Does anyone actually believe Jack Chick's theology?

[Mike McKinney]

It wouldn't have happened in real life. It just existed in Chick's mind, a caricature of any Christians who didn't accept his own theology. If you look at the rest of his tracts, his common tactics are paranoia and fear-mongering.

But you're the one who brought up the tract.

I take it you don't spend much time witnessing. It's very common for people to offer their good works as a answer to why they should go to Heaven.

 

[Humble Disciple]

Not true. There are lots of secular groups that do charitable work. The Peace Corps, Doctors Without Borders, etc.

Working for fifty years in the mission field is not the same as working in the Peace Corps or Doctors Without Borders. I've read a lot of Chick tracts over the years and I know that he resented anyone and caricatured anyone who didn't fit his own narrow theology.

The intended effect of the tract, as far as I can tell, was to promote antinomianism and fear-mongering. Otherwise, he wouldn't have quoted Matthew 7:23 out of context.

When Jesus says "Depart from me, I never knew you," he is speaking specifically to people who never followed His commandments:

Matthew 7
15 “Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. 16 By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17 Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them. 21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

 

[Salty]

HD, the Chick tract is a tale of a Northern Baptist Convention missionary.

I had an American Baptist church on my radio station - they broadcaster their Sunday Morning Service. I would listen often for technical reasons. Never ONCE, did I ever hear the plan of salvation. It was always a feel-good message. For whatever reason - that church asked me to be interm pastor. They got upset with me because I actually gave an alter call. Several in the church did NOT want any children - ie Sunday school, ect. I was told that there insurance did NOT cover children Sunday School -
I wont say that they were not saved - BUT the Bible does tell us that we shall know them by their fruits.

HD, Many non- Christian, cults and others DO carry out the commands of Christ. But that does not get them to Heaven.


HD - Just curious - what brand of Baptist are you?

 

[Lodic]

It wouldn't have happened in real life. It just existed in Chick's mind, a caricature of any Christians who didn't accept his own theology. If you look at the rest of his tracts, his common tactics are paranoia and fear-mongering.

Are your objections aimed at Chick's tracts in general, or this one in particular? Whether someone could conceivably serve as a missionary for decades without preaching Christ is not really the point. Do you believe anyone can go to Heaven based solely on their good works, or is it only based on placing their faith in Christ?

You keep using the "false prophets" passage to warn us about Chick's theology. While I'm not really a fan of his tracts, the example you provided is Biblically sound. Tell us specifically what is false doctrine in the tract.

 

[Humble Disciple]

HD, the Chick tract is a tale of a Northern Baptist Convention missionary.

What do you mean? That sounds slanderous.

 

[Humble Disciple]

Do you believe anyone can go to Heaven based solely on their good works, or is it only based on placing their faith in Christ?

Without God's grace through faith, our works cannot be pleasing to God, because otherwise they are done through a fallen, selfish motive, whether we realize it or not.

Tell us specifically what is false doctrine in the tract.

His quoting of Matthew 7:23 out of context. When Jesus says "Depart from me, I never knew you," he is speaking specifically to people who never followed His commandments:

Matthew 7
15 “Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. 16 By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17 Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them. 21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

 

[Mike McKinney]

You keep using the "false prophets" passage to warn us about Chick's theology. While I'm not really a fan of his tracts, the example you provided is Biblically sound. Tell us specifically what is false doctrine in the tract.

The theology is usually right on. It's the over the top sensationalistic style of the tracts most people object to and make fun of.

I agree with most of the theology, but sometimes I think the guy needs to switch to decaf.

 

[Mike McKinney]

His quoting of Matthew 7:23 out of context. When Jesus says "Depart from me, I never knew you," he is speaking specifically to people who never followed His commandments:

Following the commandments and doing good works is evidence of salvation, not a means of salvation.

 

[Humble Disciple]

Following the commandments and doing good works is evidence of salvation, not a means of salvation.

I don't believe that people who aren't in Christ are truly capable of performing good works.

 

[Mike McKinney]

Working for fifty years in the mission field is not the same as working in the Peace Corps or Doctors Without Borders. I've read a lot of Chick tracts over the years and I know that he resented anyone and caricatured anyone who didn't fit his own narrow theology.

You seem to be all over the place. I'm not sure if you're being intentionally disingenuous, or you're just confused.

You said that being a missionary and risking your life means somebody is saved.

When I gave examples of missionaries who risk their lives, now you're saying it's not the same thing.

The intended effect of the tract, as far as I can tell, was to promote antinomianism and fear-mongering. Otherwise, he wouldn't have quoted Matthew 7:23 out of context.

First, you have a habit of quoting verses out of context, yourself. So, should we judge your posts by the standard you judge him?

Second, pointing out the Bible's teaching that works can't save is not "antinomian".

When Jesus says "Depart from me, I never knew you," he is speaking specifically to people who never followed His commandments:

Yes, because following the commandments and doing good works is the mark of one who is saved, not the means by which one is saved.

The point you're missing is that you can have good works without the Gospel, such as the two missionaries in the tract, but you can't have the Gospel without resulting in good works.

You keep calling him antinomian, but I have more hope for a person who does not completely understand the role of the law in our salvation than a person who insists salvation is by his own law keeping and good works.

 

[Mike McKinney]

I don't believe that people who aren't in Christ are truly capable of performing good works.

And yet, the unsaved do good works all the time.

 

[Humble Disciple]

Yes, because following the commandments and doing good works is the mark of one who is saved, not the means by which one is saved.

I agree.

You keep calling him antinomian...

Yes, based on the sheer volume of Chick tracts that I've read. He had a very narrow theology and caricatured anyone who disagreed with it.

 

[Humble Disciple]

While one might not like the source, this breaks down how Chick quoted verses on good works out of context to suit his own theology and agenda:

Good works[edit]
Chick also liked to claim that good works are not the way into Heaven; he failed to explain those passages (like Psalm 62:12, Jeremiah 17:10, Romans 2:5-6, Matthew 16:27, Matthew 25:41-46, Luke 10:26-28, James 2:17, and Revelation 20:12-13) which state that good works are required for salvation.

It got really bizarre when Chick points out one part of the Bible and ignores the adjacent passages that totally undermine the very point he raised. For example, in The Chaplain Chick referred to Matthew 25:41 while ignoring Matthew 25:42-46 showing that good works are a requirement. So, he cites the following:

Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: (Matthew 25:41) (what Chick cites)

But look at what Chick omits:

For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee? Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal. (Matthew 25:42-46)

This lack of crosschecking research gets really bizarre when you compare tracts. Take Flight 144 (1998) and Somebody Goofed (2002) for example. In Flight 144 Chick has a character state "The Bible says that good works can't save anyone" but in Somebody Goofed Chick has a reference that simply says "**Rev 20:12-15". Well here is the King James version of that reference, with some boldface added for emphasis:

"And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire." (Revelation 20:12-15)

So Chick provides a reference to a passage that contradicts a claim made by an earlier tract and the really ludicrous part is that both tracts are still in print.
Jack Chick - RationalWiki

Sola scriptura, not sola Chicktura.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

What do you mean? That sounds slanderous.

It would seem you are unfamiliar with the Fundementalist\Modernist controversy in the Northern Baptist Convention (mid1920s-late 1940s). How is my remark "slanderous"? It's based on the historical record.

 

[Humble Disciple]

It would seem you are unfamiliar with the Fundementalist\Modernist controversy in the Northern Baptist Convention (mid1920s-late 1940s). How is my remark "slanderous"? It's based on the historical record.

Can you name names?

 

[Reynolds]

In this Jack Chick tract, a Christian couple is sent to eternal conscious torment in hell for actually obeying Jesus' commands to love your neighbor, serve the poor, heal the sick, make disciples of all nations, etc.:


This has to be the most absurd Bible tract I've ever seen. Does anyone actually base their soteriology on Chick tracts?

All this tract seems to do is discourage people from obeying Christ through fear and intimidation. Was Jack Chick a radical antinomian?

The tract even quotes Matthew 7:23 out of context. When Jesus says "Depart from me, I never knew you," he is speaking specifically to people who never followed His commandments:

Matthew 7
15 “Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. 16 By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17 Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them. 21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

How could Jesus be any more clear than "Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire"? (Matthew 7:19)

Jesus said that, if you love Him, you will keep His commandments (John 14:15), that except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven (Matthew 5:20) and Hebrews 12:14 says that, without holiness, no one will see the Lord. Without God's sanctifying grace, this righteousness wouldn't be possible:

I am starting to doubt your reading comprehension or your truthfulness.

You seem to start every thread with an agenda. Then you manipulate "evidence" to fit your agenda.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

Can you name names?

HD it's been over 70 years ago. I can't name any specific missionaries. But, I know that the Modernist missionaries were one of the reasons men like B.Myron Cedarholm, Robert Ketchem, Richard Weeks, Arno Q. (Sr.) and G Archer Wenigar, Richard V. Clearwaters, et al left the convention.

 

[Mike McKinney]

Yes, based on the sheer volume of Chick tracts that I've read. He had a very narrow theology and caricatured anyone who disagreed with it.

Irrelevant. You accused him of a heresy and that he caricatured people is not evidence of that heresy.

 

[Mike McKinney]

I am starting to doubt your reading comprehension or your truthfulness.

I agree. I believe he's being dishonest.

You seem to start every thread with an agenda. Then you manipulate "evidence" to fit your agenda.

I'm still waiting for him to show some evidence.

 

[Humble Disciple]

Irrelevant. You accused him of a heresy and that he caricatured people is not evidence of that heresy.

Chick frequently quotes verses out of context to fit his theology:

Good works[edit]
Chick also liked to claim that good works are not the way into Heaven; he failed to explain those passages (like Psalm 62:12, Jeremiah 17:10, Romans 2:5-6, Matthew 16:27, Matthew 25:41-46, Luke 10:26-28, James 2:17, and Revelation 20:12-13) which state that good works are required for salvation.

It got really bizarre when Chick points out one part of the Bible and ignores the adjacent passages that totally undermine the very point he raised. For example, in The Chaplain Chick referred to Matthew 25:41 while ignoring Matthew 25:42-46 showing that good works are a requirement. So, he cites the following:

Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: (Matthew 25:41) (what Chick cites)

But look at what Chick omits:

For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee? Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal. (Matthew 25:42-46)

This lack of crosschecking research gets really bizarre when you compare tracts. Take Flight 144 (1998) and Somebody Goofed (2002) for example. In Flight 144 Chick has a character state "The Bible says that good works can't save anyone" but in Somebody Goofed Chick has a reference that simply says "**Rev 20:12-15". Well here is the King James version of that reference, with some boldface added for emphasis:

"And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire." (Revelation 20:12-15)

So Chick provides a reference to a passage that contradicts a claim made by an earlier tract and the really ludicrous part is that both tracts are still in print.
Jack Chick - RationalWiki