Did Jesus drink Alchol?

[TheOliveBranch]

I believe that is the point I was trying to make. We all have a choice on whether to sin or not. God tells us what the effects of alcohol do, and he tells us why. It is our choice to listen to Him or do what we want.

 

[Mike McK]

Originally posted by I Am Blessed 16:
Mike; You are in the wrong forum. This one is about alcohol; not music. You chase people all over the board trying to make them answer you. You have done that to me.

I didn't chase anyone. I came here to post about this thread and I did. I only answered posts that were directed at me, not the other way around.

And you're right, you never have answered my questions.

 

[Mike McK]

Originally posted by TheOliveBranch:
Thank-you for saying it better than I could, Sue.

Mike, Come chase me back in the Music forum.

No, I've just decided to add you to the list of pharisees I refuse to respond to.

 

[I Am Blessed 24]

Originally posted by Mike McK:
And you're right, you never have answered my questions.

I did not answer your questions for the same reason Olive didn't.

I rest my case.

Sue

 

[Mike McK]

Originally posted by I Am Blessed 16:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Mike McK:
And you're right, you never have answered my questions.

I did not answer your questions for the same reason Olive didn't.

I rest my case.

Sue </font>[/QUOTE]Yeah, because you don't want everybody to see what a hypocrite you are.

 

[HankD]

Being a Jew and under the Law, yet perfect and without sin and also the perfect lamb for sacrifice and the High priest, he would have followed the Law and not put a fermented [contaminated] beverage into his body.(Lev 10:9-10)

1 Peter 2:24
24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

Matthew 15
10 And he called the multitude, and said unto them, Hear, and understand:
11 Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.
12 Then came his disciples, and said unto him, Knowest thou that the Pharisees were offended, after they heard this saying?


HankD

 

[Sherrie]

Hi Mike!

I know the Bible scripture says he sat with people in the taverns, and talked with them, but personaly, I do not think Jesus ever did drink. I think he says in scripture somewhere, (I have not found it right now, but will look in a bit for it) He was not going to drink, until he was in Heaven with the Father. If someone else knows where that is, please post it.

I think somewhere else its says for us to be sober. And to be drunk in the spirit.

So the first 2 things are we should do as Jesus, and 1 is wait until we are in Heaven, and then 2, we also should be in the spirit.

I think it has more to do with being an example for others. We do not want the alcohol to take over, and do something that is less spiritual, or less Christ like.

I think the thing is, that we should not be like fools too. We as Christians, should be working towards wisdom. The more wisdom we learn, the more we have to learn. I think too when we fail, and all Christians fail, we have to be able to learn from our failures and grow from that.

Your Sister In Christ
Sherrie

 

[JonathanDT]

Originally posted by TheOliveBranch:
Su Wei, from this comment, I would gather that this person is equating social drinking with it's use for medicinal purposes. I don't recall any Bible verses stating that Jesus actually drank wine. It is assumed that he did.

You'll have to go the the music forum to understand the context of my quote. Basically I mentioned that Jesus drank, Su claimed I just called Jesus a sinner since alcohol was an abomination to God. My response was what Su quoted to start the thread.

In the verses posted in the beginning, Jesus clearly said that he was drinking. Could he have been talking about drinking water or grape juice? No, because he was contrasting his drinking to John the Baptist not drinking, and John the Baptist could drink anything BUT fermented wine. But don't take my word, search your Bible for it.

Being a Jew and under the Law, yet perfect and without sin and also the perfect lamb for sacrifice and the High priest, he would have followed the Law and not put a fermented [contaminated] beverage into his body.(Lev 10:9-10)

You neatly took those verses out of context. Go back and read them again, it says "You and your sons are not to drink wine or other fermented drink whenever you go into the Tent of Meeting" Sorry, but you just won't find a verse prohibiting Jesus from drinking, it doesn't exist.

God bless,
`JD

 

[JonathanDT]

Originally posted by Sherrie:
Hi Mike!

I know the Bible scripture says he sat with people in the taverns, and talked with them, but personaly, I do not think Jesus ever did drink. I think he says in scripture somewhere, (I have not found it right now, but will look in a bit for it) He was not going to drink, until he was in Heaven with the Father. If someone else knows where that is, please post it.

I believe your thinking of this:
Matthew 26:29 I tell you, I will not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it anew with you in my Father's kingdom."

This was at the last supper.

Bro Curtis, that verse actually says that "overseers" may not be "given to drunkeness" or "addicted to wine". A far cry from not drinking at all.

God bless,
`JD

 

[TheOliveBranch]

Originally posted by JonathanDT:
In the verses posted in the beginning, Jesus clearly said that he was drinking. Could he have been talking about drinking water or grape juice? No, because he was contrasting his drinking to John the Baptist not drinking, and John the Baptist could drink anything BUT fermented wine. But don't take my word, search your Bible for it.

The whole context of the quoted Scripture is related to the baptism of John.Accusations are being thrown around in the verses from Luke. Verse 35 shows who has the wisdom. Verse 32 says that he didn't dance to their music, nor cry for them in mourning, but those are all accusations, too.

Being a Jew and under the Law, yet perfect and without sin and also the perfect lamb for sacrifice and the High priest, he would have followed the Law and not put a fermented [contaminated] beverage into his body.(Lev 10:9-10)

You neatly took those verses out of context. Go back and read them again, it says "You and your sons are not to drink wine or other fermented drink whenever you go into the Tent of Meeting" Sorry, but you just won't find a verse prohibiting Jesus from drinking, it doesn't exist.

Jesus was under the Law, but He was also a high Priest. Whenever someone came before the Lord, as a priest, they had to be free from anything unholy, as stated in Lev 10:10. Jesus was always before the Lord, always ready and holy before the Father.

[ March 10, 2003, 02:26 PM: Message edited by: TheOliveBranch ]

 

[Johnv]

Jesus would have consumed wine with every sabbath and passover meal he celebrated. Biblically, consuming wine during these meals is honorable and appropriate. Had Jesus diverted fromthis custom, it would have been significant enough for the Gospel writers to note it.

 

[TheOliveBranch]

With that reasoning, Jesus would have comsumed wine at the Last Supper, making him unclean and unholy for the perfect sacrifice. His Holiness came far above custom, a known fact that is not necessary to mention, as are many other things, like shaving and cutting his hair.

 

[Johnv]

I see no biblical reason to say that consuming sabbath wine would result in an unclean sacrifice.

 

[JonathanDT]

The whole context of the quoted Scripture is related to the baptism of John.Accusations are being thrown around in the verses from Luke. Verse 35 shows who has the wisdom. Verse 32 says that he didn't dance to their music, nor cry for them in mourning, but those are all accusations, too.

No, Verse 32 is an analogy about the people of Israel at the time. Verse 34a was the actual situation of John(he didn't eat bread or drink wine), verse 34b was the accusation. In the same way, verse 35a was the actual situation(the Son of Man came eating and drinking), while 35b has the accusations. It's important not to mix those up.

JohnV, here is your mistake. Olive Branch wasn't talking about Biblical reason. This is his own personal belief that has no foundation in the Bible(or has an misguided foundation), it has probably been taught to him ever since he was saved. Old habits die hard, so do old beliefs.

 

[Mickes]

Wine is a mocker and strong drink is rageing. To be a mocker or to be rageing I feel is sin so wine would be sin. In proverbs 23:31 it describes acoholic wine and tells us not to look at it so why would we think we can drink it. another good verse is Habakkuk 2:15 woe unto him that gives his neighbor strong drink.

 

[Johnv]

If you take it literally, then, you could drink other alcoholic beverages. Beer is neither wine nor strong drink, unless you consume enough of it.

Proverbs is in the OT, and the Jews still readily consumed wine at sabbaths and passovers. Yet Jesus never condemned the practice, and celebrated the proper use of wine as demonstrated by his first miracle.

 

[Mike McK]

Originally posted by Mickes:
Wine is a mocker and strong drink is rageing. To be a mocker or to be rageing I feel is sin so wine would be sin. In proverbs 23:31 it describes acoholic wine and tells us not to look at it so why would we think we can drink it. another good verse is Habakkuk 2:15 woe unto him that gives his neighbor strong drink.

Both of these are talking about drinking to excess, not moderation. I think we're all agreed that drinking to excess is wrong.

 

[Johnv]

Agreed 100%

 

[D.R.]

Ok,

I really cannot believe that we are still having this discussion in Baptist life. For those of you who insist that Jesus did not drink wine, I think you are making assumptions that no text seems to back up. As for the Levitical law banning drinking, whether or not it (in context) says not to drink, makes no difference. That is because Jesus was not a priest in the line of the Levites and therefore did not have to be under those laws. He was the sacrifice, and it never said the sacrifice had to be free from alcohol usage. Many assumptions are being made that alcohol is in some way accursed or evil. This cannot be true. All wine in that day was fermented. In fact, in response to what Sue said on the first page about looking at the text of the wineskins as nonfermented wine, there was no such thing. Welch was the first to invent this in the last 100 years or so. In fact, he did so because of the temperance movement. Baptists up until that point used wine in their communion services. I think this is a silly debate, and those who choose to believe that Jesus did not drink wine over against the slew of evidence in support of it do it because of their presuppositions. One of my close friends wrote and article in Bible Illustrator called, "Jesus the tetoller." In it, he covers how obvious it was to the first century Christians that they were to use fermented wine for communion and how in the Middle Ages they actually used beer for communion. Now that will blow your socks off won't it? In fact some of those groups you Landmarkists trace the baptist movement through to John the Baptist with are the very groups who did this. Guys, I exhort you to leave your presuppositions and focus on the historical and Biblical Jesus, not the one you make up in your head.
DR

 

[Ben W]

I would like to jump in on this point also. Jesus was not from the Levites, hence he could not be a priest. To call him a priest is incorrect. The Son of Man is a correct term.

Jews today drink alcoholic wine, if it was not permitted it would not be in their culture to do so.