Does posting bible verses violate the BB Copyright rules?

[rsr]

Originally posted by KeithS:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by standingfirminChrist:
Keith,

If the book itself says one cannot use passages out of it without express written permission, then one must get express written permission.

Not hard to understand.

standingfirm - lets not be condescending. You may be correct and I may be wrong, but I do not think so. I DO KNOW that according to US Copyright Law there is an exemption called "fair use" which allows for the limited quotation of copyrighted works WITHOUT prior permission from the publisher (or copyright holder). I am NOT aware of ANY copyright holder having the right to exempt themselves from "fair use". Therefore I do not believe I am wrong.

I provided a reference to copyright.gov which explains this for those willing to do the research. I did not review the site thoroughly, but again, I am not aware of any copyright hold being allowed to exempt themselves from "fair use". Please provide an article which disputes this interpretation. </font>[/QUOTE]You won't find one. Keith is correct that copyright laws allow for "fair use" of copyrighted material. "Commentary and criticism" is one of the rules of thumb for deciding "fair use," so long as the copyrighted material is not extensive, and the BB certainly qualifies under that exception.

Many of the copyright sites do spell out what they consider acceptable use (number of verses, percentage of work, etc.) and allow those uses without previous permission, but with acknowledgement. (Seems only fair to me.) Many also explicitly permit reproduction on bulletin boards, overhead slides, etc. with only the translation being designated by the appropriate letters.

(BTW: The ASV is in the public domain, as is Young's Literal Translation, the World English Bible and the Darby Bible. The NET allows you to print the entire Bible for distribution, so long as you give it away for free and acknowledge the copyright.)

This is a non-issue being treated as if it were an issue. Not surprising, I suppose, because it happens all the time here.

 

[Ed Edwards]

//Does posting bible verses violate the BB Copyright rules? //

No. However, Ed requests that when you quote the KJV you help
me figure out UP FRONT (or immediately folloiwng) which
KJV you have selected. The three I can check easily are:

KJV1611 Edition
KJV1769 Edition (probably a lot like the KJV1762 Edtion)
KJV1873 Edition (could be a American Bible Society /ABS/ 1850 edition)

Gtbuzzarp: //It is my understanding that except for the KJV,
if you write a book, etc, and quote Scripture you must
get permission by the holder
of the Copyright holder (such as Thomas Nelson).//

Your understanding is incorrect.
The reasonable quote rules allow for proabbly a couple of
chapters of any book (but not all of Jude at one time).
The practical posing limits are quite a bit less.

BTW, COLON EIGHT makes a sun glasses smiling face.
The normal way of putting CHAPTER# COLON VERSE NUMBER
really messes up on the eighth verse (or the 80s in
Psalm 119 tee hee )
Eight is the limit on posting smilies in one post. SO you can't
put in nine chapters

From HOLY BIBLE, Containing the Old & New Testaments,
King James Version (IGC=Inspirational Gift Company, 2003, ISBN 0-97284-8-5)
Printed in China:

All rights reserved. NO part of this publication may be
reproduced or transmitted in any form or by any means without
written permission of the publisher.

SO? turn me in, I copied a whole paragraph

By Contrast, my HCSB = Christian Standard Bible (Holman, 2003)
has a 250 verse limit.

All the copyright laws do is give one the right to sue.
The first rule of sueing is SUE GROUPS WITH MONEY.
This rule precludes most BB members and the BB itself

KiethS: //I cannot understand how
the quoting of a passage of Scripture violates copyright law.
copyright law is intended to prevent the unauthorized
reproduction of a work - it does not prevent quoting
a work.//

This copyright argument of the KJVOs is so week I wonder
sometimes why anybody ever brings it up?

Come on, the Currently most used KJV is the KJV1769 Edition
(which for me includes also the KJV1762 edition, because
I only have one and they are generally similar).
This version was first printed in 1769 - a year in which
the USofA was in open rebellion against the King of England.
Each sale of a 3£ Bible (would be about like $300 now)
put 1£ in the King's fist. This is what the 13 colonies
were rebelling about. I don't think many of our patrioic
forefathers were out buying KING'S TAXES BIBLES.
BTW, and not mentioned much on KJVO sites:
The term AUTHORIZED VERSION means that the King gets his
'take' for each Bible sold.
You can see why even in 2003 I get my KJV1769 from RED CHINA

I'm an American and we have NO KING BUT KING JESUS!!!!

BTW, the Geneva Bible (I have the 1587 Edition) is public
domain It is a good Bible. It doesn't have some of the
Anglican baby-baptizin' bent that the KJV1611 has.

 

[Keith M]

Originally posted by standingfirminChrist:
Keith,

If the book itself says one cannot use passages out of it without express written permission, then one must get express written permission.

Not hard to understand.

Yet it is apparent you don't understand, SFIC...

It is permitted to quote Scripture. It is not permitted to quote massive amounts of Scripture. What part of that is so hard for you to understand, SFIC?

 

[Keith M]

BTW, COLON EIGHT makes a sun glasses smiling face.
The normal way of putting CHAPTER# COLON VERSE NUMBER
really messes up on the eighth verse

Actually this problem is caused by the 8 and the ")" symbol being used in conjunction. Administrators can go to the area that holds the smilie codes and simply place a space between the 8 and the ")" symbol. This easily solves the problem. This practice should be adopted on all discussion boards where lots of Bible quotes are posted.

 

[jw]

In front of my NASB

The text of the New American Standard Bible® may be quoted and/or reprinted up to and inclusive of five hundred (500) verses without express written permission of The Lockman Foundation, providing that the verses do not amount to a complete book of the Bible nor do the verses quoted account for more than 25% of the total work in which they are quoted.
New American Standard Bible : 1995 update. 1995 (Ge 1:1). LaHabra, CA: The Lockman Foundation.

In front of my ESV:

The ESV text may be quoted (in written, visual, or electronic form) up to and inclusive of one thousand (1,000) verses without express written permission of the publisher, providing that the verses quoted do not amount to a complete book of the Bible nor do the verses quoted account for 50 percent or more of the total text of the work in which they are quoted.
The Holy Bible : English standard version. 2001. Wheaton: Standard Bible Society.

In front of my NIV:

The NIV text may be quoted in any form (written, visual, electronic or audio), up to and inclusive of one thousand (1,000) verses without express written permission of the publisher, providing the verses quoted do not amount to a complete book of the Bible nor do the verses quoted account for 50 percent or more of the total text of the work in which they are quoted.
The Holy Bible : New International Version. 1996, c1984. Grand Rapids: Zondervan.

Yah, the truth does dispell fiction

You can quote Bible verses all ya want here. Just not reproduce huge chunks of a book without prior permission.

You'll also note there is a copyright infront of your KJV.

 

[Gold Dragon]

Originally posted by kubel:
As far as I'm aware, the KJV does still has a copyright and is still required to be licensed today. It's just not enforced anywhere but in the UK.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KJV#Copyright_status

Unlike other bible translations, the KJV copyright owned by the British crown does not expire.

 

[gtbuzzarp]

Originally posted by Ed Edwards:
Gtbuzzarp: //It is my understanding that except for the KJV,
if you write a book, etc, and quote Scripture you must
get permission by the holder
of the Copyright holder (such as Thomas Nelson).//

Your understanding is incorrect.
The reasonable quote rules allow for proabbly a couple ofchapters of any book (but not all of Jude at one time). The practical posing limits are quite a bit less.

Yup, I already amended this by posting a few of those limits. No arguments here.

 

[robycop3]

From an old cop:

A USA copyright allows a product to be used as it was obviously intended to be used. For example, a radio station may publicly play a recorded song, since that was the purpose for which it was recorded & distributed. However, the radio station may not alter it, nor make & sell copies of it w/o paying royalties to the copyright holder.

I phoned the US patent Ofc. several years ago, and here's what they told me about Bibles:

A Bible is intended to be preached from, and a preacher may freely do so, long as he's not trying to make money from that Bible itself. Bibles are meant to be read aloud from, and one may do so freely, except that he's not allowed to make money from that version if it's under USA copyright. And Bibles are intended to be QUOTED FROM, up to any restrictions posted in their individual copyrights.

Most copyrighted versions have a limit posted as to how much of it may be reproduced w/o permission.

The MAIN restriction upon copyrighted versions in the USA is reproducing them to sell. Othwerwise, Bibles have far-fewer restrictions from a copyright than do most other written works.

Almost every KJV edition has some sorta copyright in it, but in the USA it's NOT on the TEXT. The copyright may be on anything else in it, from a concordance, to maps, "study helps", commentaries, illustrations, or the design of the cover.

In short, we may freely post individual verses, or even whole chapters, from any version, long as one isn't attempting to make monetary gain from such posting.

In this time of instant copying & the ability to send any writings anywhere on earth in a matter of seconds, these laws may have been amended...but has anyone heard of anyone in the USA getting in copyright trouble for preaching from any version, reading it aloud, posting verses in public message boards, or publicly quoting from it? In other words, it's safe to use any copyrighted Bible version for the intended purposes of Bibles in general.

(BTW, you've prolly notice our British brethren freely quote from the KJV on the various public boards.)

 

[PhatCat]

This is from the Wikipedia article:

"The protection that the Authorised Version, and also the Book of Common Prayer, enjoy is the last remnant of the time when the Crown held a monopoly over all printing and publishing in the United Kingdom."

So you see, that British Crown copyright is not the same as the money-making copyright laws elsewhere.

I have seen some of the most vile and hateful things ever from "Christians" who attack KJVo's. I really can't believe it, it blows my mind.

I'll tell you one of the things that helped me turn to the KJB only, years ago- the fact that hardly ever do the adherents NASB attack the NIV or the CEV attck the ASV or the ESV attack the RSV, etc. But they ALL come together to attack the KJV adherents. I thought to myself that this was strange. Well I found out why:

John 3:19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.(KJB)

This, of course, is speaking of the Lord Jesus. Who, by the way, is also the Word. Coinkidink?

The crack about baby baptiz'n pushed in the KJB is truly ignorant. That was not an ad hominem attck, it was a statement of fact.

Hatred clouds judgment.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

Originally posted by jw:
In front of my NASB
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />The text of the New American Standard Bible® may be quoted and/or reprinted up to and inclusive of five hundred (500) verses without express written permission of The Lockman Foundation, providing that the verses do not amount to a complete book of the Bible nor do the verses quoted account for more than 25% of the total work in which they are quoted.
New American Standard Bible : 1995 update. 1995 (Ge 1:1). LaHabra, CA: The Lockman Foundation.

In front of my ESV:

The ESV text may be quoted (in written, visual, or electronic form) up to and inclusive of one thousand (1,000) verses without express written permission of the publisher, providing that the verses quoted do not amount to a complete book of the Bible nor do the verses quoted account for 50 percent or more of the total text of the work in which they are quoted.
The Holy Bible : English standard version. 2001. Wheaton: Standard Bible Society.

In front of my NIV:

The NIV text may be quoted in any form (written, visual, electronic or audio), up to and inclusive of one thousand (1,000) verses without express written permission of the publisher, providing the verses quoted do not amount to a complete book of the Bible nor do the verses quoted account for 50 percent or more of the total text of the work in which they are quoted.
The Holy Bible : New International Version. 1996, c1984. Grand Rapids: Zondervan.

Yah, the truth does dispell fiction

You can quote Bible verses all ya want here. Just not reproduce huge chunks of a book without prior permission.

You'll also note there is a copyright infront of your KJV. </font>[/QUOTE]In front of one of my KJVs (printed 1993):

All rights in respect of the Authorized King James Version of the Holy Bible are vested in the Crown in the United Kingdom and controlled by the Royal Letters Patent. No part of this publication may be reproduced or transmitted, in any form or by any means, electronic, mechanical, photocopying, recording and otherwise, or stored in any retrieval system of any nature, without written permission.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

Originally posted by jw:
In front of my NASB
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />The text of the New American Standard Bible® may be quoted and/or reprinted up to and inclusive of five hundred (500) verses without express written permission of The Lockman Foundation, providing that the verses do not amount to a complete book of the Bible nor do the verses quoted account for more than 25% of the total work in which they are quoted.
New American Standard Bible : 1995 update. 1995 (Ge 1:1). LaHabra, CA: The Lockman Foundation.

In front of my ESV:

The ESV text may be quoted (in written, visual, or electronic form) up to and inclusive of one thousand (1,000) verses without express written permission of the publisher, providing that the verses quoted do not amount to a complete book of the Bible nor do the verses quoted account for 50 percent or more of the total text of the work in which they are quoted.
The Holy Bible : English standard version. 2001. Wheaton: Standard Bible Society.

In front of my NIV:

The NIV text may be quoted in any form (written, visual, electronic or audio), up to and inclusive of one thousand (1,000) verses without express written permission of the publisher, providing the verses quoted do not amount to a complete book of the Bible nor do the verses quoted account for 50 percent or more of the total text of the work in which they are quoted.
The Holy Bible : New International Version. 1996, c1984. Grand Rapids: Zondervan.

Yah, the truth does dispell fiction

You can quote Bible verses all ya want here. Just not reproduce huge chunks of a book without prior permission.

You'll also note there is a copyright infront of your KJV. </font>[/QUOTE]In front of one of my KJVs (printed 1993):

All rights in respect of the Authorized King James Version of the Holy Bible are vested in the Crown in the United Kingdom and controlled by the Royal Letters Patent. No part of this publication may be reproduced or transmitted, in any form or by any means, electronic, mechanical, photocopying, recording and otherwise, or stored in any retrieval system of any nature, without written permission.

 

[jw]

Originally posted by C4K:
In front of one of my KJVs (printed 1993):

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />All rights in respect of the Authorized King James Version of the Holy Bible are vested in the Crown in the United Kingdom and controlled by the Royal Letters Patent. No part of this publication may be reproduced or transmitted, in any form or by any means, electronic, mechanical, photocopying, recording and otherwise, or stored in any retrieval system of any nature, without written permission.

</font>[/QUOTE]Youch! That's a lot tougher than the MV's copyright resctrictions.

Of course it only holds up in the UK.

 

[rbell]

It's OK, C4K...

Since the front pages of your Bibles are less inspired than the actual chapters...you can tear them out and not worry about it.

(wonder if folks will know I'm kidding before getting the flamethrowers out)

 

[mcdirector]

Just for rbell

 

[rbell]

Great! I've always wanted to see what "403 forbidden" looks like...

 

[mcdirector]

Oh great! I tried to find it again, but apparently it's one of those rotating picture places. thhhhh

It was a picture of a flame thrower from the Orient.

 

[rsr]

 

[mcdirector]

well double thhhhhhh

No fair rsr! Your picture worked and my link was a dud. *stomp, stomp, stomp*

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

Originally posted by jw:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by C4K:
In front of one of my KJVs (printed 1993):

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />All rights in respect of the Authorized King James Version of the Holy Bible are vested in the Crown in the United Kingdom and controlled by the Royal Letters Patent. No part of this publication may be reproduced or transmitted, in any form or by any means, electronic, mechanical, photocopying, recording and otherwise, or stored in any retrieval system of any nature, without written permission.

</font>[/QUOTE]Youch! That's a lot tougher than the MV's copyright resctrictions.

Of course it only holds up in the UK. </font>[/QUOTE]Whats really weird is that it was printed in New York