Thomas Helwys
New Member
I know I referenced scripture generally, but I thought that was sufficient because I don't see anywhere in scripture that humans cannot choose.
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Do we all have the SAME Free Will To choose As Adam Had?
- Thread starter Yeshua1
- Start date
I know I referenced scripture generally, but I thought that was sufficient because I don't see anywhere in scripture that humans cannot choose.
Alive in Christ
New Member
Yes.
.....
I don't either, but the choosing I see is at odds with my description of libertarian freedom. The choosing I see is genuine as it is what the agent most wants to do. Where you and I will disagree is when we discuss why the agent wants to do one thing or another.
canadyjd
Well-Known Member
I guess you need to define "free" will. I know we have human will, and we do make choices, but that will is not "free" from outside and inside influences.
Adam and Eve had "free" will in the sense they were not influenced by sin, and yet they were not "free" from outside influence, since Satan tempted Eve and then Eve led her husband into rebellion.
Someone said we have the ability to choose what is right. Isn't that what Satan told Eve (right after telling her she wouldn't surely die)... that if she ate of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil she would be "like God" knowing good and evil, implying, IMHO, that she would have the ability to choose good rather than evil without God's help?
So, no, I don't think we have "free will" like Adam. "Free will" is an illusion, a lie, a fabrication of Satan to trick mankind into trusting themselves and their own abilities instead of trusting God....IMHO.
peace to you
raying:
Adam and Eve had "free" will in the sense they were not influenced by sin, and yet they were not "free" from outside influence, since Satan tempted Eve and then Eve led her husband into rebellion.
Someone said we have the ability to choose what is right. Isn't that what Satan told Eve (right after telling her she wouldn't surely die)... that if she ate of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil she would be "like God" knowing good and evil, implying, IMHO, that she would have the ability to choose good rather than evil without God's help?
So, no, I don't think we have "free will" like Adam. "Free will" is an illusion, a lie, a fabrication of Satan to trick mankind into trusting themselves and their own abilities instead of trusting God....IMHO.
peace to you
raying:Adam was created pure/innocent, so he had true free will to choose, he chose badly, and since the fall, we now have received sin natures as a result and are free to chose, but limited in whatwe can actually still choose to do!
that Bondgae of the human will thing, as Luther explained!