Does God command the lost to do something they are unable to do?

[percho]

You really need to start reading verses in context. When you do that it will clear up many of your misunderstanding of scripture.

Eze 36:24 "'For I will take you out of the nations; I will gather you from all the countries and bring you back into your own land.
Eze 36:25 I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you will be clean; I will cleanse you from all your impurities and from all your idols.
Eze 36:26 I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit in you; I will remove from you your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh.

If we followed your train of thought we would have to conclude that every Jew became a devoted follower of God.

God was saying that He would give them a new outlook through an impressible heart fit for receiving the word of God.
In Ezekiel 18:31 they are commanded, "Make you a new heart and a new spirit." Here in Ezekiel 36:26 God says, "A new heart will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you." Thus the responsibility of man and the sovereign grace of God are shown to be co-existent.

We are not to sit back and wait for God to force us to believe. We are expected to us our reason to evaluate the various means by which God draws us to Himself.

Relative to: If we followed your train of thought we would have to conclude that every Jew became a devoted follower of God.

I will just post; John 3:7, Romans 11:19-36, Ezek 37

I would like to pose a question to you and to all on the board.

From Joel 2:28 And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh;
John 7:39 YLT and this he said of the Spirit, which those believing in him were about to receive; for not yet was the Holy Spirit, because Jesus was not yet glorified

On the day that took place did the dead Abraham have the Holy Spirit within him?

Gal 3:14-16 YLT that to the nations the blessing of Abraham may come in Christ Jesus, that the promise of the Spirit we may receive through the faith. Brethren, as a man I say it, even of man a confirmed covenant no one doth make void or doth add to, and to Abraham were the promises spoken, and to his seed; He doth not say, 'And to seeds,' as of many, but as of one, 'And to thy seed,' which is Christ;

What will the promise of the Spirit do for Abraham who had been dead for thousands of years?

 

[Silverhair]

I Corinthians 1 tells us that God was “well pleased” to save people through the gospel. That was His sovereign choice.

Scripture tells us God is well pleased with His Son, Jesus and His sacrifice.

Scripture very clearly reveals to us what pleases God concerning how folks are saved.

I believe scripture. You believe a man made philosophy that denies scripture because you do not approve of God’s sovereign choice in how folks are saved.

peace to you

God saves those that believe the gospel message just as Ephesians 1:13 tell us.
"In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise,"

And we also see in Romans 10:13
"WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED."

And Paul goes on to tell us why they would call on the Lord in Romans 10:14
"How then will they call on Him in whom they have not believed? How will they believe in Him whom they have not heard? And how will they hear without a preacher?"

We have to hear the message before we can believe the message and then we can respond to it and either call on the Lord or reject it.

 

[Silverhair]

Relative to: If we followed your train of thought we would have to conclude that every Jew became a devoted follower of God.

I will just post; John 3:7, Romans 11:19-36, Ezek 37

I would like to pose a question to you and to all on the board.

From Joel 2:28 And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh;
John 7:39 YLT and this he said of the Spirit, which those believing in him were about to receive; for not yet was the Holy Spirit, because Jesus was not yet glorified

On the day that took place did the dead Abraham have the Holy Spirit within him?

Gal 3:14-16 YLT that to the nations the blessing of Abraham may come in Christ Jesus, that the promise of the Spirit we may receive through the faith. Brethren, as a man I say it, even of man a confirmed covenant no one doth make void or doth add to, and to Abraham were the promises spoken, and to his seed; He doth not say, 'And to seeds,' as of many, but as of one, 'And to thy seed,' which is Christ;

What will the promise of the Spirit do for Abraham who had been dead for thousands of years?

Re Joel 2:28 if you will look back to Joel 2:1 and following you will see that he is speaking of the "day of the LORD". the end times {see the book of Revelation}

No he did not as the Holy Spirit had not been given as of yet.

Abraham was considered righteous because he believed the Lord
Gen 15:6 Then he believed in the LORD; and He reckoned it to him as righteousness.

Just as we are considered righteous when we do.
Rom 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness,
Rom 4:6 just as David also speaks of the blessing on the man to whom God credits righteousness apart from works:
Rom 4:7 "BLESSED ARE THOSE WHOSE LAWLESS DEEDS HAVE BEEN FORGIVEN, AND WHOSE SINS HAVE BEEN COVERED.
Rom 4:8 "BLESSED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT."

God considered Abraham righteous through faith just as we are and just as our sins have been forgiven so were Abraham's.
The Holy Spirit does not save us but He does indwell us to guide us. The promise of the Holy Spirit is for those that have trusted in God since Pentecost.

 

[Stray Cat]

Another poster has asserted God would not command someone to do something they were unable to do. Is this true?

I find examples throughout scripture where people were commanded to do something by God they were not able to accomplish WITHOUT the intervention of God.

1. Love the Lord your God with all your heart mind spirit. God commanded it. Everyone that believes they are able to keep this commandment please say so directly.

2. Love your neighbor as yourself. Love one another. Love your enemies. Can you keep a command to “love” someone without the intervention of the ONE who is LOVE?

3, when the rich young ruler asked Jesus what he must do to be saved, Jesus told him to keep the OT commandments. Did Jesus know he was unable to keep the commandments? Of course He did. Jesus told him to do something knowing he wasn’t able to obey. Why? To get him to realize his need for a Savior. Interestingly, when the man walked away, Jesus stated it was easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than a rich man to get into heaven.

The disciples were astonished and said “WHO THEN CAN BE SAVED?” Jesus answered and gave the definitive answer that everyone should accept “WITH MAN I5 IS IMPOSSIBLE! WITH GOD, ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE!”

4. Jesus commanded us to be PERFECT, as His Father in heaven is perfect. If anyone believes they are perfect, please say so directly.

God commands things we are unable to do apart from His intervention to demonstrate our need for Him.

This is especially true when it comes to salvation (a right relationship with God). We are commanded to repent and believe, to seek God, to have faith in Jesus, to believe He rose from the dead.

Why is it so hard to accept God is in control of our salvation, from start to finish? He is the one who choses before the foundation of the world. He is the one who calls us BY NAME (a specific call to specific people, not a general call to all and then accept who responds of their own “free will”). He is the one who, by Holy Spirit, draws, convicts of sin and truth of the gospel, enables us to accomplish God’s will, comforts us, is grieved when we sin.

So, in short, scripture clearly tells us God commands us to do things we are unable to do in order to demonstrate our need of Him.

Salvation is the ultimate example of this truth.

peace to you

Why is it so hard to accept God is in control of our salvation, from start to finish? He is the one who choses before the foundation of the world. He is the one who calls us BY NAME (a specific call to specific people, not a general call to all and then accept who responds of their own “free will”). He is the one who, by Holy Spirit, draws, convicts of sin and truth of the gospel, enables us to accomplish God’s will, comforts us, is grieved when we sin.

Canadyjd, Hi. It is so hard because the natural unregenerated man is blind 2 Cor. 4:3-4. I believe God breaks us and brings us low
Romans 3:19. We are brought to helplessness and hopelessness. God saves in his own time. All glory to God.

 

[percho]

Where does belief come from?

Are you born with the ability of belief? If you are born with the ability of belief and exercise that ability, why would you need to be born from above?

Jesus answered and said to them, 'This is the work of God, that ye may believe in him whom He did send.'

John 6:29 Jesus answered and said to them, 'This is the work of God, that ye may believe in him whom He did send.'

I ask all. When did Paul go from being an unbeliever to being a believer? When did he preach Christ as the Son of God?

 

[Silverhair]

Where does belief come from?

Are you born with the ability of belief? If you are born with the ability of belief and exercise that ability, why would you need to be born from above?

Yes. The answer is obvious, we cannot save ourselves. Our belief does not save us but it is the condition of our salvation.

Jesus answered and said to them, 'This is the work of God, that ye may believe in him whom He did send.'

John 6:29 Jesus answered and said to them, 'This is the work of God, that ye may believe in him whom He did send.'

The crowd asked Jesus "What shall we do, so that we may work the works of God?"

Jesus had told them "Do not work for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to eternal life,..." This comment from Him brought the question of "What shall we do, so that we may work the works of God?"

So we see that the only thing that God would require is that you believe in Him.

I ask all. When did Paul go from being an unbeliever to being a believer? When did he preach Christ as the Son of God?

The bible does not make a clear statement as to the time but I would say at the Damascus road experience.

From the biblical text we can conclude that Paul began to preach the gospel message in Damascus shortly after he had his sight restored.

Act 9:18 And immediately there fell from his eyes something like scales, and he regained his sight, and he got up and was baptized;
Act 9:19 and he took food and was strengthened. Now for several days he was with the disciples who were at Damascus,
Act 9:20 and immediately he began to proclaim Jesus in the synagogues, saying, "He is the Son of God."

 

[Marooncat79]

Another poster has asserted God would not command someone to do something they were unable to do. Is this true?

I find examples throughout scripture where people were commanded to do something by God they were not able to accomplish WITHOUT the intervention of God.

1. Love the Lord your God with all your heart mind spirit. God commanded it. Everyone that believes they are able to keep this commandment please say so directly.

2. Love your neighbor as yourself. Love one another. Love your enemies. Can you keep a command to “love” someone without the intervention of the ONE who is LOVE?

3, when the rich young ruler asked Jesus what he must do to be saved, Jesus told him to keep the OT commandments. Did Jesus know he was unable to keep the commandments? Of course He did. Jesus told him to do something knowing he wasn’t able to obey. Why? To get him to realize his need for a Savior. Interestingly, when the man walked away, Jesus stated it was easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than a rich man to get into heaven.

The disciples were astonished and said “WHO THEN CAN BE SAVED?” Jesus answered and gave the definitive answer that everyone should accept “WITH MAN I5 IS IMPOSSIBLE! WITH GOD, ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE!”

4. Jesus commanded us to be PERFECT, as His Father in heaven is perfect. If anyone believes they are perfect, please say so directly.

God commands things we are unable to do apart from His intervention to demonstrate our need for Him.

This is especially true when it comes to salvation (a right relationship with God). We are commanded to repent and believe, to seek God, to have faith in Jesus, to believe He rose from the dead.

Why is it so hard to accept God is in control of our salvation, from start to finish? He is the one who choses before the foundation of the world. He is the one who calls us BY NAME (a specific call to specific people, not a general call to all and then accept who responds of their own “free will”). He is the one who, by Holy Spirit, draws, convicts of sin and truth of the gospel, enables us to accomplish God’s will, comforts us, is grieved when we sin.

So, in short, scripture clearly tells us God commands us to do things we are unable to do in order to demonstrate our need of Him.

Salvation is the ultimate example of this truth.

peace to you

So you are saying that when God gave the Moral Law in Ex 20 that He was serious?

even though He knew that we couldn’t obey it?

yeah, I thought so, and by the way, I agree w you.
And you are correct on your other points as well

 

[canadyjd]

God saves those that believe the gospel message…

We have to hear the message before we can believe the message and then we can respond to it and either call on the Lord or reject it.

Amazing to hear that. Are you rejecting your prior statements that many are saved having never heard the gospel?

Peace to you

 

[canadyjd]

So you are saying that when God gave the Moral Law in Ex 20 that He was serious?

even though He knew that we couldn’t obey it?

yeah, I thought so, and by the way, I agree w you.
And you are correct on your other points as well

Thank you for the kind words

peace to you

 

[Silverhair]

Amazing to hear that. Are you rejecting your prior statements that many are saved having never heard the gospel?

Peace to you

No. Those that hear the gospel either believe or do not. Those that believe it will be saved. But that does not preclude God saving those that trust in Him when drawn through the other means He has provided.

I do not limit God in the exercise of His prerogative to save those that He chooses to save. The question is why do you?

 

[canadyjd]

No. Those that hear the gospel either believe or do not. Those that believe it will be saved. But that does not preclude God saving those that trust in Him when drawn through the other means He has provided.

I do not limit God in the exercise of His prerogative to save those that He chooses to save. The question is why do you?

You limit God’s chosen method of bringing salvation (the gospel of Christ)to His people by claiming it isn’t good enough… there must be other ways to salvation.

By doing so you make a mockery of the sacrifice of Jesus, His suffering and death, by literally claiming it isn’t necessary for salvation.

Peace to you

 

[Silverhair]

You limit God’s chosen method of bringing salvation (the gospel of Christ)to His people by claiming it isn’t good enough… there must be other ways to salvation.

By doing so you make a mockery of the sacrifice of Jesus, His suffering and death, by literally claiming it isn’t necessary for salvation.

Peace to you

Did I say that people are not saved by trusting the gospel message? NO. So you should quit with the false accusations. To say God can save as He chooses does not lessen the sacrifice of Christ.

Your hyperbole is just a bit trying by times.

What I find strange is that you want to disparage me for saying God can save as He chooses and yet you call into question His sovereignty when you limit His authority with what you write.

So the question is, who is actually disparaging God?

 

[MrW]

Yet some say God reprobated people to unbelief from the beginning but still says they are responsible for what He did. God gave me a logical mind. If I build a robot and program it to act a certain way and it DOES what I instructed, I get the credit.

In fact, I wrote programs for my employer at the time that are still working as I wrote them, 24 hours a day, 10 years later.

But if I give it free will then IT has the responsibility. I didn’t give them free will.

 

[canadyjd]

Did I say that people are not saved by trusting the gospel message? NO. So you should quit with the false accusations. To say God can save as He chooses does not lessen the sacrifice of Christ.

Your hyperbole is just a bit trying by times.

What I find strange is that you want to disparage me for saying God can save as He chooses and yet you call into question His sovereignty when you limit His authority with what you write.

So the question is, who is actually disparaging God?

Did I say, that you said, people are not saved by responding to the gospel with faith in Christ? I did not.

You have repeatedly stated that many are saved having never heard the gospel. I was just asking if you finally had abandoned this false doctrine.

Your doctrine literally makes the sacrifice of Christ, His crucifixion, death, resurrection unnecessary for salvation.

Shameful

peace to you

 

[Silverhair]

Did I say, that you said, people are not saved by responding to the gospel with faith in Christ? I did not.

You have repeatedly stated that many are saved having never heard the gospel. I was just asking if you finally had abandoned this false doctrine.

Your doctrine literally makes the sacrifice of Christ, His crucifixion, death, resurrection unnecessary for salvation.

Shameful

peace to you

Then as I said before you have a odd understanding of the meaning of sovereign. Either God can do as He chooses or He cannot. You obviously do not think He can do as He chooses.

God has provide various means with which to draw people to Himself. You cannot accept that He in His sovereignty can save those that trust in Him unless they conform to your view. You do realize that Christ is God, right? I have to ask as you keep saying that those that trust in God are not saved unless they hear the gospel. So I have to ask why you have such a low view of God?

As I said those that hear the gospel will either trust in or reject Christ. Those that trust in Him will be saved those that reject Him will be lost. Where you have a problem seems to be that God can and does draw people through His creation and by the Holy Spirits conviction.

Who do you think you are that you can tell God whom or how He can save? You seem to be rather selective in the scriptures that you believe.

Joe 2:32 "And it will come about that whoever calls on the name of the LORD H3068 Will be delivered;

H3068
- Original: יהוה
- Transliteration: Y@hovah
- Phonetic: yeh-ho-vaw’
- Definition: Jehovah = the existing one

Rom 10:13 for "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD G2962 WILL BE SAVED."

G2962
- Original: κύριος
- Transliteration: Kurios
- Phonetic: koo’-ree-os
- Definition:
1. he to whom a person or thing belongs, about which he has power of deciding; master, Lord

Lord, master, owner. Also the NT Greek equivalent for the OT Hebrew Jehovah. The Complete WordStudy Dictionary

I understand that this is hard for you to accept but those that call out to God in faith will through His grace be saved.