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Does The New Testament Teach Irresistible Grace?

Discussion in '2005 Archive' started by Martin, Jul 16, 2005.

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  1. johnp.

    johnp. New Member

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    HaHa! :cool: Very much so! :cool:
    The scripture says:
    For it is by grace you have been saved... Eph 2:8-9.
    The Wes says:
    For it is not by grace you have been saved...

    Eli's house received no atonement but Wes says all sins have been atoned for. :cool: 1 Sam 3:14.

    john.
     
    #41 johnp., Jul 17, 2005
  2. here now

    here now Member

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    Wes says:
    All Faith whether 'saving or not' comes from within the man.


    HN says:
    That's not what the Bible says.

    1 Cor. 12:4 But there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.

    1 Cor. 12:9 To another faith by the same Spirit....
     
    #42 here now, Jul 17, 2005
  3. Wes Outwest

    Wes Outwest New Member

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    Context is everything HN!

    Suggest you do an indepth study of faith. You will find that it is exclusively human out of all of God's creation.

    God, who knows all and sees all, has absolutely no reason to have faith, thus he has no faith to give to man. However, he does give to man knowledge of Himself with which man establishes faith IN HIM.

    Faith is exclusively HUMAN!
     
    #43 Wes Outwest, Jul 17, 2005
  4. OCC

    OCC Guest

    Oh I kept up Wes. Count on it. You mentioned the word "family" did you not? You mentioned the word "alone" did you not? checkmate.

    BTW...if I had said what you did...you would self righteously tell me I owed him an apology. Therefore, I did the same.

    Oh...and stop shouting at me. [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
    #44 OCC, Jul 17, 2005
  5. here now

    here now Member

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    Wes, notice that you said:

    "All faith whether 'saving or not' comes from within the man.

    So I took nothing out of context.

    You need to say what you mean. If you did not mean ALL faith then you should not have said ALL faith.
     
    #45 here now, Jul 17, 2005
  6. OCC

    OCC Guest

    Or at the very least...keep notes. [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
    #46 OCC, Jul 17, 2005
  7. here now

    here now Member

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    Wes,
    Faith is not exclusively human.
     
    #47 here now, Jul 17, 2005
  8. here now

    here now Member

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    Wes,
    You go around making comments and then you crawdad on them.

    We do not have 'generic families' we have 'personal families'. No one should bring someone elses family into this debate.
     
    #48 here now, Jul 17, 2005
  9. johnp.

    johnp. New Member

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    Hello KJ.
    There look at that and I thought you were caring for my honour but it was just vengence. :cool: Shockingingly natural behaviour, I'm impressed. :cool:

    john.
     
    #49 johnp., Jul 17, 2005
  10. OCC

    OCC Guest

    Johnp...you assume and speak too soon without clarifying first. A natural behaviour, I am sure.

    A man can have two motives for doing something.

    You may continue the lover's quarrel...
     
    #50 OCC, Jul 17, 2005
  11. OCC

    OCC Guest

    Johnp...why aren't you addressing what herenow said in the post above yours hmm??? :cool:
     
    #51 OCC, Jul 17, 2005
  12. johnp.

    johnp. New Member

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    Hello KJ.
    Me to.
    A man will have only one motive for anything and that will tend towards self aggrandizement.
    You're too kind. :cool:
    Do you mean this one?
    Wes,
    You go around making comments and then you crawdad on them.
    We do not have 'generic families' we have 'personal families'. No one should bring someone elses family into this debate.

    No question has been asked and I saw nothing to address. Which way do you mean? I looked up 'crawdad' and think it means to 'alter' or 'change' is that right?

    john.
     
    #52 johnp., Jul 17, 2005
  13. OCC

    OCC Guest

    Which way do I mean? Probably that he basically said the same thing I did...to which you had no problem addressing me. But you didn't address herenow.

    Self aggrandizement? Thou hast spoken for thyself. I think you just pick a few people you think you can handle in a debate or a verbal slugfest and leave the rest. Well...I am one you should have left. :cool:

    This is for you sunshine.. [​IMG]
     
    #53 OCC, Jul 17, 2005
  14. Wes Outwest

    Wes Outwest New Member

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    Did I demean his family?
     
    #54 Wes Outwest, Jul 17, 2005
  15. Wes Outwest

    Wes Outwest New Member

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    I said it the way I did to distinguish between faith in God and faith in other objects and things. ALL faith comes from within the man. None of it comes from outside of the man...saving faith or not.
     
    #55 Wes Outwest, Jul 17, 2005
  16. Wes Outwest

    Wes Outwest New Member

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    Can you provide me an example of faith within the bounds of God's creation that is not exclusively human?
     
    #56 Wes Outwest, Jul 17, 2005
  17. Wes Outwest

    Wes Outwest New Member

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    The term family as I used it is generic...that is, NON SPECIFIC! The family is not identified. Nor was my use of the word derogatory to john's family in any manner whatever.

    This little game you play is fun. Let's keep it up!
     
    #57 Wes Outwest, Jul 17, 2005
  18. johnp.

    johnp. New Member

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    Hello KJ.
    I do not accept flowers from a man KJ.

    Hello Wes.
    You did not demean my family and I took no offence. If I thought you had overstepped the mark I would have said something.
    2PE 1:1 Simon Peter, a servant and apostle of Jesus Christ,
    To those who through the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ have received a faith as precious as ours:

    john.
     
    #58 johnp., Jul 17, 2005
  19. OCC

    OCC Guest

    Johnp...your comment about flowers from a man...you have no idea why I did that. :rolleyes: This is for you sunshine [​IMG]

    Ok Wes...some families have people with Mental Disorders in them...
     
    #59 OCC, Jul 17, 2005
  20. Wes Outwest

    Wes Outwest New Member

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    Some don't, what's your beef?
     
    #60 Wes Outwest, Jul 17, 2005
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