Drinking Question......

[jaigner]

We do not drink by the way. In our area a person drinks is not thought to be a christian, not only is it a bad witness, but a stumbling block to weaker christians.

Or maybe it is a good witness that Christians are not moralistic, legalistic and works-centered.

 

[saturneptune]

I do not drink. You can probably justify drinking in moderation with Scripture. I really don't care. I do not "buy" all the excuses. Alcohol ruins lives. Why would anyone want anything to do with it? Alcohol "dims" your judgment after only ONE drink. Scientific fact. Drinking in "moderation" sounds ridiculous to me. After about 2 drinks you're not in any mindset to realize you've had enough. It's called "playing with fire" in my book.


I'll wait for the :tonofbricks: that I know is coming.

I'll drink to that. (Iced tea of course). Seriously, one of the best posts I have seen on the subject. Excellent thoughts.

My idea is that one can make a case for that the Bible does not teach to abstain, in the technical sense of the term. However, if one factors in common sense, a witness, ruined lives, lost jobs, and broken families, why would anyone even play with it? To prove in post after post the the Bible allows drinking misses the whole point. Everyone who is saved has the Holy Spirit as a guide, and the answer should be quite clear.

 

[Username]

I do not drink. You can probably justify drinking in moderation with Scripture. I really don't care. I do not "buy" all the excuses. Alcohol ruins lives. Why would anyone want anything to do with it? Alcohol "dims" your judgment after only ONE drink. Scientific fact. Drinking in "moderation" sounds ridiculous to me. After about 2 drinks you're not in any mindset to realize you've had enough. It's called "playing with fire" in my book.


I'll wait for the :tonofbricks: that I know is coming.

Alcohol abuse certainly ruins lives and families. I have no problem with folks not wanting to "play with fire".

With that said, the underlined portion of your post is not (necessarily) true.

 

[saturneptune]

Alcohol abuse certainly ruins lives and families. I have no problem with folks not wanting to "play with fire".

With that said, the underlined portion of your post is not (necessarily) true.

If one does not drink, that is plenty of alcohol to impair judgement. The times I drank in the Navy (over 30 years ago), three beers would get me to fight anyone and four I was carried back to the ship. If you are talking about hard liquor, that is much worse. If two drinks does not affect you, you already way down the road to trouble.

 

[webdog]

I'll drink to that. (Iced tea of course). Seriously, one of the best posts I have seen on the subject. Excellent thoughts.

My idea is that one can make a case for that the Bible does not teach to abstain, in the technical sense of the term. However, if one factors in common sense, a witness, ruined lives, lost jobs, and broken families, why would anyone even play with it? To prove in post after post the the Bible allows drinking misses the whole point. Everyone who is saved has the Holy Spirit as a guide, and the answer should be quite clear.

The same can be said of sex when abused...

The answer is quite clear: The abuse of alcohol is a sin, just like the abuse of anything is sin.

 

[saturneptune]

The same can be said of sex when abused...

The answer is quite clear: The abuse of alcohol is a sin, just like the abuse of anything is sin.

I cannot disagree with that, and do not judge anyone who drinks in moderation. For me, it is not where I have been lead. So how have you been doing Web?

 

[webdog]

I cannot disagree with that, and do not judge anyone who drinks in moderation. For me, it is not where I have been lead. So how have you been doing Web?

I think you hit on a major thing...if the Spirit leads you to not drink even though Scripture allows it, you should not drink. The discernment comes in knowing whether it's the Spirit leading, or the culture and regulations of man.

I've been hanging in there...haven't been on here as much lately.

 

[Steadfast Fred]

If you are of the belief that drinking is a sin against God, so you don't do it because of that reason, but........

1. If someone you knew relied upon it (drunkard) and needed it to get by would you allow them into your home. Why or Why not?

2. If you allow someone to drink in your home, is this the same as allowing a theif or a drug addict in your home?

Looking for Biblical guidance here, the only thing I can find would be 1 Corinthians 5:11

Proverbs 23:20 Be not among winebibbers; among riotous eaters of flesh:

That answers the question for me. We are not to be around them... that would include bringing them into our home.

 

[Steadfast Fred]

I think you hit on a major thing...if the Spirit leads you to not drink even though Scripture allows it, you should not drink. The discernment comes in knowing whether it's the Spirit leading, or the culture and regulations of man.

I've been hanging in there...haven't been on here as much lately.

The Spirit would not go against the Scripture. If the Scripture tells someone it is ok to drink in moderation, then the Spirit is not going to tell the otherwise.

On the obverse, if the Spirit tells someone not to drink, the Scripture will as well.

The fact is, the Spirit does indeed tell us to abstain from wine that is fermented.

 

[Aaron]

Or maybe it is a good witness that Christians are not moralistic, legalistic and works-centered.

After all, the deprecations and false accusations of an ungodly society should be our first consideration when deciding a course of action. :thumbs:

 

[Aaron]

There is no good that comes from drinking wine. It doesn't build character, it helps no one in Christian virtue, it doesn't promote the Kingdom of God or the Gospel.

But the damage that has been done by something that so naturally lends itself to abuse is unquestionable. What's worse, those who've been saved out of it, and testify of it, and will no longer touch it are marginalized as unspiritual, legalistic, ignorant and superstitious.

Now tell me again how holy and righteous your moderate drinking is . . .

 

[webdog]

There is no good that comes from drinking wine. It doesn't build character, it helps no one in Christian virtue, it doesn't promote the Kingdom of God or the Gospel.

All your opinion of course.

But the damage that has been done by something that so naturally lends itself to abuse is unquestionable. What's worse, those who've been saved out of it, and testify of it, and will no longer touch it are marginalized as unspiritual, legalistic, ignorant and superstitious.

Everyone that has been 'saved out of it' obviously had a problem abusing it. Those that try to tell us that don't abuse it or have a problem to abstain as they do are legalistic and ignorant.

Now tell me again how holy and righteous your moderate drinking is . . .

Thanks for proving my point.

 

[webdog]

The Spirit would not go against the Scripture. If the Scripture tells someone it is ok to drink in moderation, then the Spirit is not going to tell the otherwise.

On the obverse, if the Spirit tells someone not to drink, the Scripture will as well.

The fact is, the Spirit does indeed tell us to abstain from wine that is fermented.

Wrong on so many levels. The Spirit lead Paul to a single life, are you telling me everyone should be single?

 

[Aaron]

All your opinion of course.

Really? Alcohol isn't a nutrient. And it's not necessary for preservation. And frankly, the taste of alcoholic drinks, unless it's the fruity kind, has to be acquired.

But then, if one is drinking for taste, why bother with the alcohol? There is no shortage of fruit drinks, and they're much less expensive.

So again, why bother with the alcohol?

 

[Aaron]

Everyone that has been 'saved out of it' obviously had a problem ...

Thanks for proving my point.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

I like the taste of single malt Scotch --- 12 yr old. Go replicate that in a non alcoholic drink. Plus if you add fig newtons to it I will follow you anywhere. :laugh:

 

[Aaron]

I like the smell of tobacco. So?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

you can have a chaw but please dont spit in my general direction

Cheers

 

[jaigner]

There is no good that comes from drinking wine. It doesn't build character, it helps no one in Christian virtue, it doesn't promote the Kingdom of God or the Gospel.

Neither does baseball. Neither does mexican food. Neither does flying kites. Neither does driving cars. Neither does growing a beard. Neither does listening to Frank Sinatra. Neither does a fine dinner date. Neither does an entertaining movie. Neither does a front porch in late summer. Neither does shopping for clothes. Neither does smoking a nice cigar (which is, of course, a matter of conscience). Neither does mowing the lawn. Neither do a lot of things.

They are a matter of taste and conscience.

 

[jaigner]

After all, the deprecations and false accusations of an ungodly society should be our first consideration when deciding a course of action. :thumbs:

Of course not, but the same of Christians is not true, either.

The point is that drinking is not in and of itself a bad witness. Neither is not drinking necessarily a good witness.

In many cases it's out of a judgmental and self-righteous mindset.