Does the Will of God Then "Trump" Will Of man or Not?

[percho]

man is born aleady into the stae of being under the judgement/condemnation of God, due to the fact that when Adam fell, God sees him as being the Head of the human race, that all humanity in a sense "shared" in his guilt and sin...

SO ALL would need the cross of Christ in order to avoid condemantion...
The idea of a man being born with a "clean slate" before God, that would not be held liable to God if/until actually sinning not in the Bible

I fully agree with you. The moment you enter this life you are on the road to it's end, death brought on by the sin of Adam. You are going to die. The question is will one be resurrected to life or to damnation.

I am the resurrection and the life (that is eternal) he that believeth in me, though he were dead, (we all are dead in trespass and sins, dying thou dost die) yet shall he live: (because the earnest of the Spirit is in him and will resurrect him at my appearing and he will inherit eternal life) And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. (Those that receive this will resurrection will never die again)

Now let me ask. Will they go to heaven or will they by entering in, inherit the kingdom of God per the scriptures?

Were those of Thessalonica concerned about their believing friends who had died being in the kingdom of God or was it something else they were concerned about? Do you think Paul preached to them about the kingdom of God? Just where was God going to bring them to with Jesus after they were raised from the dead?

 

[Winman]

Originally Posted by JesusFan View Post
So IF a person always chose to do right, and not to sin, would he still need the death of Jesus on Cross to provide him eternal life or not? Would he be providing it for himself?


And to add to what you have said even though we see things different.

(For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law. A statement of fact. Yet.
Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression,

Death without qualification came to all men by Adam and it is death that man has to be redeemed from. Earnest until the redemption of the purchased possession, speaking of our birth by resurrection of the person that died which was brought about by his (Jesus) blood (Death) and resurrection being the firstborn from the dead.

No?

The law from Adam to Moses was the law written upon the heart that Paul spoke of in Romans. Read from Adam to Moses in the scriptures and you will see that men knew what sin was and had standards for behavior. Didn't Moses flee for his life when he realized that it was discovered he had killed an Egyptian? Why? Because the scriptures say Pharaoh sought his life for doing this.

But hundreds of years before this another Pharaoh knew it was wrong to have Abraham's wife when he discovered it.

Men knew right from wrong from Adam to Moses, this was the law of their heart, and their conscience. This is why men died spiritually when they did not sin after the similitude of Adam. Rom 5:14 is actually telling us that men were not held liable for Adam's sin, but their own sin. Read it carefully and you will see.

 

[percho]

The law from Adam to Moses was the law written upon the heart that Paul spoke of in Romans. Read from Adam to Moses in the scriptures and you will see that men knew what sin was and had standards for behavior. Didn't Moses flee for his life when he realized that it was discovered he had killed an Egyptian? Why? Because the scriptures say Pharaoh sought his life for doing this.

But hundreds of years before this another Pharaoh knew it was wrong to have Abraham's wife when he discovered it.

Men knew right from wrong from Adam to Moses, this was the law of their heart, and their conscience. This is why men died spiritually when they did not sin after the similitude of Adam. Rom 5:14 is actually telling us that men were not held liable for Adam's sin, but their own sin. Read it carefully and you will see.

I do not have a problem with that. Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

Adam and Eve didn't have the law as given by God to Moses either but what they did was sin.

And it brought death. Dying they would surly die.

 

[convicted1]

That is the point... IF God allowed us "absolute free will" to make a decision to receive Christ, NONE of us would, as we are sinful beings whose heart and mind is bent to rejecting true God, prefering instead to have god and religion of our own making!

God comes to us and shows us our lost condition. Just like Apostle Paul in Romans ch. 7 stated that he was alive without the law, but when sin revived, he died. When God shows us just how vile we really are, then it is up to us to accpet or reject Him. I am not making Him a "g"od with this analogy, either. He is God, and besides Him, there is none other.

For whatever reason, some will accept His invitation, and some will reject it. Those who accept this invitation will live forever, and those who reject it, will die, die and never die!! I guess the loved darkness rather than Light.

i am I AM's!!

Willis

 

[convicted1]

Read this passage VERY closely!!

1 Cor. 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.


In verse 22, it says in Adam, all die, not all are dead. When Adam transgressed in the Garden, he placed the sentence of death upon all of us, in that we are now born to die, whether we be saint or sinner. When we sin from the heart, we then die spiritually, and not before. In Adam, we all die, and not "In Adam, all are dead". That's a MAJOR difference folks!!

i am I AM's!!

Willis

 

[JesusFan]

The law from Adam to Moses was the law written upon the heart that Paul spoke of in Romans. Read from Adam to Moses in the scriptures and you will see that men knew what sin was and had standards for behavior. Didn't Moses flee for his life when he realized that it was discovered he had killed an Egyptian? Why? Because the scriptures say Pharaoh sought his life for doing this.

But hundreds of years before this another Pharaoh knew it was wrong to have Abraham's wife when he discovered it.

Men knew right from wrong from Adam to Moses, this was the law of their heart, and their conscience. This is why men died spiritually when they did not sin after the similitude of Adam. Rom 5:14 is actually telling us that men were not held liable for Adam's sin, but their own sin. Read it carefully and you will see.

The thing though is IF you deny original sin, that all of us are found tio be "in Adam" guilty, born with inherited sin natures..

Than you will have no case for just WHY Jesus MUST have had the Virgin Birth...

IF he would not have inherited a sin nature, been part of original sin...

WHY even the need to be born by the Holy Spirit conceiving Him in mary?
Either he was born witha normal father, joseph, or was a sinner?

NO to both ideas, so you MUST have doctrine of original sin to keep the Virgin Birth of Christ...

Anything less is heretical...