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Did Trump Jump the Shark?
- Thread starter Aaron
- Start date
How about if I explain how the rules are being misused:
For starters I might ask you to explain why Kasich, with no chance of winning a majority, is still in the race if not in hope to syphon off enough delegates to deny a majority to Trump? And ask: Do you believe using ploys like this was the founder’s intent when setting up the convention “rules”?
I do not believe the convention was ever intended to facilitate a method for GOPEE’s to manipulate the rules so that they can maintain or gain control of who is nominated. Yet, that is what they’re being used for…
In conjunction with Kasich’s shenanigans other Anti-Trump strategists, (GOPPEE’s), calling themselves the Republican Unity Ticket are attempting to encourage all candidates (who also have no chance of winning a majority) to hold their delegates (186) on the first ballot in hopes to force the second ballot. More “rules” being manipulated by the GOPPEE to deny any possibility of a majority for Trump on a first ballot! WHEREIN, “facilitating” a second ballot “freeing up” delegates to vote “their” will, RATHER than the original will of the people. If Trump got ½ of these in a 2 man race the extra 93 delegates could make the difference …but the GOPPEE’s would rather have control than allow for a more closely related by “WE the People” control.
The GOPEE’s, who are out to control the nomination, are blitzing attacks through super PACs (i.e.; using such maneuvers as posting pics of Trump’s wife – which common anti-Trumper’s seem to have no problem with such tactics or rarely even criticize it yet willingly focus on Trump’s hitting back and calling his response/defense a disgrace.) All in hopes of denying a majority of delegates to be chosen by the people whereby it was the intent that they be represented by these delegates, not to have the delegates represent the Establishment.
I don’t call these shenanigans “cheating” but I will certainly call them underhanded maneuvers to facilitate GOPPEE control of choosing a candidate and will propose that these kinds of tactics to deny a majority was never the intent of the founders for the purposes of forming the convention “rules”.
Plain and simple, the “rules” are being manipulated for ways they were NOT intended for to give advantage to the GOPEE’s desire to control the nomination process. You may want to argue by claiming if by the “rules” is not “cheating” but to deprive something as valuable as a majority by the people through deceit or fraud (unscrupulous use of rules for other than intended); to influence or lead by deceit, trick (such as using super PACs to publish wife pics and hypocritically turning to attack any defense of that action as unconscionable) or artifice (clever lawyers artfully using “rules” to manipulate control as per their interested parties); to elude or thwart by or as if by outwitting (BTW, just gave the Webster definition of “cheat”) – in order to accomplish the goals of takeover control of our (We the People's) nomination process through manipulating the “rules” in ways they were not intended for IMO is unethical at best.
Zaac
Well-Known Member
Acting in good faith to what? Has someone already gotten the number of delegates needed for the nomination? Good faith requires they adhere to the rules. There's no rule that says they have to support a candidate just because he amasses more delegates than all others but doesn't reach the number needed for the nomination.
As I mentioned before, there are SEVERAL states in which Trump did not receive a majority of the vote. The voters wanted someone else.
Consider it that whole "will of the people" thing you seemed to be so passionate about before.
Zaac
Well-Known Member
You must have been counting votes for Gore.
And you must have gone to some Midwest Law School where they taught you that math or rules don't matter.
Quick correction. Trump has NEVER received the majority of the vote in a single state - only a plurality. To date, he has won more delegates than any of the other individual candidates - but even here, he does not have a majority.
We still have about 20 states to go, including Wisconsin (next week), Pennsylvania, New York and California. Can we please finish the voting first before we start with the conspiracies?
Zaac
Well-Known Member
Gosh, that's even worse. I just don't see how the "Will of the people" Is somehow thwarted if the majority of the people didn't will him.
Kasich is staying in because he believes he has the best chance to win the White House, based on current polls. The voters in the next primary states can choose to accept or reject this. If it should be "left to the people" then why should he forced out? Let the voters decide.
Regarding the other candidates' delegates, each state party is a bit different. From what I understand, some require that they vote for their candidate on the first ballot, others do not. However, it will be hardball politicking - which is nothing new.
Lastly, the photo with Trump's wife was way over the line by the super PAC. However, the response from Trump was even more childish, showing side by side spousal pictures. Really? And now, we have the NE (who has endorsed Trump) coming out with their story on Cruz.
Regarding the other candidates' delegates, each state party is a bit different. From what I understand, some require that they vote for their candidate on the first ballot, others do not. However, it will be hardball politicking - which is nothing new.
Lastly, the photo with Trump's wife was way over the line by the super PAC. However, the response from Trump was even more childish, showing side by side spousal pictures. Really? And now, we have the NE (who has endorsed Trump) coming out with their story on Cruz.
- Kasich is nothing but delusional dead weight.
Let's use your poker analogy. Seven card stud. Kasich has an 8 and a Jack in the hole and a Jack, 2, 4, 8 showing. So two pair, possible full house. There are no other Jacks or 8's showing anywhere. Trump has a King, Ace in the hole and two Aces, 7, 5 showing. So three Aces. Why should Kasich drop out when he still has a shot at winning? Sure, Trump has three Aces, and is leading at this point of the game.
You have failed to show that the rules are being manipulated. Please show how that is being done.
Got a link for this allegation? Let's say it is true. Why doesn't Mr. "Art of the Deal" Trump, out-negotiate these Unity Republicans?
Once again (and please write this down) Trump has never won a state with more than 49% of the vote. He's never gotten more than half the voters anywhere. So, he's never had the "will of the people" behind him. And he wouldn't get half of these delegates you claim are being "tampered" with.
Once again (and please write this down) Trump has never won a state with more than 49% of the vote. He's never gotten more than half the voters anywhere. So, he's never had the "will of the people" behind him.
There you go again....
Trump has never won a state with more than 49% of the vote. He's never gotten more than half the voters anywhere. He's never had a majority.
LOL! You are begging the question. You have not shown the rules are being manipulated.
Trump has never won a state with a majority. The rules exist PRECISELY in case of a situation where a candidate comes to the convention without a majority.
I'm shocked! Shocked! That politics is a dirty game. Maybe Trump shouldn't have played?
You keep saying the rules are being manipulated yet you have never shown how this is being done.
I suppose if you keep saying "cheat" and "manipulate" enough times you can fool yourself into believing it is happening.
Even so, what is stopping Mr. ("We Don't Win Anymore") Trump from figuring out a way to win? I would think outsmarting some political science hacks should be child's play for a Wharton School of Business Graduate that wrote THE BOOK on negotiating.
There is no way that Kasich is siphoning votes away from Trump. He is siphoning them away from Cruz. Kasich is doing Trump a favor by staying in since it is making it harder for Cruz.
Now I have no respect for him doing that, but I figure it is helping Trump not Cruz which annoys me to no end.
Who are you referring to when you say "founders" ?
If you mean the founders of this country, they never wanted a 2 party system but here we are.
If you mean the founders of the GOP well considering how much both the GOP and the Democrats have morphed and changed over the last 150+ years its a bit hard to refer back to them and what they would want. But I think we can safely say that Lincoln would not be a fan of Trump.
Though a small one, there is the chance that he can still take the nomination in a brokered convention. That is his only hope, as I understand things.
I doubt a brokered convention will be a peaceful one.
Like what? Do you think there will be fistfights on the floor? Protests in the streets? What, exactly?
On Fox News last night Kasich said that he would at very least keep Trump from the magic 1237 number and force a brokered convention.
HankD
Zaac
Well-Known Member
Especially if all these concealed weapons folks decide they are gonna come packin' no matter what the center says.
All of these guys need to start acting their age.
I agree Rev, it's like a middle school brawl and its bringing contempt on all of them.
HankD