Do people which commit suicide automatically go to hell?

[standingfirminChrist]

Jim,
If a person commits suicide, he or she is murdering self.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Homocide is the murder of another individual.

Suicide is the murder of self.

 

[Jim1999]

I know of no respectable dictionary that defines suicide as murder.

You also apply a divine penalty that wavered throughout the scripture. David was never punished for the murders he comitted! Interpretations of scripture must be context specific, then compared with other scriptures when determining doctrines.

Sorry, no pass from me.

Cheers,

Jim

 

[Claudia_T]

I know of no respectable dictionary that defines suicide as murder.

You also apply a divine penalty that wavered throughout the scripture. David was never punished for the murders he comitted! Interpretations of scripture must be context specific, then compared with other scriptures when determining doctrines.

Sorry, no pass from me.

Cheers,

Jim

Jim!

David's child died because of the things he did. remember?

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Try Webster's 1828...

SU'ICIDE, n. L. suicidium; se and coedo, to slay.

1. Self-murder; the act of designedly destroying one's own life. To constitute suicide, the person must be of years of discretion and of sound mind.
2. One guilty of self-murder; a felo de se.

As for having to be of sound mind, again my argument woudl be the person had enough presence of mind to know the gun or rope or other means would end his or her life; ergo... a sound mind.

 

[Marcia]

The question behind this one is whether one can lose their salvation. I say no. And I say no, suicide does not mean a believer will go to hell.

If you go to hell, then it's because you have not had faith in Christ. And yes, people who have trusted Christ can become despondent and kill themselves. Clinical depression is an illness and involves chemical imbalances.

I don't think I will debate this - just wanted to post my view. It's pointless debating this with people who think you can lose your salvation or who think if you kill yourself then you are not saved.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Here is an interesting passage...

Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live? But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die. Yet ye say, The way of the Lord is not equal. Hear now, O house of Israel; Is not my way equal? are not your ways unequal? When a righteous man turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and dieth in them; for his iniquity that he hath done shall he die. Again, when the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness that he hath committed, and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul alive. Because he considereth, and turneth away from all his transgressions that he hath committed, he shall surely live, he shall not die.

Now we know one cannot lose his or her salvation, but this would indicate that one who commits suicide (it is a transgression of the law 'Thou shalt not kill), will face judgment for that transgression. This tells me that this person who dies in abominations will not enter eternal life, but will spend eternity in hell.

Each one of us know the christian, the true believer in Christ will not be judged for our sins, but will give account for our works. Suicide is not a work, but sin. It is transgression of the law. The Word clearly shows the righteous who dies in his transgression will be judged for that transgression.

No arguments here. I believe the Word of God.

 

[Marcia]

Now we know one cannot lose his or her salvation, but this would indicate that one who commits suicide (it is a transgression of the law 'Thou shalt not kill), will face judgment for that transgression. This tells me that this person who dies in abominations will not enter eternal life, but will spend eternity in hell.

Each one of us know the christian, the true believer in Christ will not be judged for our sins, but will give account for our works. Suicide is not a work, but sin. It is transgression of the law. The Word clearly shows the righteous who dies in his transgression will be judged for that transgression.

No arguments here. I believe the Word of God.

So not all our sins are forgiven on the cross? Christians can't transgress the law, or if they do, they are not saved? Then you have something in common with Claudia. You should read the passages from Col and Gal I posted for her on the SDA thread.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Marcia,

We sin everyday. If we say we have no sin, we do not the truth. The thing is, do we hide the sin? or do we confess it? Can one confess a sin after death?

 

[standingfirminChrist]

If one sins, and is not remorseful, does not repent, does not confess one's sins, can it truly be said that one was saved just because that one made a profession of faith in Christ years before?

The Lord chastens whom he loves. If one does not feel the chastening hand of the Lord, I would say that one did not have a born again experience. That he or she had a form of godliness, but denied the power thereof... Jesus Christ.

An empty profession of faith.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

I know of no respectable dictionary that defines suicide as murder.

You also apply a divine penalty that wavered throughout the scripture. David was never punished for the murders he comitted! Interpretations of scripture must be context specific, then compared with other scriptures when determining doctrines.

Sorry, no pass from me.

Cheers,

Jim

David was definitely punished for the murders. He lost children. And you seem to forget that David also repented of the murders. Read Psalm 51 in your spare time... no, make it a point to make time to read that chapter. You will see a repentant David crying before the Lord, broken.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

To say a suicide will be accepted of God and welcomed into the Kingdom speaks directly against not just the clear teachings of 1 John 3:15 and Revelation 21:8, but more Biblical truths.


How can one endure to the end when one has committed suicide? (Matthew 24:13).


How can one who commits suicide be abiding in Christ?(John 15:1-6; 1 John 3:15).



How can one continue in goodness while committing suicide?(Romans 11:22).



How can a suicide be still holding fast the Word? (1 Corinthians 15:2).



How is a suicide be said to be holding to the hope of the gospel? (Colossians 1:23).



How is a suicide holding fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm to the end? (Hebrews 3:6).



How is a suicide holding the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end? (Hebrews 3:14).



How is a suicide turning to and listening to God? (Hebrews 12:25).


How are they overcoming the world (1 John 5:4),



Instead, they are being overcome by the world and the devil (1 Peter 5:8; 1 John 5:18).



Suicidal people will end up in hell if they die in such a state. Such people are not saved.

 

[Claudia_T]

David was definitely punished for the murders. He lost children. And you seem to forget that David also repented of the murders. Read Psalm 51 in your spare time... no, make it a point to make time to read that chapter. You will see a repentant David crying before the Lord, broken.

Thats not the point, if you commit suicide there is no repentance and you have already committed murder... namely, murdering yourself

 

[Shiloh]

How can one endure to the end when one has committed lies? (Matthew 24:13).


How can one who commits lies be abiding in Christ?(John 15:1-6; 1 John 3:15).



How can one continue in goodness while committing lies?(Romans 11:22).



How can a liar be still holding fast the Word? (1 Corinthians 15:2).



How is a liar be said to be holding to the hope of the gospel? (Colossians 1:23).



How is a liar holding fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm to the end? (Hebrews 3:6).



How is a liar holding the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end? (Hebrews 3:14).



How is a lying turning to and listening to God? (Hebrews 12:25).


How are they overcoming the world (1 John 5:4),



Instead, they are being overcome by the world and the devil (1 Peter 5:8; 1 John 5:18).



Lying people will end up in hell if they die in such a state. Such people are not saved.

Now before you jump to conclusions remember income tax time is coming up. Remember standing the Bible tells us in IJohn 3:9 that a saved person doesn't commit sin! Do you live without sinning? Look at this,
Mat 5:31 It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement:
Mat 5:32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.
I don't know if you or your wife had been married before but is so, what do you do with this? The sin (and I believe it is a sin to kill ones self) you are talking about is not what the Bible calls "murder with malice". A Christian can and there have been some that have have taken their own life but that is not the unpardonable sin.

 

[Claudia_T]

How can one endure to the end when one has committed lies? (Matthew 24:13).


How can one who commits lies be abiding in Christ?(John 15:1-6; 1 John 3:15).



How can one continue in goodness while committing lies?(Romans 11:22).



How can a liar be still holding fast the Word? (1 Corinthians 15:2).



How is a liar be said to be holding to the hope of the gospel? (Colossians 1:23).



How is a liar holding fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm to the end? (Hebrews 3:6).



How is a liar holding the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end? (Hebrews 3:14).



How is a lying turning to and listening to God? (Hebrews 12:25).


How are they overcoming the world (1 John 5:4),



Instead, they are being overcome by the world and the devil (1 Peter 5:8; 1 John 5:18).



Lying people will end up in hell if they die in such a state. Such people are not saved.

Now before you jump to conclusions remember income tax time is coming up. Remember standing the Bible tells us in IJohn 3:9 that a saved person doesn't commit sin! Do you live without sinning? Look at this,
Mat 5:31 It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement:
Mat 5:32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.
I don't know if you or your wife had been married before but is so, what do you do with this? The sin (and I believe it is a sin to kill ones self) you are talking about is not what the Bible calls "murder with malice". A Christian can and there have been some that have have taken their own life but that is not the unpardonable sin.

So then you are saying the Bible nulls itself out? and asking us to disregard everything that it says in the way of admonitions and warnings?

because after all "we are all sinners"?


Claudia

 

[rbell]

So SFIC, how 'bout giving us a list of sins that God says, that if we commit, we are not saved?

You still can't fix the tension you've created by your interpretation...

OK, let's do this:

You're on the cell phone with someone, going down the road. You tell a lie...right then, you're in an accident, and you are killed.

By your logic, you're going to hell. Why? Because you're a liar, and you haven't asked forgiveness.

You'll disagree with my example, but this is exactly your logical premise here.

Sorry...that won't fly.

 

[Amy.G]

Well, at least we know now what the unpardonable sin is...suicide. At least by SFIC's definition.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Thats not the point, if you commit suicide there is no repentance and you have already committed murder... namely, murdering yourself

Exactly, Claudia. There is no repentance after suicide. None that will be heard.

People can mock and jest all they want, but it is the Word of God. There are enough Scriptures in the Word to reveal that suicide is not of God, that it is following a different shepherd other than Christ, that God's Word is Truth and if He allowed a murderer into His Kingdom, He would be a lair. God cannot lie. Suicide is murder, self-murder. All murderers will have their part in the lake of fire.

 

[Claudia_T]

Exactly, Claudia. There is no repentance after suicide. None that will be heard.

People can mock and jest all they want, but it is the Word of God. There are enough Scriptures in the Word to reveal that suicide is not of God, that it is following a different shepherd other than Christ, that God's Word is Truth and if He allowed a murderer into His Kingdom, He would be a lair. God cannot lie. Suicide is murder, self-murder. All murderers will have their part in the lake of fire.

It is self-murder and besides that, I think it would probably fall under the category of "the fearful and the unbelieving".

If you cant just accept that for what it says then why not do that with the rest of the Bible?

 

[Amy.G]

What is murder? Is it the same as killing? If an intruder comes in my house and threatens my family with a weapon and I shoot him, is that murder? Is it murder when a soldier kills the enemy? Is it murder when I squash that black widow spider hiding under a rock?
Murder is an evil that begins in the heart as hatred. Remember what Jesus said..
"For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies."