Do you think you would confess Jesus even if this means death?

[xdisciplex]

Do you think you could confess Jesus in a life or death situation with a pistol pointed at you?
What if you would become totally scared and deny Jesus? I mean I am scared of things which are much less scary than death. In such a situation I would most likely freak out and get an anxiety attack.
But if you deny Jesus you'll also feel terrible and the bible also says if you deny Jesus then he will deny you. But what if you try to force yourself to confess Jesus only because you're scared that if you deny him you go to hell? Then what drives you would be the fear of hell and not the love to Jesus.
But even if you love Jesus doesn't mean that you couldn't deny him. Peter also denied him. I think nobody can really say "Yes, I would confess him even if they cut me into pieces". Maybe you feel like this at this moment,sitting in front of your computer. But supposing this might ever happen then everything might be different. Imagine you sit in church and suddenly men with weapons run into the church and point a gun at you then what would you do? In such a situation there is no time to think, it's either yes or no.

 

[music4Him]

This did happen at a school several years ago and a young lady when asked if she believed in Jesus (and knowing the consequences) said yes. The disciples knew the consequences but they knew what Jesus told them too. Just as we can read the bible and know also.

Matt. 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

 

[xdisciplex]

Yes, I also know what the bible says. The bible says a lot of things.
The bible also says do not worry. Does this mean you never worry?
I worry.
And only because the bible says we shall not fear death doesn't mean I no longer fear death.

 

[Magnetic Poles]

This did happen at a school several years ago and a young lady when asked if she believed in Jesus (and knowing the consequences) said yes.

Actually, if you are speaking of Cassie Bernall who died at Columbine High School, it didn't actually happen. It was at first erroneously reported the way you describe, but eyewitnesses said it was actually another girl, one who Klebold & Harris let live, who said yes. This doesn't denigrate Cassie's memory, but it didn't stop her mom from exploiting her daughter's memory by writing a book about it.

What would I do? Discretion is the better part of valor. Why should I let a deranged killer have an excuse to kill me. Tell 'em whatever they want to hear, live to witness another day. There is no honor is foolishly dying. Words spoken under threat of death are meaningless, much like the captives who were beheaded in Iraq after being forced to speak out against the U.S. I have no desire to become a martyr.

 

[webdog]

What would I do? Discretion is the better part of valor. Why should I let a deranged killer have an excuse to kill me. Tell 'em whatever they want to hear, live to witness another day. There is no honor is foolishly dying. Words spoken under threat of death are meaningless, much like the captives who were beheaded in Iraq after being forced to speak out against the U.S. I have no desire to become a martyr.

I agree. I don't think "denying Christ" is in reference to a situation like this. A crazy guy looking for a reason to pull the trigger is just looking for an excuse to justify it in his head. You tell them what they want to hear so the chances of seeing your wife and kids increase. Denying Christ, biblically, is what the Pharisees did, and what atheist today do.

 

[music4Him]

Although we haven't heard much about them, there were Christian women who were martyred for the cause of Christianity in the early church. In the first 300 years after the death of Christ, a Roman lady named Feliciitatis, described as a devout Christian with shining virtues, was beheaded with the same sword that killed her three youngest sons. Her four elder sons, all of them educated by their mother, also died as martyrs for their belief in Christ.

Another example was a lady named Blandina. She was suspended on a piece of wood affixed in the ground and placed in an area to be food for wild beasts. Her earnest prayers both encouraged the group that was being martyred with her, but also kept the wild beasts away from her. The guards returned her to the prison. Again she was brought out to be tortured and her faith so outraged the crowd that she and the young person (who was with her) were greatly strengthen. They were unmercifully punished. She was finally slain by a sword and is now listed among the Christian women martyrs.

There were others as well. Denisa, a sixteen-year-old, was beheaded for her faith. Cecilia was placed in a scalding bath for several minutes and then beheaded. Felicitas, married and quite far along in pregnancy, and Perpetua, were stripped naked and thrown to a wild bull to be gored, but not killed. Then they were beheaded. All of these women were martyred simply for confessing a faith in Christ.

In the Reformation (1200-1500), the issues for martyrdom were related to Catholicism verses Protestantism. Protestants were martyred for not embracing the Catholic faith. In this time period men, women, and children were all martyred with the same degree of disdain throughout England, France Germany, the Netherlands, Scotland, and Bohemia. The most famous of all Christian women martyrs, Joan of Arc, was martyred in this age, although some might argue that her mission was as much political as religious. Joan made references to earlier Christian women martyrs, Saint Catharine and Saint Margaret, who gave her inspiration for her mission. Joan started her objectives at the age of 13 saying that God had directed to do free the French from the English rule. She was tried and actually found innocent, but was eventually burned at the stake.

Martyrdom has existed and will continue to exist as long as there is religious persecution. Webster's Dictionary states that a martyr is anyone who is either killed for refusing to deny his or her faith or one who suffers greatly for the cause. People all over the world are suffering greatly because they refuse to deny their faith in Christ, and some are killed. Foreign missionaries are abducted for preaching the Gospel of Christ. Gracia Burnham is one example of a modern day Christian woman martyr. Although her husband gave his life for the cause of Christ, Gracia was held as a prisoner for over a year. She lived in tortuous conditions and suffered many indignities, terror, disease, and witnessed the deaths of many of her fellow captives after being kidnapped by Abu Sayyaf, a militant Islamic group.

http://www.allaboutfollowingjesus.org/christian-women-martyrs-faq.htm

Rom 8:31 What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?

 

[xdisciplex]

But what about Peter?
His situation was exactly the same.
One the one hand you have a point because simply dying because you say yes when you know that saying yes means that you will die almost seems like suicide but on the other hand saying no means denying Jesus. I don't know if this makes Jesus happy.

 

[Brother Bob]

To be honest I don't think Christ has asked us to give our life for Him but give our lives to Him. It is a good question and I suspect every Christian has thought about it but no one could really give a sure answer until put to the test. We think we will never be put to that test but with the weapons in the world today, who knows?

 

[Tom Butler]

I agree with Dr. Bob. We know what we'd like to do under those circumstances, but we really won't know until we're faced with a real-life situation.

 

[Link]

I agree. I don't think "denying Christ" is in reference to a situation like this. A crazy guy looking for a reason to pull the trigger is just looking for an excuse to justify it in his head. You tell them what they want to hear so the chances of seeing your wife and kids increase. Denying Christ, biblically, is what the Pharisees did, and what atheist today do.

This sounds like a Muslim view of denying Islam. They are allowed to do that to save their life. We aren't Mohammadans.

Jesus said if you deny me before men, I will deny you before My Father in heaven. This saying soon found application for many early believers. The apostles could have denied Christ and got the Pharisees off their back. But they would rather be beaten and persecuted in other ways.

Paul probably tried to get Christians to deny Christ when he compelled them to blaspheme.

Many early Christians stood before a ruler and were given an opportunity to deny Christ, and chose to die (sometimes after bizaar and sick torture, publicly) instead. This was a bit different from a lunatic with a gun, since the ruler had the power of the state behind him. But these kind of things, sometimes without the power of the state, happen today. Here in Indonesia, there have been some conflicts between races and religious groups where Mslims asked Christians their religion and things of that nature. There is a kind of Christian report, or perhaps urban legend, about a 15 year old boy that got his 'tangan' (hands or arms) cut of by some Muluku Mslims who asked him to deny Christ. They compelled him to deny his faith, and cut off one 'tangan.' Then he confessed Christ. They cut the other one off. he confessed Christ again. Finally the delivered a death blow to his belly.

If the early Christians took Jesus' words seriously, shouldn't we follow their example?

I am not really worried about denying Christ in this kind of situation. What better way is there to go? I think it can be harder to live for Christ in the small things day to day than being confronted with the opportunity for 'heroic martyrdom'.

 

[Jim1999]

During the Chinese Boxer Rebellion, a Christian woman was being executed. Her final words to her executioner was: "I am dying for a great cause, Jesus Christ. What are you living for?"

I agree we don't know in advance. We would like to think we would respond correctly. Remember, even that great disciple Peter denied knowing the Lord three times at His very execution.

Cheers,

Jim

PS. There is an old saying, "If you 'suppose' yourself into a situation, you best 'suppose' yourself out of it. That is all that remains; a supposition.

 

[webdog]

This sounds like a Muslim view of denying Islam. They are allowed to do that to save their life. We aren't Mohammadans.

Jesus said if you deny me before men, I will deny you before My Father in heaven. This saying soon found application for many early believers. The apostles could have denied Christ and got the Pharisees off their back. But they would rather be beaten and persecuted in other ways.

Paul probably tried to get Christians to deny Christ when he compelled them to blaspheme.

Many early Christians stood before a ruler and were given an opportunity to deny Christ, and chose to die (sometimes after bizaar and sick torture, publicly) instead. This was a bit different from a lunatic with a gun, since the ruler had the power of the state behind him. But these kind of things, sometimes without the power of the state, happen today. Here in Indonesia, there have been some conflicts between races and religious groups where Mslims asked Christians their religion and things of that nature. There is a kind of Christian report, or perhaps urban legend, about a 15 year old boy that got his 'tangan' (hands or arms) cut of by some Muluku Mslims who asked him to deny Christ. They compelled him to deny his faith, and cut off one 'tangan.' Then he confessed Christ. They cut the other one off. he confessed Christ again. Finally the delivered a death blow to his belly.

If the early Christians took Jesus' words seriously, shouldn't we follow their example?

I am not really worried about denying Christ in this kind of situation. What better way is there to go? I think it can be harder to live for Christ in the small things day to day than being confronted with the opportunity for 'heroic martyrdom'.

A muslim view?:laugh:

Appeasing a madman looking for an excuse to kill you is not denying Christ. The greek literally means to disown. On the other hand, if we are told to worship another god to spare our lives, to cooperate to this would be denying Christ.

 

[Jim1999]

We have an old battlefield concept of retreating so we can live to fight another day. We have not surrendered the fight, we have simply regrouped for future battle.

Sometimes, even in the Christian religion, we must retreat so we may live to present this truth again.

Not having lived in a suppressive country, I haven't a clue how I would react. I never lived under a repressive ungodly communism. I came close to Nazi terrorism, but still never experenced it first-hand. Many denied being a Jew so that they might live. In England, we didn't circumcize male children during the war years in case Hitler made it to England....was this wrong too? or wisdom?

Cheers,

Jim