Drinking Alcohol Poll--

All who disobey God's Word, saved, unsaved, makes no difference, will face judgment. Many in this life, many in the life to come.

 

That's not why I asked the question. It's called curiosity. I am just wondering if this is mostly an American invention.

 

Okay, I'll just point blank ask you then.

Do you believe that those of us who consume alcohol occasionally, do not believe it is a sin, and believe Jesus himself made and drank real wine are going to hell?

 

Certainly it seems to be confined to the English-speaking part of the Free Church Protestant world ie: North America and also in particular the 'Celtic fringe' - Welsh Methodism, Northern Irish and Scottish Presbyterianism and other non-conformists. You simply don't get it amongst Christians in continental Europe.

I ahev a theory about that which has to do with the culture of alcohol consumption, when alcohol is consumed and what sort of alcohol is consumed: in continental Europe, historically because of the climate, the tipple of choice is wine. Now wine is typically consumed with a meal, which in that part of the world is a (sometimes extended) family affair with everyone from the youngest to the oldest joining in the eating and drinking. Thre things flow from this: (a) the food helps absorb the alcohol and thus reduces the potential for intoxication; (b)the consumption is over a fixed period ie: the time it takes to eat the main course which again reduces the opportunity to over-indulge and (c) people learn from an early age to enjoy alcohol responsibly.

Contrast that with the UK and North America where (California notwithstanding) there hasn't been a long-standing viticultural tradition, the chosen drinks tend to be beer or spirits, which tend to be drunk on their own, can be drunk over an open-ended period of time, tend to be drunk outside the home at pubs and bars etc and we can see that (a) it is consumed outside of the family home and therefore impressionable children have no good role models to observe (except perhaps some church-based teaching that it's somehow 'naughty') (b) they don't get to drink it until suddenly when they're of the legal age to buy it and the potential for abuse is far greater.

Just my $0.02 theory...

 

It is not an invention. It is God's Word.

 

I will let the Word of God answer that one.

 

"Quack!"

(I know what a duck sounds like when I hear one.)

Ed

 

So far, the only verses I've seen you post either refer specifically to drunkenness, which I think we're all agreed is forbidden in scripture, or taken out of context.

Could you just indulge me and show me two or three that forbid alcohol at all?

 

Proverbs 23:31 is not specifically about drunkenness as you assume... it is about fermented wine. "Look thou not upon the wine..."

You cannot twist it to mean it is a warning against drunkenness. It is a warning against the wine itself.

 

Not ducking at all. As a matter of fact, I saw James Reed was trying to get me to get myself booted off the board with his question. I answered him wisely concerning his question.

We all will face judgment for rebellious acts from time to time. We will be punished accordingly.

Will a man go to hell for drinking alcohol? What does the Word of God say?

"It is the LORD: let him do what seemeth him good."

 

Gimme' a break! Several posters have said that a Christian cannot commit a sin such as murder, and be saved, nor be saved as a drunk, and that one can lose their salvation, and are still around. More than one poster has said that one cannot be in adultery, and die as an adulterer and be saved. They are still around. Not to mention a lot of other strange sounding stuff. In fact, about the only ones I have recently seen , in any numbers, were those of the so-called "Millenial Exclusion" sort, other than some trolls, plus a couple who would not cease in the personal attacks.

One was not asking you to personally question another's salvation, which is prohibited on the BB, I believe. So I suggest that the question, "point-blank" as it was, is entirely legitimate. And I would seem to remember that nowhere does the word of God ever say a person goes to hell for drinking alcohol, as far as I can find, but it does say a whole bunch against drunkenness, which I do not recall one poster advocating.

That there are 'degrees' of dealing with wine, can be well seen in the differences in the qualification for bishops/elders and deacons, where Scripture says a bishop "must be...not given to wine", whereas a deacon "must be ...not given to much wine". The elders are held to a higher standard than are the deacons, Biblically.

But this (wine statement) is not the only qualification (and it is not 'ranked' as the number one, either), of one who is to be in either of these offices. Were only wine involved, I should have been in one or the other of these offices, virtually all of my adult Christian life. I have not been, nor was I qualified, on other grounds. (Hard to be the husband of one wife, when you ain't never been married! That alone disqualified me, as I see it.)

Nor did I even desire such (the office, for I did desire the wife), and that is the very first qualification for a bishop/elder - to desire it!. Not desiring that office (and I never have), all the other qualifications are moot.

My comments stand. That was a "duck".

Ed

 

Ed, let me ask you...

if one disobeys God's command to abstain from lying all his life... tells lies every day, but has made a profession of trust in Christ since his youth, will he be overlooked or will he be sent to hell?

Remember... he too has made a profession of trust in Christ. And remember God's Word says all liars will have their part in the lake that burneth with fire and brimstone. Now, is that man going to heaven? or hell?

 

ann,

big difference. Paul did not sin out of rebellion. Paul said 'that which I would not dio, that I find myself doing'. His war between the flesh and the Spirit was not intentional. He occasionally gave in to the flesh, but not because he wanted to.

The Word of God tells us that 'Rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft.' The command to abstain is clear in God's Word. Yet many rebel against this command and place stumbling blocks in front of others telling them God allows that which He disallows.

Same with one who calls onesself a Christian that lies constantly. The Word of God clearly commands us not to lie. They are rebelling against the God of the Word.

Have a problem with God's commands? Take it up with Him.


Now, the Word of God says clearly that all liars will have their part in the lake of fire. If one who professes to know Christ lies constantly, unless that one repents, where will he go? Scripture seems pretty clear to me.

 

I have shown it, you, and others just ignore it.

 

Still ignoring it, I see.

 

But you see, this is what I mean about you taking verses out of context.

I don't know if you did it on purpose or not, but you neglected to post the previous two verses (vv 29-30), which tell us that it is referring to drunkenness.

This is the portion of the passage you're not telling us about:

29 Who hath woe? who hath sorrow? who hath contentions? (8675) who hath babbling? who hath wounds without cause? who hath redness of eyes? 30 They that tarry long at the wine; they that go to seek mixed wine.

People don't get bloodshot eyes from moderation. They get bloodshot eyes from drunkenness.

"Tarrying long" doesn't refer to moderation, it refers to those who drink and keep on drinking for a long period of time.

I'm sorry, but I can't find any command to abstain in the Bible and you're being so combative that I don't know if it would even do any good to ask you again.