Doctrinal Defintions of Faith

[npetreley]

Npet:

The hard documented evidence is troubling to you. I can see that.

You think you can see that? No wonder you're having trouble understanding what JM is saying.

It does not serve your cause well when to try to portray a doctrinal discussion as though it is a personality war.

That's funny. That's pretty much what I was saying to you.

No wonder people don't want to debate you. You debate from the perspective of an imaginary world.

 

[npetreley]

Amy G., thank you for the link to J. Mac's website.
http://www.gty.org/media/pdf/Lordship_Salvation.pdf

Lou M.: After reading what J. Mac says I see the following.

He affirms salvation is by grace through faith with no human works involved.

He affirms there is no "preparation work" before salvation.

He says what I thought he was saying from the quotes you gave, that commitment to follow Jesus Christ always accompanies true saving faith.

He absolutely does not say a person must have an "upfront" commitment to follow Christ prior to salvation. In fact, he clearly rejects the notion.

Concerning the James 4 quote. You base argument on J. Mac calling v.7-7-10 an invitation to salvation, whereas James was written to believers.

But the context of James 4 goes directly to J. Mac's argument that following Christ accompanies salvation. James has already scolded the professing believers as being "friends of the world and enemies of God". V. 6 says "God is opposed to the proud, but gives grace to the humble".

James is clearly speaking here of two different kinds of people. God is opposed to one (unsaved, proud, and of the world) and to one God is giving grace to (the humble, not of the world, saved).

It is in that context that the verses 7-10 come. James is concerned with what saving faith should look like, how it is expressed among the believers. v.7-10 expand on that. J. Mac's exposition of the passage is quite good, and certainly reasonable in the context given.

I believe you are misrepresenting what J. Mac says on this issue.

peace to youraying:

I agree with everything you've stated here. I think Lou is having a perspective problem. He's a rebel in search of a cause and manufacturing it where there is none. Sells books, though, I guess.

 

[Lou Martuneac]

canadyjd:

Sorry, but you are wrong and/or mistaken on virtually every point.

My book of nearly 300 pages thoroughly and irrefutibly documents that LS, including JM's interpretation, is a false, works based, man-centered message that frusrates grace (Gal. 2:21).

I do not have time to reproduce all of it here. You and any objective reader can view my blog for much more detail on this issue. I might suggest these as starters:

The Relationship Between God's Grace & Lordship Legalism

John MacArthur's Discipleship Gospel

Impossible Decision

Kind regards,


LM

 

[Lou Martuneac]

You think you can see that? No wonder you're having trouble understanding what JM is saying.

Npet:

Your emotions are showing again. You must learn to rein them in if you are to be taken seriously.


LM

 

[npetreley]

Npet:

Your emotions are showing again. You must learn to rein them in if you are to be taken seriously.

LM

You'll never take me seriously, regardless, so why should I care what you think about me? Go back to peddling your book by taking the quotes of Godly men out of context.

 

[webdog]

Npet:

Your emotions are showing again. You must learn to rein them in if you are to be taken seriously.


LM

Don't hold your breath. Vitriol and rudeness runs rampant in just about every one of his posts. Consider yourself blessed if he puts you on ignore. It has been a peaceful couple weeks for me.

 

[Dr. Bob]

Think it's time to shut this down. All heat, no light :BangHead: