Doctrine of Grace/Calvinisim In Hymns and Songs

[Blammo]

I hear the Savior say,
“Thy strength indeed is small;
Child of weakness, watch and pray,
Find in Me thine all in all.”

Refrain
Jesus paid it all,
All to Him I owe;
Sin had left a crimson stain,
He washed it white as snow.

For nothing good have I
Whereby Thy grace to claim,
I’ll wash my garments white
In the blood of Calv’ry’s Lamb. (Amen)

Refrain

And now complete in Him
My robe His righteousness,
Close sheltered ’neath His side,
I am divinely blest.

Refrain

Lord, now indeed I find
Thy power and Thine alone,
Can change the leper’s spots
And melt the heart of stone.

Refrain

When from my dying bed
My ransomed soul shall rise,
“Jesus died my soul to save,” (Only if you were arbitrarily picked?)
Shall rend the vaulted skies.

Refrain

And when before the throne
I stand in Him complete,
I’ll lay my trophies down
All down at Jesus’ feet.

Refrain

Another great hymn of the FAITH

 

[Blammo]

By Daniel Whittle (I don't know what his theology was, but the song is perfectly calvinistic, in fact, I don't see how an arminian can honestly sing this song)

I KNOW WHOM I HAVE BELIEVED

I know not why God's wondrous grace
to me he hath made known,
nor why, unworthy, Christ in love
redeemed me for his own.

Refrain:
But I know whom I have believed,
and am persuaded that he is able
to keep that which I've committed
unto him against that day.

I know not how this saving faith
to me he did impart,
nor how believing in his word
wrought peace within my heart.
(Refrain)

I know not how the Spirit moves,
convincing us of sin,
revealing Jesus through the word,
creating faith in him. (That's good, Amen!!!)
(Refrain)

I know not when my Lord may come,
at night or noonday fair,
nor if I walk the vale with him,
or meet him in the air.
(Refrain)

The title says it all

 

[Blammo]

Charles Wesley was not a calvinist but this verse of the great hymn is in agreement with calvinism:

Long my imprisoned spirit lay,
fast bound in sin and nature's night;
Thine eye diffused a quickening ray;
I woke, the dungeon flame with light;
my chains fell off, my heart was free;
I rose, went forth, and followed thee.

Sounds like he was a slave to sin, heard the good news, and believed. ("I rose, went forth, and followed thee.")

 

[2BHizown]

Yes, the writer is reflecting on the great mercy and grace of our God and looking at his salvation with great gratitude for God's gift to him!

 

[Jarthur001]

I love this hymn, though not the word of God, it is sound doctrine.

Tis a great song.

To say it is calvinistic seems funny to me. In the first verse: Who repented and won the victory in Jesus?

Salvation is though faith in God alone. Some preach easly believe as in when the preacher say..

"how many love your mother? Good..God is love. Now sign the card in front of you and your on your way to heaven."

OK...maybe its not that bad. But you get the idea. I believe the Bible teaches to have faith and believe...means you see God for who He is and want to worship Him..turn from the world....repent.

And the second verse: "then I cried dear Jesus, come and heal my broken spirit". Didn't you tell me the spirit is healed before the sinner can cry out to Jesus?

I have no idea what the song writer meant. But I can tell you how i read it. Man must see himself as a sinner...broken"...in need of Christ. Needed..not just to take man to heaven, even though in the end this will happen. But broken as a sinner, because the Holy Spirit has shown to him how worthless he is......broken and in need to be cleaned from all sins before a Holy God...broken and knowing It is Christ he needs....and with all that one has...turn...repent...Cry out to Jesus to heal us from the state of sin...and WORSHIP the King.

Man sees himself this way..when the Holy Spirit gives him understanding of mans sin state and need of Christ. Thus..the cry

IMHO...that is how the song speaks to me.

 

[Blammo]

Yes, the writer is reflecting on the great mercy and grace of our God and looking at his salvation with great gratitude for God's gift to him!

Amen, the free gift of God is eternal life by grace through faith in Christ.

 

[Blammo]

Tis a great song.


Salvation is though faith in God alone. Some preach easly believe as in when the preacher say..

"how many love your mother? Good..God is love. Now sign the card in front of you and your on your way to heaven."

OK...maybe its not that bad. But you get the idea. I believe the Bible teaches to have faith and believe...means you see God for who He is and want to worship Him..turn from the world....repent.



I have no idea what the song writer meant. But I can tell you how i read it. Man must see himself as a sinner...broken"...in need of Christ Needed..not just to take man to heaven, even though in the end this will happen. But broken as a sinner, because the Holy Spirit has shown to him how worthless he is......broken and in need to be cleaned from all sins before a Holy God...broken and knowing It is Christ he needs....and with all that one has...turn...repent...Cry out to Jesus to heal us from the state of sin...and WORSHIP the King.

Man sees himself this way..when the Holy Spirit gives him understanding of mans sin state and need of Christ. Thus..the cry

IMHO...that is how the song speaks to me.

Yes, I don't subscribe to the "take a knee, 1,2,3, now your free" kind of stuff either. I agree with what you are saying here. It is the gospel and the Holy Spirit that draw men to Christ. Showing man he is totally helpless and wicked, and showing him the way out of it. That is part of God's plan.

 

[Baptist Believer]

BTW...there are some on this very board that says it is mans duty to find God, with the grace given him...be it small or great.

Ah, but I'm sure those who would say that it is humankind's duty to reach out to God is certainly tied to the biblical truth that God has sought us first.

But I didn't want to start a debate as much as I wanted others to share songs of deep doctrine.

Same here. Just a friendly discussion.

Thanks!

 

[npetreley]

Doctrine by song lyrics

It almost seems as if some people here are trying to defend their doctrine by using song lyrics. This doesn't seem like a very intelligent approach to defending doctrine, to me.

On a related note, I know of lots of people who sing "In all I do, I honor you". I refuse to sing that song simply because I know it's not true. Similarly, I'm silent during songs that reflect free-willism.

I recommend that free-willers remain silent during songs like Amazing Grace, too. If you don't believe it, don't sing it, or you're being hypocritical.

​

 

[Brother Bob]

I recommend that free-willers remain silent during songs like Amazing Grace, too. If you don't believe it, don't sing it, or you're being hypocritical.

You mistate the belief of so called free-willers. I don't know anyone who does not believe we are saved by Grace. Do you know what Grace is? Also, there is a way to receive that Grace in your own heart and that is to believe. Without faith you can not please God.

 

[Blammo]

I recommend that free-willers remain silent during songs like Amazing Grace, too. If you don't believe it, don't sing it, or you're being hypocritical.

I find that to be rather rude.

We, who believe in free-will, know we are saved by grace. It's the "by faith" part that you keep leaving out.

 

[J.D.]

I find that to be rather rude.

We, who believe in free-will, know we are saved by grace. It's the "by faith" part that you keep leaving out.

Well, Blammo, I think you were rude too with your posts. The OP, after all, is "Doctrine of Grace/Calvinism In Hymns and Songs". You came in with an agenda to contradict our (calvinists) heart-felt opinions about these wonderful songs.

 

[webdog]

The problem I see is in "calvinism IN hymns and song". What's the purpose of hymns and songs? To worship God...not spread a theology! If these songs were written by calvinists with the sole purpose of putting good 'ole "doctrines of grace" in the words of the songs...to toot the horn of calvinists, they do not need to by in ANY hymnal! I have no problem with hymns and songs that are Bible based, not calvinist based or even "doctrines of grace" based.

 

[J.D.]

The problem I see is in "calvinism IN hymns and song". What's the purpose of hymns and songs? To worship God...not spread a theology! If these songs were written by calvinists with the sole purpose of putting good 'ole "doctrines of grace" in the words of the songs...to toot the horn of calvinists, they do not need to by in ANY hymnal! I have no problem with hymns and songs that are Bible based, not calvinist based or even "doctrines of grace" based.

Web, one's theology is one's world view. Our theology affects every thought and act in life.

Would you write a hymn that does NOT reflect your theology? I think not.

Would you say that a hymn should not include trinitarian theology? I think not.

So why can't Newton or Watts or Toplady or Cowper or Luther etc etc express their love for the Sovereign, Omnipotent Ruler of the Universe?

 

[pinoybaptist]

<snip>.....So why can't Newton or Watts or Toplady or Cowper or Luther etc etc express their love for the Sovereign, Omnipotent Ruler of the Universe?

And why can't we who are thankful for amazing, unmerited grace, Calvinist or adherent to the Doctrine of Grace, sing and/or publish what to us seems to be the true songs of Zion ?

How about these songs from the sweet psalmist of Israel :

Psalm 65
1

To the chief Musician, A Psalm and Song of David.

1.
Praise waiteth for thee, O God, in Sion: and unto thee shall the vow be performed.

2 O thou that hearest prayer, unto thee shall all flesh come.

3 Iniquities prevail against me: as for our transgressions, thou shalt purge them away.

4 Blessed is the man whom thou choosest, and causest to approach unto thee, that he may dwell in thy courts: we shall be satisfied with the goodness of thy house, even of thy holy temple.

5 By terrible things in righteousness wilt thou answer us, O God of our salvation; who art the confidence of all the ends of the earth, and of them that are afar off upon the sea:

I suppose they are unscriptural, eh ?

Yet you freewillers do not have even one song that says you came to God and repented of your sins because you have free will, or because God granted you the freedom to choose. Your theologians all fall back on grace, because eventually that is what it all amounts to. Had it not been for God's grace given in Christ before the foundation of the world, neither you nor Calvinists nor those who believe in the Doctrine of Grace me included will have any hope of and in heaven.

You can only resort to implied name calling, that those who adhere to the Doctrine of Grace, or those you call Calvinists, are proud, arrogant, self-centered sinners who think they are special, and are therefore unredeemed.

 

[pinoybaptist]

A Relatively New Song

by J.F. Parker 1901-1970

The Bride of Christ

The Bride of Christ we have today, A blessing from the Lord;
He gave her to His Son to save, and take her home above.

Chorus:

The turtledove is singing now; The winter's past and gone.
Rise up, my fair one, come away ! I'll take you home to stay.

She was His bride before she knew she had a Husband dear;
And when for her His choice was made, it caused her to draw near.

When she, adorned with all His grace, shall be exalted there,
No queen with all her glory here Was ever half so fair.

 

[npetreley]

I find that to be rather rude.

We, who believe in free-will, know we are saved by grace. It's the "by faith" part that you keep leaving out.

I'm sorry you find it to be rude. Given that we know the author had Calvinistic views, and those views are expressed in the lyrics (though not so blatantly that one couldn't twist them to mean something else) I assume that the singer would be aware of that. But since it is possible to force free-will into the lyrics, perhaps I should have chosen a song with more explicit lyrics. It would CERTAINLY be hyprocritical for free-willers to sing this one by Isaac Watts:

"Why was I made to hear His voice,
And enter while there's room;
When thousands make a wretched choice,
And rather starve than come?

"'Twas the same love the spread the feast,
That sweetly forced me in;
Else I had still refused to taste,
And perish'd in my sin."

 

[Blammo]

Well, Blammo, I think you were rude too with your posts. The OP, after all, is "Doctrine of Grace/Calvinism In Hymns and Songs". You came in with an agenda to contradict our (calvinists) heart-felt opinions about these wonderful songs.

J.D. -

Sorry I offended you. But, to claim the great hymns of the faith as Calvinist offends me. I hope you noticed I simply highlighted some of the words in the hymns, said "amen" and "praise God". I'm guessing you don't think the title of this thread was any kind of bait?

 

[Blammo]

I'm sorry you find it to be rude. Given that we know the author had Calvinistic views, and those views are expressed in the lyrics (though not so blatantly that one couldn't twist them to mean something else) I assume that the singer would be aware of that. But since it is possible to force free-will into the lyrics, perhaps I should have chosen a song with more explicit lyrics. It would CERTAINLY be hyprocritical for free-willers to sing this one by Isaac Watts:

"Why was I made to hear His voice,
And enter while there's room;
When thousands make a wretched choice,
And rather starve than come?

"'Twas the same love the spread the feast,
That sweetly forced me in;
Else I had still refused to taste,
And perish'd in my sin."

What part of those lyrics do you think I don't believe? "Forced"? If you go to cyberhymnal.org, you will find a different word in the lyrics:

’Twas the same love that spread the feast
That sweetly drew us in;
Else we had still refused to taste,
And perished in our sin.

http://www.cyberhymnal.org/htm/h/s/hsweetaw.htm

 

[Jarthur001]

The Church's one foundation​

The Church's one foundation
is Jesus Christ her Lord;
she is his new creation,
by water and the word:
from heaven he came and sought her
to be his holy bride;
with his own blood he bought her,
and for her life he died.

Elect from every nation,
yet one o'er all the earth,
her charter of salvation,
one Lord, one faith, one birth;
one holy Name she blesses,
partakes one holy food,
and to one hope she presses,
with every grace endued.

Though with a scornful wonder
men see her sore oppressed,
by schisms rent asunder,
by heresies distressed;
yet saints their watch are keeping,
their cry goes up, "How long?"
and soon the night of weeping
shall be the morn of song.

Mid toil and tribulation,
and tumult of her war
she waits the consummation
of peace for evermore;
till with the vision glorious
her longing eyes are blessed,
and the great Church victorious
shall be the Church at rest.

Yet she on earth hath union
with God, the Three in one,
and mystic sweet communion
with those whose rest is won.
O happy ones and holy!
Lord, give us grace that we
like them, the meek and lowly,
on high may dwell with thee.