Conservatives Are More Than Twice as Likely as Liberals to Be Strongly Patriotic

[poncho]

Poncho, something that bothers me about your posts is that you seem to think that if someone disagrees with your political views, they hate America and are part of some kind of conspiracy. I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I do get that impression from your posts. Don't you think people can be sincerely wrong?

Yes I do but not all the time and not always to the detriment of these United States. From the earliest days of human history there has always been an elite class that dreamed and schemed to enslave everyone else. Just like rulers have always used false flag operations to control populations.

Conspiracy theories? No it's just plain ole history. Learn it. Does that mean I think people who have forgotten this history hate the USA? No it just means they aren't being very good citizens and in so doing are helping the eilte class to finally realize their dream, imho.

 

[jaigner]

I had the same experience last Sunday.

I bet they are all so proud to have you serving as their minister of music being on such a higher spiritual plane than the rest of the congregation. I'm surprised that you would stoop so low as to serve people who would dare to say the Pledge of Allegiance in a church service. If they were on the same level as you they would know better. Shame on them for being so spiritually ignorant. Hopefully you taught them a lesson by your excellent example.

By the way, we had a patriotic ceremony before the start of the church service where the Boy Scouts posted the colors, a member read an excerpt from the Declaration of Independence, we sang the National Anthem, and had a special prayer of thanksgiving to God for our country. Then we began the worship service and I preached on the "Qualifications for Hell" from Revelation 21.

Sweet mercy.

Did I say I was on a higher plane? No, I just disagree.

I don't think country worship has any place in the life of the believer, and it certainly doesn't need to be in church. If someone pledges allegiance outside of corporate worship, that is their choice and is an issue of conscience.

And I didn't do anything to stand out or prove a point. My actions were not to draw attention toward myself or done with an air of condescension.

I just am of the conviction that it is not appropriate to say the pledge, as my allegiance is elsewhere.

And doing it in corporate worship, I believe, is horrific.

So your sarcasm is not appropriate, nor is it particularly amusing.

 

[jaigner]

If it is wrong for a Christian to pledge allegiance to the flag in church, then why would it be OK outside of church?

Is this how a Christian's life is supposed to be, we act one way in church, and act another way outside?

I believe that, outside of corporate worship, pledging allegiance to an earthly kingdom is a matter of conscience.

Inside corporate worship, I believe it has no place regardless, because if the focus is taken off Christ, worship cannot be Christian by definition.

 

[jaigner]

Brother, you might be surprised. But, I'll have to admit the supposed anonymity does allow for a more sarcastic approach.

Honestly, if I served with a music minister who refused to participate based on arrogant misguided principals I would move for his dismissal.

This is unbelievable. I did not draw attention to myself, but it's just not something that I can do with a clear conscience. Why in the world would I have to agree with you on this?

This is a personal conviction, not arrogance. Pledging allegiance to the flag is putting country, an earthly kingdom at the center of worship. And if the country is at the center of worship, it ceases to be Christian.

I am a thoughtful person. My background is in theology, so in a corporate worship service, I try to examine every element theologically with much prayer and thought. It's not about arrogance.

 

[StefanM]

Brother, you might be surprised. But, I'll have to admit the supposed anonymity does allow for a more sarcastic approach.

Honestly, if I served with a music minister who refused to participate based on arrogant misguided principals I would move for his dismissal.

And if a pastor did such to the music minister in my church, I would move for his dismissal as well.

 

[StefanM]

This is unbelievable. I did not draw attention to myself, but it's just not something that I can do with a clear conscience. Why in the world would I have to agree with you on this?

Papal infallibility.

(oh wait, we are Baptists...)

 

[jaigner]

And if a pastor did such to the music minister in my church, I would move for his dismissal as well.

Cha-ching!!!

 

[jaigner]

Papal infallibility.

(oh wait, we are Baptists...)

No joke. I don't usually get so worked up about weird stuff people say on here, but man...

 

[Revmitchell]

Honestly, if I served with a music minister who refused to participate based on arrogant misguided principals I would move for his dismissal.

As would I......

 

[FR7 Baptist]

As would I......

What if your church got angry and voted you out?

 

[jaigner]

Again, this in no way makes me arrogant. In fact, I did my best to not stick out. There is nothing misguided or arrogant about this belief, and if my conviction ever changes, I will change. This is just how I believe now.

 

[Revmitchell]

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