc).

There are also texts like Amos 5:21-24 which state that the sacrifices and ceremonies are unacceptable to God is the absence of moral righteousness.

 

[canadyjd]

If you believe the OT moral law is still "binding" on Christains, then you must believe the punishments associated with violating those laws are also in place.

If you pull into a church parking lot and they have big piles of rocks laying around, you will know where they stand on the issue.

 

[HankD]

Abandon hope all ye who enter here ...

Deuteronomy 27:26 Cursed be he that confirmeth not all the words of this law to do them. And all the people shall say, Amen.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

If you believe the OT moral law is still "binding" on Christains, then you must believe the punishments associated with violating those laws are also in place.

If you pull into a church parking lot and they have big piles of rocks laying around, you will know where they stand on the issue.

Er, no. The civil and judicial laws are fulfilled in Christ, as are the ceremonial and sacrificial laws. We imitate Christ and no longer stone adulterers but bid them repent (John 8:11).

 

[loDebar]

The Law was only intended for the Hebrews between Moses and Jesus to sustain the nation as a Holy People. Not Abraham , not us.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

Abandon hope all ye who enter here ...

Deuteronomy 27:26 Cursed be he that confirmeth not all the words of this law to do them. And all the people shall say, Amen.

Gal. 3:10. 'For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse, for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them." But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for, "the just shall live by faith."'

Note that the Holy Spirit does not say, "For as many as are of the law are under the curse." It is those who are 'of the works of the law' who are cursed. That is, those who try to work to gain their salvation are cursed because they can never do it.

But we are still to keep the Ten Commandments, not in order to be saved, but because we are saved, and God's law is written on our hearts (Psalm 40:8; Hebrews 8:10). It is our delight to keep God's righteous moral law and it grieves us when we fail to do so (Romans 22-25).

 

[HankD]

Gal. 3:10. 'For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse, for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them." But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for, "the just shall live by faith."'

Note that the Holy Spirit does not say, "For as many as are of the law are under the curse." It is those who are 'of the works of the law' who are cursed. That is, those who try to work to gain their salvation are cursed because they can never do it.

But we are still to keep the Ten Commandments, not in order to be saved, but because we are saved, and God's law is written on our hearts (Psalm 40:8; Hebrews 8:10). It is our delight to keep God's righteous moral law and it grieves us when we fail to do so (Romans 22-25).

Why stop at the ten? Keep it all or not at all.

Why do you need "commandments" ?

Do you need to command a sheep or a hog to stay out of the cesspool?

 

[Martin Marprelate]

Why stop at the ten? Keep it all or not at all.

God does not require me to abstain from prawn (shrimp) sandwiches (Mark 7:18-19). He does require me to abstain from idolatry (Exodus 20:4-5).

Why do you need "commandments" ?

Because I love Jesus (John 14:21).

Do you need to command a sheep or a hog to stay out of the cesspool?

It seems like you do (2 Peter 2:22). But let me ask you, why do you find His commandments burdensome (Matthew 11:30; 1 John 5:3)?

 

[Yeshua1]

I do not hold that the rules governing the Sabbath have been moved to the Sunday ( eg No work, No Leisure activities). I believe that a day should be set aside where Christians are able to worship together(this is commanded). That everyday man is to read/dwell on scripture/God.

In terms of the Moral law. As Christians we should attempt to do what pleases the law and not do what displeases him. the moral commands/right and wrong did not change when in the NT. Though in the NT the laws were expounded upon. (eg “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery. But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.)

the issue I have with NCT is the use of only the Law of Christ (NT) for there are commands that a Christian should still obey that are not restated - eg avoiding Incest.

But just obeying the law is not the priority, it is the two greatest commandments. “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart ... ‘Love your neighbour as yourself." that it is the motivation for keeping the commands that is important. That if you truly love God then by default you will obey.

Yes, we under theNC are now able to have the Sabbath day rest onto the Lord, and not in keeping all of the burndens Pharisees placed on it, but in spirit and in truth!
And the Moral law of God is still what God requires us to abide by, but not by trying our best to do that, but by submitting to jesus and the Holy Spirit to produce that in us now!

 

[Yeshua1]

Believers are not "under the law" as one is under the ruling of parents.

Believers are not lawless, either.

There are two great commandments that the Lord Jesus Christ gave, believers follow those two commandments.

Whaich would be including in the entire 10 Commandments of god....

 

[Yeshua1]

If you believe the OT moral law is still "binding" on Christains, then you must believe the punishments associated with violating those laws are also in place.

If you pull into a church parking lot and they have big piles of rocks laying around, you will know where they stand on the issue.

Not binding in how to get right with God, but once justified and reconciled, those would be how God expects us to live!

 

[Yeshua1]

God does not require me to abstain from prawn (shrimp) sandwiches (Mark 7:18-19). He does require me to abstain from idolatry (Exodus 20:4-5).

Because I love Jesus (John 14:21).

It seems like you do (2 Peter 2:22). But let me ask you, why do you find His commandments burdensome (Matthew 11:30; 1 John 5:3)?

"If you love me, keep My commandments"

 

[Yeshua1]

There is a ton of evidence. Start with the fact that the 10 Commandments (digest of the moral law) was written by God Himself (Deuteronomy 5:22), while the rest of the law was mediated to Moses by angels (Acts 7:53 etc).

There are also texts like Amos 5:21-24 which state that the sacrifices and ceremonies are unacceptable to God is the absence of moral righteousness.

The entire sacrifice system, and all of the feasts and festivals, pointed in types and shadows what the coming Messiah would do in order to reddem us.

 

[canadyjd]

Er, no. The civil and judicial laws are fulfilled in Christ, as are the ceremonial and sacrificial laws. We imitate Christ and no longer stone adulterers but bid them repent (John 8:11).

The question of the post says "binding" on Christians. Is the word "binding" used concerning the law outside of a legal obligation to keep the law?

 

[HankD]

God does not require me to abstain from prawn (shrimp) sandwiches (Mark 7:18-19). He does require me to abstain from idolatry (Exodus 20:4-5).

Because I love Jesus (John 14:21).

It seems like you do (2 Peter 2:22). But let me ask you, why do you find His commandments burdensome (Matthew 11:30; 1 John 5:3)?

Nevermind.