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Daniel 8:10-12
- Thread starter vooks
- Start date
vooks
Active Member
BobRyan, One Baptist,
Daniel 8:11-12 (KJV)
Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of his sanctuary was cast down. 12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.
and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away
Who takes away the daily/continual sacrifice?
A. Jesus
B. The little horn
C. I don't know
Daniel 8:11-12 (KJV)
Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of his sanctuary was cast down. 12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.
and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away
Who takes away the daily/continual sacrifice?
A. Jesus
B. The little horn
C. I don't know
vooks
Active Member
Daniel 8:13-14 (KJV)
Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot? 14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.
Hi BobRyan, am still waiting
Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot? 14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.
Hi BobRyan, am still waiting
vooks
Active Member
Daniel 8:11-14 (ESV)
11 It became great, even as great as the Prince of the host. And the regular burnt offering was taken away from him, and the place of his sanctuary was overthrown. 12 And a host will be given over to it together with the regular burnt offering because of transgression, and it will throw truth to the ground, and it will act and prosper. 13 Then I heard a holy one speaking, and another holy one said to the one who spoke, “For how long is the vision concerning the regular burnt offering, the transgression that makes desolate, and the giving over of the sanctuary and host to be trampled underfoot?” 14 And he said to me, “For 2,300 evenings and mornings. Then the sanctuary shall be restored to its rightful state
Can somebody help me understand how the sanctuary of verse 11 is different from that of verse 14, yet verse 14 is an interpretation or explanation of v11
Wait, here comes Ministry Magazine, October 1980 to the rescue
What on earth is 'verbal link'?
11 It became great, even as great as the Prince of the host. And the regular burnt offering was taken away from him, and the place of his sanctuary was overthrown. 12 And a host will be given over to it together with the regular burnt offering because of transgression, and it will throw truth to the ground, and it will act and prosper. 13 Then I heard a holy one speaking, and another holy one said to the one who spoke, “For how long is the vision concerning the regular burnt offering, the transgression that makes desolate, and the giving over of the sanctuary and host to be trampled underfoot?” 14 And he said to me, “For 2,300 evenings and mornings. Then the sanctuary shall be restored to its rightful state
Can somebody help me understand how the sanctuary of verse 11 is different from that of verse 14, yet verse 14 is an interpretation or explanation of v11
Wait, here comes Ministry Magazine, October 1980 to the rescue
What on earth is 'verbal link'?
Last edited by a moderator:
TrevorL
Member
Greetings again vooks,
Sorry for the delay in responding.
The vision as a whole speaks of the supremacy of the Grecian/Roman powers over Judah and Jerusalem for 2300 days and this is interpreted as 2300 years. The Battles of Issus and Granicus brought Alexander, the Goat, to power when he defeated the Medo-Persian power, the Ram. This occurred in BC333-334 and adding 2300 years to this 1967 when the Jews liberated Jerusalem. This is the start of cleansing Jerusalem of the Gentile ascendancy so that the Temple can be rebuilt at the return of Jesus as depicted in Isaiah 2:1-5, Micah 4:1-8, Zechariah 14.
Kind regards
Trevor
Sorry for the delay in responding.
Not sure what you are asking concerning “this”. The development of the little horn if initially Pagan Rome started when one of the kings in a Province in Asia Minor bequeathed his territory to the Romans, and then the Romans gradually took over adjacent territories and later invaded the Middle East.
The vision as a whole speaks of the supremacy of the Grecian/Roman powers over Judah and Jerusalem for 2300 days and this is interpreted as 2300 years. The Battles of Issus and Granicus brought Alexander, the Goat, to power when he defeated the Medo-Persian power, the Ram. This occurred in BC333-334 and adding 2300 years to this 1967 when the Jews liberated Jerusalem. This is the start of cleansing Jerusalem of the Gentile ascendancy so that the Temple can be rebuilt at the return of Jesus as depicted in Isaiah 2:1-5, Micah 4:1-8, Zechariah 14.
Kind regards
Trevor
TrevorL
Member
Greetings again vooks,
I would like to reinforce my previous Post concerning the explanation of the 2300 days of Daniel 8.
Daniel 8:9-14 (KJV): 9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land. 10 And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them. 11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of his sanctuary was cast down. 12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered. 13 Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot? 14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.
The following words of Jesus help to interpret the above, and note the similarity of the underlined words and especially the words in bold in Daniel 8 and Luke 21:
Luke 21:20-24 (KJV): 20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. 21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. 22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. 24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
Daniel 8 uses the term “sanctuary” while Luke 21 uses “Jerusalem”, and both use the phrase “trodden down”.
Daniel 8 uses the term “2300 days”. Luke 21 uses “the times of the Gentiles” and this appears to be a longer period than the 2300 days as the times of the Gentiles started with Nebuchadnezzar’s conquest of Jerusalem and will end when Jesus overthrows the Gentiles that will yet invade Jerusalem as mentioned in Ezekiel 38.
Thus Jesus is applying Daniel 8 to the events of AD70 and also speaking of the eventual restoration of Jerusalem and the worship that shall be centred there Isaiah 2:1-5, Micah 4:1-8, Zechariah 14.
Kind regards
Trevor
I would like to reinforce my previous Post concerning the explanation of the 2300 days of Daniel 8.
Daniel 8:9-14 (KJV): 9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land. 10 And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them. 11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of his sanctuary was cast down. 12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered. 13 Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot? 14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.
The following words of Jesus help to interpret the above, and note the similarity of the underlined words and especially the words in bold in Daniel 8 and Luke 21:
Luke 21:20-24 (KJV): 20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. 21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. 22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. 24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
Daniel 8 uses the term “sanctuary” while Luke 21 uses “Jerusalem”, and both use the phrase “trodden down”.
Daniel 8 uses the term “2300 days”. Luke 21 uses “the times of the Gentiles” and this appears to be a longer period than the 2300 days as the times of the Gentiles started with Nebuchadnezzar’s conquest of Jerusalem and will end when Jesus overthrows the Gentiles that will yet invade Jerusalem as mentioned in Ezekiel 38.
Thus Jesus is applying Daniel 8 to the events of AD70 and also speaking of the eventual restoration of Jerusalem and the worship that shall be centred there Isaiah 2:1-5, Micah 4:1-8, Zechariah 14.
Kind regards
Trevor
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
The question in 8:13 is "how long is the vision" that is how long a period of time does the vision cover - from the time when Medo-Persia is already esteablished and dominant - to a time after the Greek empire has divided into 4 kingdoms and a little horn power arises out of the territory of the Greek Empire -- that by comparison to both Persia and Greece is "exceedingly great".
That is more than 2300 literal days.
Two rules for prophetic interpretation
1. The Historicist Protestant rule - And in Apocalyptic writing - timelines always use day-for-year as we see in Dan 9 and the 70 weeks .
2. All timelines in the bible - whether they use day-for-year or literal - are contiguous. So with the 1260 years of Dan 7, and with the 2300 years of Dan 8 and with the 490 years of Dan 9.
in Christ,
Bob
TrevorL
Member
Greetings Bob,
I hold a different view of the 2300 days than that held by the SDAs and I assume that this is your view. I have a tentative view of starting the 2300 days at three distinct times and with three distinct conclusions, a sliding fulfillment.
But the principal evident fulfillment is that the 2300 days starts with the prominent event in this prophecy, the overthrow of the Ram by the He-Goat in BC 334-333 and this then corresponds with the retaking of Jerusalem by the Jews in 1967 in the 6-Day War. The link between Daniel 8:13-14 and Luke 21:20-24 is ignored by the SDAs, despite the fact that this is an obvious allusion and exposition by the Lord Jesus Christ.
Also note that the 2300 days speaks of down-treading, but the Medo-Persian power DID NOT down tread the Holy Land and Jerusalem. Rather they were instrumental in restoring the Jews to their land, rebuilding both Jerusalem and the Temple. It is only the period of dominance of the Grecian and the Roman Powers of the Holy Land that the term “trodden under foot” can be applied.
The other reason why the SDA view cannot be accepted is that they see no immediate future for restoration of worship in literal Jerusalem at the coming of Jesus, but they believe in the destruction and burning of all things on the earth for the 1000 years. The SDAs ignore the simple teaching of Isaiah 2:1-5, Micah 4:1-8, Zechariah 14 and Acts 3:19-21.
Kind regards
Trevor
Daniel 8:13-14 (KJV): 13 Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot? 14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.
I hold a different view of the 2300 days than that held by the SDAs and I assume that this is your view. I have a tentative view of starting the 2300 days at three distinct times and with three distinct conclusions, a sliding fulfillment.
But the principal evident fulfillment is that the 2300 days starts with the prominent event in this prophecy, the overthrow of the Ram by the He-Goat in BC 334-333 and this then corresponds with the retaking of Jerusalem by the Jews in 1967 in the 6-Day War. The link between Daniel 8:13-14 and Luke 21:20-24 is ignored by the SDAs, despite the fact that this is an obvious allusion and exposition by the Lord Jesus Christ.
Also note that the 2300 days speaks of down-treading, but the Medo-Persian power DID NOT down tread the Holy Land and Jerusalem. Rather they were instrumental in restoring the Jews to their land, rebuilding both Jerusalem and the Temple. It is only the period of dominance of the Grecian and the Roman Powers of the Holy Land that the term “trodden under foot” can be applied.
The other reason why the SDA view cannot be accepted is that they see no immediate future for restoration of worship in literal Jerusalem at the coming of Jesus, but they believe in the destruction and burning of all things on the earth for the 1000 years. The SDAs ignore the simple teaching of Isaiah 2:1-5, Micah 4:1-8, Zechariah 14 and Acts 3:19-21.
Kind regards
Trevor
TrevorL
Member
Greetings again vooks and Bob,
Another feature of Daniel 8 that is important to attempt to identify correctly is the representative of the little horn of the goat at the time of Christ’s return.
Daniel 8:25 (KJV): And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.
The ealier part of v25 is often considered to be the Papacy and this is reinforced by associating this with Daniel 11:36-39 and this in turn is considered to be associated with the development of the Man of Sin in 2 Thessalonians 2:3-12.
My present understanding of this is that the intervening period may be speaking in part concerning the Papacy, but I believe that Daniel 7 is speaking of the Roman Empire with the focus on the Western portion and then the development of the Papacy, while Daniel 8 speaks of the little horn of the Goat representing the Roman Empire with the focus on the Eastern portion. In the last days one is mother is more military.
This appears to be the correct view because of the following detail is best understood as an expansion of the second part of Daniel 8:25.
Daniel 11:40-45 (KJV): 40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over. 41 He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon. 42 He shall stretch forth his hand also upon the countries: and the land of Egypt shall not escape. 43 But he shall have power over the treasures of gold and of silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt: and the Libyans and the Ethiopians shall be at his steps. 44 But tidings out of the east and out of the north shall trouble him: therefore he shall go forth with great fury to destroy, and utterly to make away many. 45 And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him.
Daniel 8:25 (KJV): he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.
Both passages speak of the destruction of this Power, and Daniel 11:40-45 indicate that unlike Daniel 7 this Power is a military Power, that has assumed the Role of the King of the North. Daniel 11:40-45 can thus be aligned with Ezekiel 38 that also speaks of a military confedacy headed up by Power whose origin is from the North of the Land, coming down into the Holy Land and then being destroyed by Divine intervention.
I am not aware of how the SDAs consider Daniel 11:40-45, but I do not think that they would see any real significance in future events concerning the Holy Land. They dismiss the idea that Christ will intervene to save the Nation of Israel and then convert them and establish Divine Worship centred in Jerusalem as detailed in Ezekiel 38-40, Isaiah 2:1-5, Micah 4:1-8, Zechariah 14 and Acts 3:19-21. My personal understanding is that Russia will assume the role of the King of the North and will be backed militarily by Europe and endorsed by the Papacy when they invade the Middle East.
Kind regards
Trevor
Another feature of Daniel 8 that is important to attempt to identify correctly is the representative of the little horn of the goat at the time of Christ’s return.
Daniel 8:25 (KJV): And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.
The ealier part of v25 is often considered to be the Papacy and this is reinforced by associating this with Daniel 11:36-39 and this in turn is considered to be associated with the development of the Man of Sin in 2 Thessalonians 2:3-12.
My present understanding of this is that the intervening period may be speaking in part concerning the Papacy, but I believe that Daniel 7 is speaking of the Roman Empire with the focus on the Western portion and then the development of the Papacy, while Daniel 8 speaks of the little horn of the Goat representing the Roman Empire with the focus on the Eastern portion. In the last days one is mother is more military.
This appears to be the correct view because of the following detail is best understood as an expansion of the second part of Daniel 8:25.
Daniel 11:40-45 (KJV): 40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over. 41 He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon. 42 He shall stretch forth his hand also upon the countries: and the land of Egypt shall not escape. 43 But he shall have power over the treasures of gold and of silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt: and the Libyans and the Ethiopians shall be at his steps. 44 But tidings out of the east and out of the north shall trouble him: therefore he shall go forth with great fury to destroy, and utterly to make away many. 45 And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him.
Daniel 8:25 (KJV): he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.
Both passages speak of the destruction of this Power, and Daniel 11:40-45 indicate that unlike Daniel 7 this Power is a military Power, that has assumed the Role of the King of the North. Daniel 11:40-45 can thus be aligned with Ezekiel 38 that also speaks of a military confedacy headed up by Power whose origin is from the North of the Land, coming down into the Holy Land and then being destroyed by Divine intervention.
I am not aware of how the SDAs consider Daniel 11:40-45, but I do not think that they would see any real significance in future events concerning the Holy Land. They dismiss the idea that Christ will intervene to save the Nation of Israel and then convert them and establish Divine Worship centred in Jerusalem as detailed in Ezekiel 38-40, Isaiah 2:1-5, Micah 4:1-8, Zechariah 14 and Acts 3:19-21. My personal understanding is that Russia will assume the role of the King of the North and will be backed militarily by Europe and endorsed by the Papacy when they invade the Middle East.
Kind regards
Trevor
TrevorL
Member
Greetings again vooks and Bob,
Reviewing my Post yesterday I realised that I had made some errors in editing. What I was trying to say was:
I believe that Daniel 7 is speaking of the Roman Empire with the focus on the Western portion and then the development of the Papacy, while Daniel 8 speaks of the Little Horn of the Goat representing the Roman Empire with the focus on the Eastern portion. In the last days one is mainly a religious power while the other is mainly a military power.
I believe that the Little Horn of Daniel 7 is the Papacy and the latter-day Little Horn of the Goat will be assumed by Russia when she sweeps down and takes Turkey, the final stage of the drying of the Euphrates River or Power. Then after some time Russia and its confederacy will invade the Middle East, bringing on the Battle of Armageddon. Thus these two horns are incipiently represented by Pope Francis and Putin. It is significant that today, June 10th Pope Francis and Putin are scheduled to meet at the Vatican, and the Associated Press on June 4th stated that high on the agenda should be the troubles in Ukraine and Syria. Both these leaders may be ambitious to eventually reunite the Western and Eastern portions of the Roman Empire, politically, economically, militarily and in religion. This appears to be the events depicted by the image of Daniel 2 at the time when the stone hits the image upon the feet. At that time, not 1000 years later as claimed by the SDAs, Christ will replace the Kingdoms of men with the Kingdom of God and rule over the nations from the Throne of David in Jerusalem for the 1000 years.
I do not know how the above details sit with SDAs today. My own experience in my early 20s, nearly 50 years ago, was with a senior SDA who stated that he could not understand why God had given Zechariah 14 as it did not fit in with his understanding of prophecy. A few years later a SDA Pastor with another SDA visited my home and their response was that many or most of the prophecies would have been fulfilled if Israel had not rejected Jesus, and thus they will never be fulfilled. The context of Zechariah 14 is the rejection and crucifixion of Jesus by the Jews as Zechariah 13 speaks of the wounds in Jesus’ hands and the smiting of the Shepherd. Zechariah 14 is the final outcome of God’s intervention and subjugation of the nations and conversion and restoration of the Jews and true worship in Jerusalem.
Also I am uncertain if these things are considered by Baptists and if they have firm ideas on prophecy. Similar to the SDAs, their emphasis is on heaven going at death or as per SDA at the return of Jesus. My impression is that there are many schools of thought amongst the Baptists, and possibly one of these views held by many Baptists is that when the OT speaks of Israel it is speaking of the Gentile Church. In other words, they do not have any real understanding of the detail of these prophecies.
Kind regards
Trevor
Reviewing my Post yesterday I realised that I had made some errors in editing. What I was trying to say was:
I believe that Daniel 7 is speaking of the Roman Empire with the focus on the Western portion and then the development of the Papacy, while Daniel 8 speaks of the Little Horn of the Goat representing the Roman Empire with the focus on the Eastern portion. In the last days one is mainly a religious power while the other is mainly a military power.
I believe that the Little Horn of Daniel 7 is the Papacy and the latter-day Little Horn of the Goat will be assumed by Russia when she sweeps down and takes Turkey, the final stage of the drying of the Euphrates River or Power. Then after some time Russia and its confederacy will invade the Middle East, bringing on the Battle of Armageddon. Thus these two horns are incipiently represented by Pope Francis and Putin. It is significant that today, June 10th Pope Francis and Putin are scheduled to meet at the Vatican, and the Associated Press on June 4th stated that high on the agenda should be the troubles in Ukraine and Syria. Both these leaders may be ambitious to eventually reunite the Western and Eastern portions of the Roman Empire, politically, economically, militarily and in religion. This appears to be the events depicted by the image of Daniel 2 at the time when the stone hits the image upon the feet. At that time, not 1000 years later as claimed by the SDAs, Christ will replace the Kingdoms of men with the Kingdom of God and rule over the nations from the Throne of David in Jerusalem for the 1000 years.
I do not know how the above details sit with SDAs today. My own experience in my early 20s, nearly 50 years ago, was with a senior SDA who stated that he could not understand why God had given Zechariah 14 as it did not fit in with his understanding of prophecy. A few years later a SDA Pastor with another SDA visited my home and their response was that many or most of the prophecies would have been fulfilled if Israel had not rejected Jesus, and thus they will never be fulfilled. The context of Zechariah 14 is the rejection and crucifixion of Jesus by the Jews as Zechariah 13 speaks of the wounds in Jesus’ hands and the smiting of the Shepherd. Zechariah 14 is the final outcome of God’s intervention and subjugation of the nations and conversion and restoration of the Jews and true worship in Jerusalem.
Also I am uncertain if these things are considered by Baptists and if they have firm ideas on prophecy. Similar to the SDAs, their emphasis is on heaven going at death or as per SDA at the return of Jesus. My impression is that there are many schools of thought amongst the Baptists, and possibly one of these views held by many Baptists is that when the OT speaks of Israel it is speaking of the Gentile Church. In other words, they do not have any real understanding of the detail of these prophecies.
Kind regards
Trevor
vooks
Active Member
Daniel 8:13 (KJV)
Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?
BobRyan,
The 'vision concerning the daily sacrifice' is the subject of HOW LONG. It had a definite starting point. Could you kindly share with us when it started?
Cc TrevorL
Sabbath or Lord's Day
I know this is off Topic, but Bob Ryan initiated the subject.
In the word of God the purpose of the Law is to show man his sin and doom without Jesus Christ (Galatians 2:16). The Law was to drive us to Christ (Galatians 3:16, 19-26). No one has ever been saved by keeping the Law, nor ever will be. Jesus Christ kept it for us, if we will receive it! All the Old Testament saints were saved not by law keeping, but by faith in the coming Christ (Romans 4; Hebrews 11). They looked forward to Him and we look back.
James 2:10: "For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all."
Romans 3:19-26: "Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. 20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall NO FLESH be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin. 21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: 23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; 24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; 26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus."
Most Sabbath keepers are depending on their keeping of the Sabbath to get them into heaven. It will not. Only Jesus Christ can do that. Period!
The saved in Christ, both the New and Old Testament saints, will keep the Sabbath perfectly during the Millennial Sabbath, which is the ultimate Sabbath of all Sabbaths, and then comes "the eighth day," eternity, which is symbolized by "the Lord's Day."
Just as we look to the founders of America to define the meanings of the words of our Nations founding documents, we likewise look to the Bible and the generations trained by Jesus and His apostles to define terms for us. Pay attention to the disciples of the apostles:
Ignatius (35-117 AD): Like Polycarp, Ignatius was a disciple of the Apostle John. Ignatius was the Pastor of the Church of Antioch. He wrote to the Magnesians in Greece sometime between 110-117 AD. We read:
"If, therefore, those who were brought up in the ancient order of things have come to the possession of a new hope, no longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord's Day, on which also our life has sprung up again by Him and by His death-whom some deny, by which mystery we have obtained faith, and therefore endure, that we may be found the disciples of Jesus Christ ..." (Epistle of Ignatius to the Magnesians, Chapter 9)
Irenaeus (115-202 AD): In the writings of Irenaeus, who was a disciple of Polycarp (70-156 AD), who was a disciple of the Apostle John, we also find mention of "the first day of the week" as the Lord's day. Around 178 AD Irenaeus wrote:
"The mystery of the Lord's resurrection may not be celebrated on any other day than the Lord's day and on this alone should we observe the breaking of the Paschal Fast." (Warren, Samuel E., The Sunday Question, p. 87, 1890; Eusebius, Church History, Bk. V, ch. 24; & Dake’s Annotated Reference Bible, p. 191)
"Pentecost fell on the first day of the week, and was therefore associated with the Lord's day." (Etienne, Augustin D., Sunday Worship, p. 41, March 9, 2009)
Hippolytus (170–235 AD): Hippolytus was a disciple of Irenaeus. He was the Pastor of Portus near Rome. He wrote this concerning the Lord's Supper:
"On the first day of the week the bishop, if possible, shall deliver the oblation to all the people with his own hand, while the deacons break the bread [Acts 20:7]." (Hippolytus. The Apostolic Tradition of Hippolytus; Gregory Dix, The Treatise on the Apostolic Tradition of St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr. London: Alban Press, 1992)
Epistle of Barnabas (written between 70 & 132 AD): This Barnabas may be by the Apostle Paul's companion. It says:
"If my sons shall keep my sabbath, then will I place my mercy upon them. He speaketh, too, of the sabbath in the beginning of the creation: And God made in six days the works of his hands, and finished them on the seventh day, and rested in it and sanctified it. Consider, my children, what signify the words, He finished them in six days. They mean this: that in six thousand years the Lord will make an end of all things, for a day is with him as a thousand years [Ps. 90:4]. And he himself beareth witness unto me, saying: Behold this day a day shall be as a thousand years. Therefore, my children, in six days, that is in six thousand years, shall all things be brought to an end [2 Pet. 3:8-13]. And the words, He rested on the seventh day [Gen.2:2], signify this: After that his Son hath come, and hath caused to cease the time of the wicked one, and hath judged the ungodly, and changed the sun and the moon and the stars [Ps. 102:25-26], then shall he rest well on the seventh day [Rev. 20:1-6]. And further he saith, Thou shall sanctify it with pure hands and a pure heart [Ps. 24:1-5]. Who, therefore, can sanctify the day which the Lord hath sanctified, unless he be pure of heart? in all things have we been deceived. Behold, that then indeed we shall be able to rest well and sanctify; even when we ourselves, having been justified, and having received the promise, when iniquity exists no longer, but all things have been made new by the Lord. we shall then be able to sanctify it, having been first sanctified ourselves. And, further, he saith unto them, Your new moons and your sabbaths I cannot endure [Isa. 1:13]. See, now, what he meaneth. The sabbaths, that now are, are not acceptable unto me, but that which I have made is, even that in which, after that I have brought all things to an end [Rev. 20:7-15], I shall make a beginning of the eighth day, which thing is the beginning of another world [Rev. 21:3-5]. Wherefore we keep the eighth day as a day of gladness, on which also Jesus rose from the dead, and after he had appeared ascended unto heaven."
Both Barnabas and Tertullian speak of Isaiah 1:13 where God says:
"Bring no more vain oblations; incense is an abomination unto me; the new moons and sabbaths, the calling of assemblies, I cannot away with; it is iniquity, even the solemn meeting."
Hope this is helpful!
I know this is off Topic, but Bob Ryan initiated the subject.
In the word of God the purpose of the Law is to show man his sin and doom without Jesus Christ (Galatians 2:16). The Law was to drive us to Christ (Galatians 3:16, 19-26). No one has ever been saved by keeping the Law, nor ever will be. Jesus Christ kept it for us, if we will receive it! All the Old Testament saints were saved not by law keeping, but by faith in the coming Christ (Romans 4; Hebrews 11). They looked forward to Him and we look back.
James 2:10: "For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all."
Romans 3:19-26: "Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. 20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall NO FLESH be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin. 21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: 23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; 24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; 26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus."
Most Sabbath keepers are depending on their keeping of the Sabbath to get them into heaven. It will not. Only Jesus Christ can do that. Period!
The saved in Christ, both the New and Old Testament saints, will keep the Sabbath perfectly during the Millennial Sabbath, which is the ultimate Sabbath of all Sabbaths, and then comes "the eighth day," eternity, which is symbolized by "the Lord's Day."
Just as we look to the founders of America to define the meanings of the words of our Nations founding documents, we likewise look to the Bible and the generations trained by Jesus and His apostles to define terms for us. Pay attention to the disciples of the apostles:
Ignatius (35-117 AD): Like Polycarp, Ignatius was a disciple of the Apostle John. Ignatius was the Pastor of the Church of Antioch. He wrote to the Magnesians in Greece sometime between 110-117 AD. We read:
"If, therefore, those who were brought up in the ancient order of things have come to the possession of a new hope, no longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord's Day, on which also our life has sprung up again by Him and by His death-whom some deny, by which mystery we have obtained faith, and therefore endure, that we may be found the disciples of Jesus Christ ..." (Epistle of Ignatius to the Magnesians, Chapter 9)
Irenaeus (115-202 AD): In the writings of Irenaeus, who was a disciple of Polycarp (70-156 AD), who was a disciple of the Apostle John, we also find mention of "the first day of the week" as the Lord's day. Around 178 AD Irenaeus wrote:
"The mystery of the Lord's resurrection may not be celebrated on any other day than the Lord's day and on this alone should we observe the breaking of the Paschal Fast." (Warren, Samuel E., The Sunday Question, p. 87, 1890; Eusebius, Church History, Bk. V, ch. 24; & Dake’s Annotated Reference Bible, p. 191)
"Pentecost fell on the first day of the week, and was therefore associated with the Lord's day." (Etienne, Augustin D., Sunday Worship, p. 41, March 9, 2009)
Hippolytus (170–235 AD): Hippolytus was a disciple of Irenaeus. He was the Pastor of Portus near Rome. He wrote this concerning the Lord's Supper:
"On the first day of the week the bishop, if possible, shall deliver the oblation to all the people with his own hand, while the deacons break the bread [Acts 20:7]." (Hippolytus. The Apostolic Tradition of Hippolytus; Gregory Dix, The Treatise on the Apostolic Tradition of St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr. London: Alban Press, 1992)
Epistle of Barnabas (written between 70 & 132 AD): This Barnabas may be by the Apostle Paul's companion. It says:
"If my sons shall keep my sabbath, then will I place my mercy upon them. He speaketh, too, of the sabbath in the beginning of the creation: And God made in six days the works of his hands, and finished them on the seventh day, and rested in it and sanctified it. Consider, my children, what signify the words, He finished them in six days. They mean this: that in six thousand years the Lord will make an end of all things, for a day is with him as a thousand years [Ps. 90:4]. And he himself beareth witness unto me, saying: Behold this day a day shall be as a thousand years. Therefore, my children, in six days, that is in six thousand years, shall all things be brought to an end [2 Pet. 3:8-13]. And the words, He rested on the seventh day [Gen.2:2], signify this: After that his Son hath come, and hath caused to cease the time of the wicked one, and hath judged the ungodly, and changed the sun and the moon and the stars [Ps. 102:25-26], then shall he rest well on the seventh day [Rev. 20:1-6]. And further he saith, Thou shall sanctify it with pure hands and a pure heart [Ps. 24:1-5]. Who, therefore, can sanctify the day which the Lord hath sanctified, unless he be pure of heart? in all things have we been deceived. Behold, that then indeed we shall be able to rest well and sanctify; even when we ourselves, having been justified, and having received the promise, when iniquity exists no longer, but all things have been made new by the Lord. we shall then be able to sanctify it, having been first sanctified ourselves. And, further, he saith unto them, Your new moons and your sabbaths I cannot endure [Isa. 1:13]. See, now, what he meaneth. The sabbaths, that now are, are not acceptable unto me, but that which I have made is, even that in which, after that I have brought all things to an end [Rev. 20:7-15], I shall make a beginning of the eighth day, which thing is the beginning of another world [Rev. 21:3-5]. Wherefore we keep the eighth day as a day of gladness, on which also Jesus rose from the dead, and after he had appeared ascended unto heaven."
Both Barnabas and Tertullian speak of Isaiah 1:13 where God says:
"Bring no more vain oblations; incense is an abomination unto me; the new moons and sabbaths, the calling of assemblies, I cannot away with; it is iniquity, even the solemn meeting."
Hope this is helpful!
Sabbath or Lord's Day
The phrase, "the Lord’s day" is found only once in the Bible in Revelation 1:10.
Revelation 1:10-11: "I was in the Spirit on the Lord’s day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches ...
The phrase, "the Lord’s day" here has a dual meaning:
1. Literal: The natural and Biblical "the first day of the week" (Matthew 28:1; Mark 16:2, 9; Luke 24:1; John 20:1, 19; Acts 20:7; 1 Corinthians 16:2) and "the morrow after the sabbath" (Leviticus 23:11, 15, 16).
2. Prophetic: The future eternal 8th day which comes after the 1000 year Sabbath (2 Peter 3:8-14; Revelation 20:1-8, 21:1-6, 22-27)
We believe that we have a 100% refutation of cultic teaching that add keeping the Old Testament Law for salvation. Keeping the Law, including the Sabbath, has never and will never save anyone.
WHAT DO THE SCRIPTURES SAY?
The Morrow after The Sabbath is Sunday:
The Seven Feasts of the Lord of Leviticus 23 symbolize prophetic events.
The feasts are prophetic pictures. These Feasts are:
1. Passover which pictures Christ's death for us.
2. Unleavened Bread is a picture of the burial of His sinless body.
3. Firstfruits symbolized the Lord's resurrection from the dead.
4. Fiftieth Day (Pentecost) signifies this present Church Age.
5. Trumpets pictures the Rapture of all believers of this Church Age.
6. Atonement is a type of the 7 year Tribulation.
7. Tabernacles signifies the Millennial Reign of Jesus Christ on this earth.
Here we will only look at the first 4 feasts that have to do with the Lord's death and resurrection and the empowerment of the first church on the Day of Pentecost 50 days after Christ's resurrection. First for the Old Testament background:
Leviticus 23:4-6, 15-17: "These are the feasts of the LORD, even holy convocations, which ye shall proclaim in their seasons. 5 In the fourteenth day of the first month at even is the LORD’S passover. 6 And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD: seven days ye must eat unleavened bread. ... 15 And ye shall count unto you from the morrow after the sabbath, from the day that ye brought the sheaf of the wave offering; seven sabbaths shall be complete: 16 Even unto the morrow after the seventh sabbath shall ye number fifty days; and ye shall offer a new meat offering unto the LORD. 17 Ye shall bring out of your habitations two wave loaves of two tenth deals: they shall be of fine flour; they shall be baken with leaven; they are the firstfruits unto the LORD." (cf. verse 17 with Ephesians 2:11-22; Acts 2:1, 4, 8-11, 14-17, 41-42; 1 Corinthians 12:13; Romans 1:16, 2:10, 10:12; 1 Corinthians 1:24. Note: "the morrow after the sabbath" is "the first day of the week" which is commonly called Sunday.)
The Lord Jesus Christ was received by many as their King on the 10th of Nisan (also called Abib) which was "the morrow after the sabbath" or "the first day of the week" and He was crucified with the approval of many on Passover (the 14th of Nisan) and was placed in the tomb before sundown the same day. His sinless body was in the tomb during the first days of Unleavened Bread, and He rose from the dead on Firstfruits which was the 17th of Nisan which was "the morrow after the sabbath" or "the first day of the week."
Messiah The Prince Came According to Daniel 9:25-26:
"Seventy weeks [70 x 7 = 490 years] are determined upon thy people [Daniel's people, the Jews] and upon thy holy city[Jerusalem], to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy [God's word], and to anoint the most Holy [Jesus Christ]. 25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment [the twentieth year of King Artaxerxes*] to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince [Christ's Triumphant Entry as King*] shall be seven weeks [7 x 7 = 49 years to restore Jerusalem], and threescore and two weeks [7 x 62 = 434 additional years]: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. 26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off [Isaiah 53:7-9], but not for himself: and the people [of the Roman Empire] of the prince [the future Antichrist] that shall come [after the Age of Grace] shall destroy the city and the sanctuary [in 70 AD]; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. 27 And he [Antichrist] shall confirm the covenant [to re-institute Temple worship] with many for one week [7 years]: and in the midst of the week [after 3 & 1/2 years] he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate [Dan 11:31-37, 12:11; Matt 24:15; 2 Thess 2:3-4; Rev 13:11-18], even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate." (Daniel 9:24-27)
Daniel's Prophecy of "Seventy Weeks" are not weeks of days, but of years. They are broken down into three sections:
The count down "from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince" began with the command of Artaxerxes Longimanus in the 20th year of his reign (Nehemiah 2:1-8).
Recent detailed research has been published by Dr. Floyd Nolen Jones that agrees with the famous Irish Bible Chronologist, James Ussher (4 Jan. 1581 - 21 Mar. 1656). Ussher establish the date of the creation as "the entrance of the night preceding the 23rd day of October ... the year before Christ 4004" at around 6 pm on 22 October 4004 BC according to the Julian calendar. "Ussher rejected Ptolemy's Canon 465 BC date for the commencement of the reign of Artaxerxes Longimanus in favor of BC 473 (AM 3531). This latter year was based on much older historic data which Ussher considered more reliable than that of the Canon [of Ptolemy]. It places the twentieth year of Artaxerxes at BC 454 and brings the 483 years [of Daniel 9] to an auspicious 30 AD fulfillment. However in 1701, fifty-one years after Ussher had published, [Bishop William] Lloyd [1627-1717] set aside Ussher's chronology and inserted Ptolemy's date in its place." (Jones; Chronology of the Old Testament: A Return to the Basics; 2002; p. 241)
Claudius Ptolemy (90 - 168 AD) was an astrologer and astronomer from Alexandria, Egypt. He preserved the Canon of Kings which was a dated list of kings used by ancient astronomers to date astronomical phenomena, such as eclipses. This Canon became known as Ptolemy's Canon.
Furthermore, Jones writes, "... the entire thesis concerning the Biblical 'Artaxerxes' as presented thus far has been remarkably corroborated by an essay published in the 1863 Journal of Sacred Literature & Biblical Record. The article reports an Egyptian hieroglyphic inscription as having been found which stated that Artaxerxes Longimanus was associated with his father on the throne in the 12th year of Xerxes' reign: 'It is satisfactory to know that the idea entertained by Archbishop Usher of dating the commencement of Artaxerxes' reign nine years earlier than the canon of Ptolemy allows, grounded upon what Thucydides says of Themistocles' flight to Persia, has been confirmed by hieroglyphic inscriptions in Egypt, shewing that Artaxerxes was associated with his father in the twelfth year of Xerxes' reign, so that there ought to be no longer any doubt respecting that famous prophecy of Daniel, so far at least as regards the crucifixion.'" (B.W. Savile, "Revelation and Science", Journal of Sacred Literature & Biblical Record, Series 4, [London: Williams and Norgate Pub., April, 1863], p. 156. sited by Jones, p. 253).
Therefore, by using Jones' Chart on page 266 of his Chronology we see that "Jesus came into the city to be declared Prince (or King) on the 10th day of Nisan in the year 30 AD. On the 14th of Nisan He was crucified. On the 17th of Nisan He resurrected. Daniel had prophesied the beginning and the end of a 483 year period of time at least 80 years before it started!!
Both the 10th of Nisan and the 17th of Nisan in 30 AD were on the 1st day of the week, Sunday.
The 10th day of Nisan was the day the Passover lambs were selected (Exodus 12:1-3). The 14th of Nisan is when the lambs are killed (Exodus 12:6-7), and Jesus was crucified on that day. The 17th of Nisan is the Feast of Firstfruits when He resurrected.
The Sabbath or The Lord's Day?
The phrase, "the Lord’s day" is found only once in the Bible in Revelation 1:10.
Revelation 1:10-11: "I was in the Spirit on the Lord’s day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches ...
The phrase, "the Lord’s day" here has a dual meaning:
1. Literal: The natural and Biblical "the first day of the week" (Matthew 28:1; Mark 16:2, 9; Luke 24:1; John 20:1, 19; Acts 20:7; 1 Corinthians 16:2) and "the morrow after the sabbath" (Leviticus 23:11, 15, 16).
2. Prophetic: The future eternal 8th day which comes after the 1000 year Sabbath (2 Peter 3:8-14; Revelation 20:1-8, 21:1-6, 22-27)
We believe that we have a 100% refutation of cultic teaching that add keeping the Old Testament Law for salvation. Keeping the Law, including the Sabbath, has never and will never save anyone.
WHAT DO THE SCRIPTURES SAY?
The Morrow after The Sabbath is Sunday:
The Seven Feasts of the Lord of Leviticus 23 symbolize prophetic events.
The feasts are prophetic pictures. These Feasts are:
1. Passover which pictures Christ's death for us.
2. Unleavened Bread is a picture of the burial of His sinless body.
3. Firstfruits symbolized the Lord's resurrection from the dead.
4. Fiftieth Day (Pentecost) signifies this present Church Age.
5. Trumpets pictures the Rapture of all believers of this Church Age.
6. Atonement is a type of the 7 year Tribulation.
7. Tabernacles signifies the Millennial Reign of Jesus Christ on this earth.
Here we will only look at the first 4 feasts that have to do with the Lord's death and resurrection and the empowerment of the first church on the Day of Pentecost 50 days after Christ's resurrection. First for the Old Testament background:
Leviticus 23:4-6, 15-17: "These are the feasts of the LORD, even holy convocations, which ye shall proclaim in their seasons. 5 In the fourteenth day of the first month at even is the LORD’S passover. 6 And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD: seven days ye must eat unleavened bread. ... 15 And ye shall count unto you from the morrow after the sabbath, from the day that ye brought the sheaf of the wave offering; seven sabbaths shall be complete: 16 Even unto the morrow after the seventh sabbath shall ye number fifty days; and ye shall offer a new meat offering unto the LORD. 17 Ye shall bring out of your habitations two wave loaves of two tenth deals: they shall be of fine flour; they shall be baken with leaven; they are the firstfruits unto the LORD." (cf. verse 17 with Ephesians 2:11-22; Acts 2:1, 4, 8-11, 14-17, 41-42; 1 Corinthians 12:13; Romans 1:16, 2:10, 10:12; 1 Corinthians 1:24. Note: "the morrow after the sabbath" is "the first day of the week" which is commonly called Sunday.)
The Lord Jesus Christ was received by many as their King on the 10th of Nisan (also called Abib) which was "the morrow after the sabbath" or "the first day of the week" and He was crucified with the approval of many on Passover (the 14th of Nisan) and was placed in the tomb before sundown the same day. His sinless body was in the tomb during the first days of Unleavened Bread, and He rose from the dead on Firstfruits which was the 17th of Nisan which was "the morrow after the sabbath" or "the first day of the week."
Messiah The Prince Came According to Daniel 9:25-26:
"Seventy weeks [70 x 7 = 490 years] are determined upon thy people [Daniel's people, the Jews] and upon thy holy city[Jerusalem], to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy [God's word], and to anoint the most Holy [Jesus Christ]. 25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment [the twentieth year of King Artaxerxes*] to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince [Christ's Triumphant Entry as King*] shall be seven weeks [7 x 7 = 49 years to restore Jerusalem], and threescore and two weeks [7 x 62 = 434 additional years]: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. 26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off [Isaiah 53:7-9], but not for himself: and the people [of the Roman Empire] of the prince [the future Antichrist] that shall come [after the Age of Grace] shall destroy the city and the sanctuary [in 70 AD]; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. 27 And he [Antichrist] shall confirm the covenant [to re-institute Temple worship] with many for one week [7 years]: and in the midst of the week [after 3 & 1/2 years] he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate [Dan 11:31-37, 12:11; Matt 24:15; 2 Thess 2:3-4; Rev 13:11-18], even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate." (Daniel 9:24-27)
Daniel's Prophecy of "Seventy Weeks" are not weeks of days, but of years. They are broken down into three sections:
The count down "from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince" began with the command of Artaxerxes Longimanus in the 20th year of his reign (Nehemiah 2:1-8).
Recent detailed research has been published by Dr. Floyd Nolen Jones that agrees with the famous Irish Bible Chronologist, James Ussher (4 Jan. 1581 - 21 Mar. 1656). Ussher establish the date of the creation as "the entrance of the night preceding the 23rd day of October ... the year before Christ 4004" at around 6 pm on 22 October 4004 BC according to the Julian calendar. "Ussher rejected Ptolemy's Canon 465 BC date for the commencement of the reign of Artaxerxes Longimanus in favor of BC 473 (AM 3531). This latter year was based on much older historic data which Ussher considered more reliable than that of the Canon [of Ptolemy]. It places the twentieth year of Artaxerxes at BC 454 and brings the 483 years [of Daniel 9] to an auspicious 30 AD fulfillment. However in 1701, fifty-one years after Ussher had published, [Bishop William] Lloyd [1627-1717] set aside Ussher's chronology and inserted Ptolemy's date in its place." (Jones; Chronology of the Old Testament: A Return to the Basics; 2002; p. 241)
Claudius Ptolemy (90 - 168 AD) was an astrologer and astronomer from Alexandria, Egypt. He preserved the Canon of Kings which was a dated list of kings used by ancient astronomers to date astronomical phenomena, such as eclipses. This Canon became known as Ptolemy's Canon.
Furthermore, Jones writes, "... the entire thesis concerning the Biblical 'Artaxerxes' as presented thus far has been remarkably corroborated by an essay published in the 1863 Journal of Sacred Literature & Biblical Record. The article reports an Egyptian hieroglyphic inscription as having been found which stated that Artaxerxes Longimanus was associated with his father on the throne in the 12th year of Xerxes' reign: 'It is satisfactory to know that the idea entertained by Archbishop Usher of dating the commencement of Artaxerxes' reign nine years earlier than the canon of Ptolemy allows, grounded upon what Thucydides says of Themistocles' flight to Persia, has been confirmed by hieroglyphic inscriptions in Egypt, shewing that Artaxerxes was associated with his father in the twelfth year of Xerxes' reign, so that there ought to be no longer any doubt respecting that famous prophecy of Daniel, so far at least as regards the crucifixion.'" (B.W. Savile, "Revelation and Science", Journal of Sacred Literature & Biblical Record, Series 4, [London: Williams and Norgate Pub., April, 1863], p. 156. sited by Jones, p. 253).
Therefore, by using Jones' Chart on page 266 of his Chronology we see that "Jesus came into the city to be declared Prince (or King) on the 10th day of Nisan in the year 30 AD. On the 14th of Nisan He was crucified. On the 17th of Nisan He resurrected. Daniel had prophesied the beginning and the end of a 483 year period of time at least 80 years before it started!!
Both the 10th of Nisan and the 17th of Nisan in 30 AD were on the 1st day of the week, Sunday.
The 10th day of Nisan was the day the Passover lambs were selected (Exodus 12:1-3). The 14th of Nisan is when the lambs are killed (Exodus 12:6-7), and Jesus was crucified on that day. The 17th of Nisan is the Feast of Firstfruits when He resurrected.
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Saturday or Sunday?
Preaching, The Lord's Supper and Giving All on The First Day of The Week:
Acts 20:7: "And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight."
1 Corinthians 16:2: "Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come."
Paul Taught in The Synagogues on The Sabbath Days:
In the Book of Acts we see the Apostle Paul and his companions teaching in the synagogues on the Sabbath. It was Paul's custom in his missionary travels to go first to the Jews. He writes of this in Romans 1:16, "For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek." (cf. Romans 2:9-10) Paul went into the synagogues to win Jews to Jesus Christ. There is no day in which it is forbidden to preach and teach the salvation that is in Jesus Christ alone. Paul's evangelical efforts on the Sabbath are found in Acts 13, 17 and 18.
However, as we have seen above when Paul taught the church, he did it on "the first day of the week" and instructed that giving was to be done on that day also (Acts 20:7; 1 Corinthians 16:2).
Paul also wrote in Colossians 2:16: "Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ." In the New Testament "a shadow is sometimes a picture, type, or an outline of the real (cf. Hebrews 8:5, 10:1). Thus it is with the Sabbath. It is the 7th day, the last day of the week, and looks forward to the 8th day, the eternal day (2 Peter 3:8-14).
2 Peter 3:8: "But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day."
We are now at the end of the 6th 1,000 year day and entering the 7th 1,000 year day, the Millennium, when believers will reign with Jesus Christ for a thousand years. All believers will keep this Sabbath, and then comes eternity.
Paul & The Church of Antioch Seek Advice From The Apostolic Church in Jerusalem:
Some Jews from Judaea came to the Church at Antioch teaching them saying, "... Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved" (Acts 15:1). Therefore, "... Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and disputation with them ..." (Acts 15:2). So the Church at Antioch decided to seek advice from the Church at Jerusalem about this question (cf. Acts 15:1-3).
Of course, Sabbath keeping is just as much part of keeping the law of Moses as circumcision is. Circumcision is a picture of "regeneration" or being "born again" (Romans 2:29; Deut. 10:16, 30:6; Jer. 4:4; John 3:3, 5; Titus 3:5; et. al.) It is not the picture, but the actual that saves. There is no work that saves; NONE! But even today there are cults that teach Sabbath keeping for salvation.
The Holy Spirit had nothing recorded for us concerning the Antioch - Jerusalem Conference in Acts 15:4-31 concerning keeping the Sabbath. Nothing in the letter written and approved by the Apostolic Church in Jerusalem about keeping the Sabbath or any of the ceremonial practices of the Law of Moses.
Church Meetings on The 1st & 2nd Sundays after Christ's Resurrection:
John 20:1, 19-29: "The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre. ... 19 Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you. 20 And when he had so said, he shewed unto them his hands and his side. Then were the disciples glad, when they saw the Lord. 21 Then said Jesus to them again, Peace be unto you: as my Father hath sent me, even so send I you. 22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost: 23 Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained. 24 But Thomas, one of the twelve, called Didymus, was not with them when Jesus came. 25 The other disciples therefore said unto him, We have seen the Lord. But he said unto them, Except I shall see in his hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and thrust my hand into his side, I will not believe. 26 And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them: then came Jesus, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, Peace be unto you. 27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing. 28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God. 29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed."
Evangelistic Preaching and Baptizing on The First Pentecost after The Resurrection:
Remember that Pentecost always falls on "the morrow after the sabbath" (Leviticus 23:15-16). In Acts chapter 2 we read:
1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance. ...
14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words: ...
20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:
21 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved. ...
33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.
34 For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,
35 Until I make thy foes thy footstool.
36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ....
37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do? ...
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation. ...
41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles’ doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.
The Sabbath or The Lord's Day?
Saturday or Sunday?
Saturday or Sunday?
Preaching, The Lord's Supper and Giving All on The First Day of The Week:
Acts 20:7: "And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight."
1 Corinthians 16:2: "Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come."
Paul Taught in The Synagogues on The Sabbath Days:
In the Book of Acts we see the Apostle Paul and his companions teaching in the synagogues on the Sabbath. It was Paul's custom in his missionary travels to go first to the Jews. He writes of this in Romans 1:16, "For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek." (cf. Romans 2:9-10) Paul went into the synagogues to win Jews to Jesus Christ. There is no day in which it is forbidden to preach and teach the salvation that is in Jesus Christ alone. Paul's evangelical efforts on the Sabbath are found in Acts 13, 17 and 18.
However, as we have seen above when Paul taught the church, he did it on "the first day of the week" and instructed that giving was to be done on that day also (Acts 20:7; 1 Corinthians 16:2).
Paul also wrote in Colossians 2:16: "Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ." In the New Testament "a shadow is sometimes a picture, type, or an outline of the real (cf. Hebrews 8:5, 10:1). Thus it is with the Sabbath. It is the 7th day, the last day of the week, and looks forward to the 8th day, the eternal day (2 Peter 3:8-14).
2 Peter 3:8: "But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day."
We are now at the end of the 6th 1,000 year day and entering the 7th 1,000 year day, the Millennium, when believers will reign with Jesus Christ for a thousand years. All believers will keep this Sabbath, and then comes eternity.
Paul & The Church of Antioch Seek Advice From The Apostolic Church in Jerusalem:
Some Jews from Judaea came to the Church at Antioch teaching them saying, "... Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved" (Acts 15:1). Therefore, "... Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and disputation with them ..." (Acts 15:2). So the Church at Antioch decided to seek advice from the Church at Jerusalem about this question (cf. Acts 15:1-3).
Of course, Sabbath keeping is just as much part of keeping the law of Moses as circumcision is. Circumcision is a picture of "regeneration" or being "born again" (Romans 2:29; Deut. 10:16, 30:6; Jer. 4:4; John 3:3, 5; Titus 3:5; et. al.) It is not the picture, but the actual that saves. There is no work that saves; NONE! But even today there are cults that teach Sabbath keeping for salvation.
The Holy Spirit had nothing recorded for us concerning the Antioch - Jerusalem Conference in Acts 15:4-31 concerning keeping the Sabbath. Nothing in the letter written and approved by the Apostolic Church in Jerusalem about keeping the Sabbath or any of the ceremonial practices of the Law of Moses.
Church Meetings on The 1st & 2nd Sundays after Christ's Resurrection:
John 20:1, 19-29: "The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre. ... 19 Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you. 20 And when he had so said, he shewed unto them his hands and his side. Then were the disciples glad, when they saw the Lord. 21 Then said Jesus to them again, Peace be unto you: as my Father hath sent me, even so send I you. 22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost: 23 Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained. 24 But Thomas, one of the twelve, called Didymus, was not with them when Jesus came. 25 The other disciples therefore said unto him, We have seen the Lord. But he said unto them, Except I shall see in his hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and thrust my hand into his side, I will not believe. 26 And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them: then came Jesus, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, Peace be unto you. 27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing. 28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God. 29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed."
Evangelistic Preaching and Baptizing on The First Pentecost after The Resurrection:
Remember that Pentecost always falls on "the morrow after the sabbath" (Leviticus 23:15-16). In Acts chapter 2 we read:
1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance. ...
14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words: ...
20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:
21 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved. ...
33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.
34 For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,
35 Until I make thy foes thy footstool.
36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ....
37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do? ...
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation. ...
41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles’ doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.
The Sabbath or The Lord's Day?
CONCLUSION
Public worship requires a set day for worship. From Christ's resurrection onward Sunday was regarded by ancient believers to be the prime day of worship. Although not directly commanded by the Lord Jesus, it is clearly implied by 1) the feasts of Firstfruits and Pentecost, 2) the Lord's meeting with the Church on Sunday two weeks in a row in John 20, and in the type of the eternal 8th day after the 1000 year Sabbath.
True Christianity appeals to the free will of man, and uses only moral means for its ends. The observance of days of worship must be left to one's conscience and the convictions of the individual. True worship looses its value when it ceases to be voluntary. As with Sunday laws, days of worship ought not to be enforced by law.
However, keeping the Sabbath within Christianity has a cultic mark of heresy upon it. Seven Day Adventism, Armstrongism, Jehovah's Witnesses, etc. all pervert salvation by adding works, add and subtract from the word of God, and sometimes don't even believe in the deity of Jesus Christ.
We have seen that 2 of the 7 Old Testament feasts of Leviticus 23 are held on "the morrow after the sabbath" or Sunday. These 2 pointed to 1) the most important event in history, the resurrection of Jesus Christ (Firstfruits), and 2) Pentecost which symbolizes the Church Age. It was on "the first day of the week" that the Lord began His baptizing work with the Holy Ghost and the dispensing of spiritual gifts to believers (Acts 2).
We have also seen that the Lord's Triumphant Entry into Jerusalem was on the Sunday, 10 Nissan (31 March 30 AD) before His crucifixion on 14 Nisan and resurrection on 17 Nisan (7 April 30 AD). The Bible Chronologist, James Ussher establish the twentieth year of Artaxerxes at BC 454 back in 1650 and Dr. Floy Jones carefully reverified this date in the early 2000's.
We have seen from the Biblical narratives in John 20 and Acts 2 that the disciples met together om 3 of the 7 weeks between the Lord's resurrection and Pentecost on "the first day of the week." The Book of John records that the Lord Jesus also met with the disciples on Sunday evening on the day of His resurrection and again 8 days later on the next Sunday (John 20:19-29). Likewise, we know the day of Pentecost 10 days after the Lord ascended back to heaven was "the first day of the week."
Furthermore, we saw that even though the Apostle Paul did the work of an evangelist (soul winning preaching) on the Sabbath, he taught the church to give, take the Lord's Supper and preach on "the first day of the week" (Acts 20:7; 1 Cor. 16:2). Paul also clearly told us that the sabbath was "a shadow of things to come," that is the sabbath is a type or picture of something yet future (Colossians 2:16; cf. Hebrews 8:5, 10:1; 2 Peter 3:8-14).
We are now at the end of the 6th 1,000 year day and entering the 7th 1,000 year Sabbath, the Millennium, when believers will reign with Jesus Christ for a thousand years. All believers of all ages will enter and keep this Sabbath, and then will come the 8th Day, eternity.
The Sabbath or The Lord's Day?
CONCLUSION
Public worship requires a set day for worship. From Christ's resurrection onward Sunday was regarded by ancient believers to be the prime day of worship. Although not directly commanded by the Lord Jesus, it is clearly implied by 1) the feasts of Firstfruits and Pentecost, 2) the Lord's meeting with the Church on Sunday two weeks in a row in John 20, and in the type of the eternal 8th day after the 1000 year Sabbath.
True Christianity appeals to the free will of man, and uses only moral means for its ends. The observance of days of worship must be left to one's conscience and the convictions of the individual. True worship looses its value when it ceases to be voluntary. As with Sunday laws, days of worship ought not to be enforced by law.
However, keeping the Sabbath within Christianity has a cultic mark of heresy upon it. Seven Day Adventism, Armstrongism, Jehovah's Witnesses, etc. all pervert salvation by adding works, add and subtract from the word of God, and sometimes don't even believe in the deity of Jesus Christ.
We have seen that 2 of the 7 Old Testament feasts of Leviticus 23 are held on "the morrow after the sabbath" or Sunday. These 2 pointed to 1) the most important event in history, the resurrection of Jesus Christ (Firstfruits), and 2) Pentecost which symbolizes the Church Age. It was on "the first day of the week" that the Lord began His baptizing work with the Holy Ghost and the dispensing of spiritual gifts to believers (Acts 2).
We have also seen that the Lord's Triumphant Entry into Jerusalem was on the Sunday, 10 Nissan (31 March 30 AD) before His crucifixion on 14 Nisan and resurrection on 17 Nisan (7 April 30 AD). The Bible Chronologist, James Ussher establish the twentieth year of Artaxerxes at BC 454 back in 1650 and Dr. Floy Jones carefully reverified this date in the early 2000's.
We have seen from the Biblical narratives in John 20 and Acts 2 that the disciples met together om 3 of the 7 weeks between the Lord's resurrection and Pentecost on "the first day of the week." The Book of John records that the Lord Jesus also met with the disciples on Sunday evening on the day of His resurrection and again 8 days later on the next Sunday (John 20:19-29). Likewise, we know the day of Pentecost 10 days after the Lord ascended back to heaven was "the first day of the week."
Furthermore, we saw that even though the Apostle Paul did the work of an evangelist (soul winning preaching) on the Sabbath, he taught the church to give, take the Lord's Supper and preach on "the first day of the week" (Acts 20:7; 1 Cor. 16:2). Paul also clearly told us that the sabbath was "a shadow of things to come," that is the sabbath is a type or picture of something yet future (Colossians 2:16; cf. Hebrews 8:5, 10:1; 2 Peter 3:8-14).
We are now at the end of the 6th 1,000 year day and entering the 7th 1,000 year Sabbath, the Millennium, when believers will reign with Jesus Christ for a thousand years. All believers of all ages will enter and keep this Sabbath, and then will come the 8th Day, eternity.
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TrevorL
Member
Greetings JohnBaptistHenry,
Scriptures that speak of judgement:
Acts 17:31 (KJV): Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.
Isaiah 2:12 (KJV): For the day of the LORD of hosts shall be upon every one that is proud and lofty, and upon every one that is lifted up; and he shall be brought low:
Joel 3:14 (KJV): Multitudes, multitudes in the valley of decision: for the day of the LORD is near in the valley of decision.
Malachi 4:5 (KJV): Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD:
1 Thessalonians 5:2 (KJV): For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
A Scripture that speaks of salvation:
2 Corinthians 1:14 (KJV): As also ye have acknowledged us in part, that we are your rejoicing, even as ye also are ours in the day of the Lord Jesus.
There is no Scripture that speak of Sunday as the day of the Lord.
Kind regards
Trevor
Yes I agree that your three Posts are off topic. Could I suggest another view of "The Lord's Day", based not upon the Early Church Fathers, whose opinions are not reliable. John was speaking of the future Day of the Lord, a day of judgement on the wicked and salvation to the faithful. John was transported in vision to that future day, so that looking back he could reveal the events that lead up to that day of the Lord, the Day of the Revealing of the Lord Jesus Christ, the Day of Apocalypse.
Scriptures that speak of judgement:
Acts 17:31 (KJV): Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.
Isaiah 2:12 (KJV): For the day of the LORD of hosts shall be upon every one that is proud and lofty, and upon every one that is lifted up; and he shall be brought low:
Joel 3:14 (KJV): Multitudes, multitudes in the valley of decision: for the day of the LORD is near in the valley of decision.
Malachi 4:5 (KJV): Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD:
1 Thessalonians 5:2 (KJV): For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
A Scripture that speaks of salvation:
2 Corinthians 1:14 (KJV): As also ye have acknowledged us in part, that we are your rejoicing, even as ye also are ours in the day of the Lord Jesus.
There is no Scripture that speak of Sunday as the day of the Lord.
Kind regards
Trevor
The Sabbath or The Lord's Day?
CONCLUSION
Public worship requires a set day for worship. From Christ's resurrection onward Sunday was regarded by ancient believers to be the prime day of worship. Although not directly commanded by the Lord Jesus, it is clearly implied by 1) the feasts of Firstfruits and Pentecost, 2) the Lord's meeting with the Church on Sunday two weeks in a row in John 20, and in the type of the eternal 8th day after the 1000 year Sabbath.
True Christianity appeals to the free will of man, and uses only moral means for its ends. The observance of days of worship must be left to one's conscience and the convictions of the individual. True worship looses its value when it ceases to be voluntary. As with Sunday laws, days of worship ought not to be enforced by law.
However, keeping the Sabbath within Christianity has a cultic mark of heresy upon it. Seven Day Adventism, Armstrongism, Jehovah's Witnesses, etc. all pervert salvation by adding works, add and subtract from the word of God, and sometimes don't even believe in the deity of Jesus Christ.
We have seen that 2 of the 7 Old Testament feasts of Leviticus 23 are held on "the morrow after the sabbath" or Sunday. These 2 pointed to 1) the most important event in history, the resurrection of Jesus Christ (Firstfruits), and 2) Pentecost which symbolizes the Church Age. It was on "the first day of the week" that the Lord began His baptizing work with the Holy Ghost and the dispensing of spiritual gifts to believers (Acts 2).
We have also seen that the Lord's Triumphant Entry into Jerusalem was on the Sunday, 10 Nissan (31 March 30 AD) before His crucifixion on 14 Nisan and resurrection on 17 Nisan (7 April 30 AD). The Bible Chronologist, James Ussher establish the twentieth year of Artaxerxes at BC 454 back in 1650 and Dr. Floy Jones carefully reverified this date in the early 2000's.
We have seen from the Biblical narratives in John 20 and Acts 2 that the disciples met together om 3 of the 7 weeks between the Lord's resurrection and Pentecost on "the first day of the week." The Book of John records that the Lord Jesus also met with the disciples on Sunday evening on the day of His resurrection and again 8 days later on the next Sunday (John 20:19-29). Likewise, we know the day of Pentecost 10 days after the Lord ascended back to heaven was "the first day of the week."
Furthermore, we saw that even though the Apostle Paul did the work of an evangelist (soul winning preaching) on the Sabbath, he taught the church to give, take the Lord's Supper and preach on "the first day of the week" (Acts 20:7; 1 Cor. 16:2). Paul also clearly told us that the sabbath was "a shadow of things to come," that is the sabbath is a type or picture of something yet future (Colossians 2:16; cf. Hebrews 8:5, 10:1; 2 Peter 3:8-14).
We are now at the end of the 6th 1,000 year day and entering the 7th 1,000 year Sabbath, the Millennium, when believers will reign with Jesus Christ for a thousand years. All believers of all ages will enter and keep this Sabbath, and then will come the 8th Day, eternity.
Excellent work on your last three posts. However, you are addressing some closed minded people on this forum so don't hold your breath thinking they will accept it.
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
If this thread is really about the Lord's Day of Isaiah 58:13, and Mark 2:28 and Rev 1 -- just let us know.
There is a vision in Daniel 7 and another one in Daniel 8. The question is specifically about the one mentioned in Daniel 8 -- that begins with the ram (Medo Persia) in its dominate phase.
Daniel 8:13 (KJV)
Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?
There is a vision in Daniel 7 and another one in Daniel 8. The question is specifically about the one mentioned in Daniel 8 -- that begins with the ram (Medo Persia) in its dominate phase.
Daniel 8:13 (KJV)
Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?
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BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Not in the actual Bible though.
Not in the actual Bible.
in the Bible Jesus condemned the idea of man "making stuff up" to replace the commandments of God.
So for those who favor "Sola scriptura" testing of all doctrine and practice we have Jesus speaking to that subject in this manner..
Mark 7 (Jesus Christ speaking)
6 And He said to them, “Rightly did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written:‘This people honors Me with their lips,
But their heart is far away from Me.
7 ‘But in vain do they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the precepts of men.’
8 Neglecting the commandment of God, you hold to the tradition of men.”
9 He was also saying to them, “You are experts at setting aside the commandment of God in order to keep your tradition. 10 For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who speaks evil of father or mother, is to be put to death’; 11 but you say, ‘If a man says to his father or his mother, whatever I have that would help you is Corban (that is to say, given to God),’ 12 you no longer permit him to do anything for his father or his mother; 13 thus invalidating the word of God by your tradition which you have handed down; and you do many things such as that.”
Both of which -- happen on yearly cycles -- once a year. Not once a week. They never occurred in a 7 day cycle.
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