Compromisers Promoted At Bob Jones University

Yes and No, Yes and No

Both of these are rather broad generalizations.

There are moderating influences in both groups

It also depends on your definition of "Mainstream Christianity"

 

FoxRev:

For the sake of argument lets assume the my feeble elderly mind has forgotten my signing such a document.

Where are the other 25,000 graduates who have signed this document and why are they not calling out the apostacy you see rearing its ugly head. As the lone voice in the wilderness I think you should take it right to B3.

By the way, if my anonymity is an issue, I too have reason to be quiet about my identity. My brother and his wife work for BJU, two of my nephews are in the University, one in the academy and one in the elementary school. They have something to lose, I do not.

 

I think people on both sides would be very surprised to find this out. From your postings here, it appears that you have moved into a category of extreme fundamentalism (which is not true fundamentalism) and have now attempted to impose your own views on BJU and BJIII. I still find that unacceptable and without scriptural merit. If you are going to be loyal to Scripture, then you should base your arguments on Scripture. I have seen very little evidence of that here.

 

This statement befuddles me. Is there some kind of BJ "Hit Squad" that sabatoges the homes and churches of people who oppose "the cause?" How exactly does BJIII "rub out" people? Seems to me the only problem he can cause is to forbid you from working for the University, speaking in chapel, or visiting the campus. If you believe they are wrong, why would you care anyway? It would be like Wheaton banning me from their campus- Not going to change my life in any way!

Help me understand this.

 

It seems to me that the ones who fear BJIII are the ones like foxrev. They want their opinion to be taken seriously, but then fail to give adequate support or fail to give liberty and then complain about things.

I don't fear BJIII in the least. He has no power over me and can't do a thing to me. In fact, he would probably grant me the charity to disagree with him on these various issues. I like the man, but I think he is misguided on a number of issues. I am not worried about getting "rubbed out."

These are common scare tactics to try to persuade others and change opinion based on outrageous statements. The reality is that we can disagree on who ought to be speaking on the platform and what the various rules ought to be. And there is a realm of acceptability that doesn't match my personal standards. Foxrev hasn't gotten to the place of realizing that yet. I disagree with BJII on many people he has to speak. But he doesn't answer to me for that. Nor does he answer to foxrev for it. He will answer to God for that.

 

The pastor friend, who I mentioned earlier in this discussion, who had brought similar charges against BJIII about 10 years ago and preached against the university at a Bible conference in MD, had his lifetime membership in the alumni association revoked.

My understanding is that they returned a prorated portion of the funds spent on getting the lifetime membership.

Andy

 

And that is "rubbing out"??? I didn't see any pastor friend that you mentioned earlier in this discussion. But people who openly attack organizations should not be members of organizations that support them. Sounds to me like the guy was inconsistent. If he thought BJU was such a compromiser for not separating, why didn't he separate from them? Sounds like perhaps BJU was the more fundamental of the two, since they practiced separation.

But who cares ... The Alumni Association means nothing and does nothing.

The fact remains that BJIII can't "rub out" anyone.

 

Check out my first post on page three of this thread.

But, hey, I agree with you. I think BJU did the right thing -- I only thought it was funny how they handled the lifetime membership issue!

We'll have to wait for foxrev to respond to his over-the-top "rubbing out" comment.

Andy

 

But not hostile, either. And I have always appreciated that about your posts.

Andy

 

If you are a student and you inadvertantly disagree with BJU, they will rub you out!

One semester before graduating I was denied reenrollment because I applied to DTS.

No joke!

Of course, the network that supports BJU looks to BJUIII as the pope. They don't admit this, but is you have a question, they will tell you they need to look into it. That means, let me check with BJU and get back to you.

So, yes, in some "sense" of the word, those who disagree with BJU can get rubbed out of their network of independent fundamentalists by BJU.

For those of us who just move on, fine. But what if you don't want to move on or out of your network? Apparently this is Foxrev's dilemma. And Foxrev is right about one thing. Preacher boys were told to confront whoever was in authority if they thought the school was drifting.

Now obviously, I disagree with the ramifications of BJU drifting to the mainstream of evangelical Christianity, but based on my experience at BJU, Foxrev is "supposed" to call attention to it, according to what we were taught.

What a stupid school, and not for the same reasons Foxrev would call it stupid.

 

Actually, I am more afraid of a "secondary rub-out." For associating with me, an unseparated Southern Baptist who listens to CCM, I don't want to have my brother and his family send packing from BJU.

This is a fact, my brother-in-law and his wife were on staff at BJU. He got an offer of another job in March prior to the contract year running out in June. He gave them three months notice he would not be renewing his contract. They gave him 24 hours to vacate his home (or is that BJU's rental house). I've seen it in action...it ain't pretty.

 

Exactly! You think you are doing the right thing by notifying them of your intents, and they rub you out.

Secondary rub-out is very real, as well.

If BJU puts the word out not to fellowship with Foxrev, what do you think will happen to Foxrev within his network of friends (fundamentalists)?

Autonomous churches, yes, but hardly independent. There network (fellowship, association) is stronger than most denominations I know, because it is based on towing the line.

 

This illustrates what I am saying. If BJU is such a "terrible place," whether for slipping into new evangeliclalism, enforcing unusual and unreasonable degrees of loyalty, or because you don't like their beige-colored brick buildings... isn't it a good thing to be "rubbed out" of their network? If your reasoning is sound, reasonable people will certainly understand and appreciate your stand, and only "blind BJ loyalists" will ostracize you. The situation 2atlow8 decribes sounds bad, I'll grant you. But again, if it is as bad as you describe, isn't that severing of ties a good thing in the long run?

I marvel at this seeming perception of fear of being "rubbing out." If you are governed by Biblical convictions, why does it matter what your former classmates, your alumni's president, or your third grade teacher thinks about you? Isn't there something some evangelist of years gone by used to say... "Do right 'till the stars fall"? Who was that, anyway?

 

Because it is your tradition, group, upbringing, network, support group, etc.

Most importantly, it was seen as true Christianity. Not to be in, is to be OUT! And that's not good.

If you freely leave, you are turning your back on God and God's will. If you become suspect, they throw you out.

Greg, you are right. We shouldn't fear it. But if you grew up admiring Dr. Bob III and BJU, and admiring is to soft of a word, and you get ostracized, it can be incredibly damaging to those persons.

I didn't grow up that way. When I saw through BJU, I was just biding my time. When they cut me off, I said thank you and moved on to Grace College (that wicked new-evangelical school in IN).

But pity the poor lad who grew up hearing BJU this and Dr. Bob, II and III, that. And we are the only true Christians, and we are the only ones going to heaven, and every one else is compromising and apostate, etc.

It is so cultic that to leave is to be outside the fellowship of true Christians.