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Do we really have free choice?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by reformedbeliever, Dec 21, 2006.

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  1. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

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    1. How about if we pray for God to open your mind to the truth of God? Dear Lord, please show mercy on Helen and open her mind to the truth, if it be your will. Amen.:thumbs:

    2. The bible admonishes us to correct false doctrine with Scripture. Therefore, it is a matter again of obedience to God.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
    #61 Joseph_Botwinick, Dec 21, 2006
  2. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    Now that I hear the right terminology let me see if I understand what you just said. That God does indeed predestinate the majority of His creation to go to Hell?

    Reformed you are not supposed to shout, especially when you scold someone else for their remarks.
     
    #62 Brother Bob, Dec 21, 2006
  3. Helen

    Helen <img src =/Helen2.gif>

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    Don't you think God's power would have been shown no matter what Pharaoh chose to do? If Pharaoh had, indeed, allowed the Israelites to go peacefully, would that have diminished God's power or His ability to show it?
     
    #63 Helen, Dec 21, 2006
  4. reformedbeliever

    reformedbeliever New Member

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    Try to control it and we will try to control our disgust with your eisegesis.
     
    #64 reformedbeliever, Dec 21, 2006
  5. J.D.

    J.D. Active Member
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    Helen likes to derail debates with sentimental stories. Better get your hanky out.
     
    #65 J.D., Dec 21, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 21, 2006
  6. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

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    Whatever God chooses is always perfect, right, holy and just and magnifies his glory. We could play what if games all day. The fact of the matter is that he did not choose for Pharoah to let the Israelites go.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
    #66 Joseph_Botwinick, Dec 21, 2006
  7. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    Raised him up from what to where. It don't say he created him for that but raised him up. Could that be to the status of ruler?
     
    #67 Brother Bob, Dec 21, 2006
  8. reformedbeliever

    reformedbeliever New Member

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    You will have to ask Him Helen.
     
    #68 reformedbeliever, Dec 21, 2006
  9. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

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    Sooooooooo True! :laugh:

    Joseph Botwinick
     
    #69 Joseph_Botwinick, Dec 21, 2006
  10. Helen

    Helen <img src =/Helen2.gif>

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    1. How about if we pray for God to open your mind to the truth of God? Dear Lord, please show mercy on Helen and open her mind to the truth, if it be your will. Amen.

    I prayed for that when I first came in contact with Calvinism. The Lord did show me the truth -- that it is an utterly false doctrine that denigrates His character.

    2. The bible admonishes us to correct false doctrine with Scripture. Therefore, it is a matter again of obedience to God.

    Then you certainly won't mind my doing it.

    On the other hand, if God has predestined my every action and thought and desire and word, then obedience is not even a real option, is it? I will do what I was programmed to do, which is, of course, being obedient to my programming.

    Calvinism makes mash of the creation of man and the character of God.
     
    #70 Helen, Dec 21, 2006
  11. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    J.D. you just run in and throw a little gas on the fire and run don't you?
     
    #71 Brother Bob, Dec 21, 2006
  12. Helen

    Helen <img src =/Helen2.gif>

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    When all else fails, go for ad hominems. It shows the absolute bankruptcy of your stance when that is all you have left.
     
    #72 Helen, Dec 21, 2006
  13. reformedbeliever

    reformedbeliever New Member

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    IF you read the OP Helen it points out that this is not just a reformed problem. Do you believe God is omniscient?
     
    #73 reformedbeliever, Dec 21, 2006
  14. Helen

    Helen <img src =/Helen2.gif>

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    I not only read it, I was the first to respond. Remember?
     
    #74 Helen, Dec 21, 2006
  15. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

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    I think it would be great if you would read the scripture and correct your false man-centered theology. I am not holding my breath, but crazier things have happened because of the intervention of the Almighty Sovereign God of the universe.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
    #75 Joseph_Botwinick, Dec 21, 2006
  16. J.D.

    J.D. Active Member
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    Speaking of running, I must run off to bed now.:sleep:

    The great thing about forums is that there's always tomorrow to get the truth into you!

    Night night!
     
    #76 J.D., Dec 21, 2006
  17. reformedbeliever

    reformedbeliever New Member

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    Excuse me? Where did I shout?
     
    #77 reformedbeliever, Dec 21, 2006
  18. Helen

    Helen <img src =/Helen2.gif>

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    OK, Joseph, pick your Scripture -- one at a time if you don't mind. And then we can discuss what it means in context.

    Keep in mind that, according to your doctrine, I will not be able to help what I think or do or say....
     
    #78 Helen, Dec 21, 2006
  19. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    Depend on God don't it?


    shout
    Rom 9:17 For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, "For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I might show my power in you, and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth."
     
    #79 Brother Bob, Dec 21, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 21, 2006
  20. reformedbeliever

    reformedbeliever New Member

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    Your response was not an answer to the question at all Helen. You seem to think this is a problem for only the Calvinist.
     
    #80 reformedbeliever, Dec 21, 2006
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