Ecumenical leanings

Unfortunately there are christian authors today who endorse the ECT movement, 'Evangelicals and Catholics Together'. We already went through this reformation once and my thoughts are, "Here I Stand, I can do no other" as Luther clearly defended justification by faith only! I feel the upper echelons of the Catholic church would desire to unite us all once more under their papacy, but for me I see that as entertaining false doctrine and playing with the devil! I strongly object to this movement! We are responsible to both know and protect the purity of our doctrine according to scripture!

 

Because the true church of Jesus is ecumenical... We will all be together in Heaven whether of our denomination here. Sorry, but that is the way it is... No place in the Bible does it say "you must be Baptist" in order to get to Heaven.

 

Here is a post from my blog... this may help solidify my stance on ecumenism.

I was shocked, confused and bewildered
As I entered Heaven's door,
Not by the beauty of it all,
Or the lights or its decor.
But it was the folks in Heaven
who made me sputter and gasp--
the thieves, the liars, the sinners,
the alcoholics and the trash.
There stood the kid from seventh grade
Who swiped my lunch money twice.
Next to him was my old neighbor
who never said anything nice.
Herb, who I always thought
Was rotting away in hell,
Was sitting pretty on cloud nine,
*Looking incredibly well.
*I nudged Jesus, "What's the deal?
I would love to hear Your take.
How'd all these sinners get up here?
God must've made a mistake.
And why's everyone so quiet,
so somber? Give me a clue."
"Hush, child," said He "They're all in shock.
No one thought they'd see you."

It's amazing to me that so many people think that in order to go to Heaven you have to be just like them. Why do you think this is so? Here's what I think it is.... pride.
We look at the person down the street, and compare ourselves with them, and say, "Thank God I am not like them." But down deep we are. You see pride is as big a sin as anyother.
You may have a list of sins you don't do. You may not drink, cheat, lie, steal, commit adultery, murder, etc. But if you think you are better than anyone else you are guilty of pride.
So many of us sit in pews and think to ourselves, "I'm glad the preacher said that, the guy across from me needed to hear it!"
It is easy to agree with the preacher when he is preaching on a sin that you are not committing.
I truly believe we will be surprised when we get to Heaven. Some that we think should be there, won't. Some we think shouldn't have made it, will.
Are you sure you will? It is not based upon what you do... but on what Christ did.

 

Jesus has already posted His take on this; its in His holy word where he commands us to come out from among them and be ye separate! To mingle with obvious heretics that blatantly reject what He has already clearly instructed is heinous sin of itself!
Yes, His church is ecumenical but you dont know who is in that church; only He knows! We are commanded to preach the gospel and if after doing so a few times if they reject it then we're to leave them alone!
As for the ECT movement, perhaps if you did a real study of Bondage of the Will, or read Triumph of Truth you would have a greater sense of loyalty to the Lord and be a willing defender of His cause, rather than to seek and enjoy the approval of many, including those of the world!
Not meaning to be caustic but I've just come from a marvelous sermon on John 9 about how the blind man had enough sense to know the truth but the 'seeing', the religious were actually blind and denied the identity of the Lord! We were asked how loyal, how willing we are to defend His true cause!
Blessings!

 

Tiny Tim said:

With this I heartily agree and I've no desire for sure that others, any others at all, be just like me. I do believe God's word has much valuable instruction to us that we will closely study and follow if we love Him and are grateful for His mercy and grace!
Yes, its all about Him!
If we discuss issues, not people, it is healthier, rather than to judge others and to assess what they must be thinking! I know there are so many here on this forum that love the Lord.
I still object to the ECT and support what Luther did as the Lord's agent way back when!
I just dont want a contaminated, watered down doctrine when I can have pure, clear teaching of the word of God!

 

It is sad but necessary that the elect be separated down here on earth. But it is a sure thing that we will not be separated in Heaven. And let us not be bigoted toward one another while we waite for that day.

(I know, I know, I should follow my own advise. I try, really I do!)

 

I also object to the ECT... There is no way you can unite true Christianity with the RCC...

You mention that you support Luther... So you are somewhat ecumenical... You recognize that there are other brothers and sisters that are not your brand of baptist. That is where i am.

 

To clarify: I support Luther's role in the reformation! Thats what I was referring to in my post. The fact that one lone man stood against the whole RC and wasnt killed to me is proof that he was God's man for the role! I still find that amazing! God has people everywhere who fill their part and take a stand for Him! We just dont seem to see so many today but He knows where they are and uses those faithful ones in His plan!
No, I am not ecumenical, at all!

 

Dealing with those who differ from us:

http://www.founders.org/library/nicole1.html

We all differ in some areas but need to be sure that we dont differ on sound basic doctrines, then we can manage the incidentals by accepting our differences and not engaging in heated debate.

 

Just curious... How do you feel about secondary seperation?

I am in a denomination that supports ecumenism. (I support it on the essentials, and still respect beliefs different than mine)
Would you separate from me because of that?

 

Tim, I taught in a liberal university's divinity school alongside men and women who were liberal in theology. I remained friends with those people to this day.

My attitude in the school was that I had an opportunity to influence some of those future ministerial students along fundamental lines of thought.

Many would disagree with me, and a number of Baptists cut me off from fellowship.

Bottom line; I would not cut anyone off. Where is my witness then?

Cheers,

Jim

 

If a 'brother', a fellow believer is overtaken in sin and remains unrepentant after being confronted in love, dealt with according to church discipline(rather a rarity today) then we are to separate from them.
The reason for this, is done in love, according to scripture, to cause them to see their sin, repent and return to fellowship.
If we're in the world and buddy-buddy with everyone, then where are our boundaries?
What does scripture command? These are acts of love and concern for our fellows, not nasty avoidance, but declaring to them they are in sin and are in the devils boneyard and must return to the fellowship of the Lord and the brethren.
We have over the years drifted off course, decided what the best way to do things is for ourself, rather than submit to scripture and risk disapproval of the masses! Being a christian is hard at times, though blest. Peter suffered terribly for his sin, the Lord prayed for him and told him what to do when he returned to Him in good faith! Because of his fall, his sin of rejecting his Lord, his humbled state of repentance shaped him for great use by the Lord.
Our compromise and so wanting to be friends that we dont declare our beliefs and boundaries renders us pretty useless to Him! 'We are Christ's ambassadors, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God!'2 Cor 5:20
If Christ is doing His business through us then we'd better hold to a higher standard.

 

Here are a couple of quotes from ECT.

 

Well, like this article states the biggest changes have occurred within protestantism as the increase in apathy, their slide from devotion to sound doctrines and such have lessened thier concern to maintain and protect what many of the reformer gave their life for.

http://audio.gracechurch.org/shepnew/2006notes/Roman%20Catholicism,%20Johnson.pdf

 

I do not find "repent and be water baptized for the remission of our sins to be our gospel. It is another gospel, which isn't another, but corrupts the gospel of Christ.

 

Maybe I'm misunderstanding your statement but I'm very confused about what you mean in light of Acts 2:38 where Peter appears to directly oppose you.

 

I would say that is cool if the result is an increase in passion to the work of Christ and devotion to maintain the sound doctrines that Christ gave his life for. I am a follower of Christ first and the reformers, while still being important influences in my theology, are much further down the list in importance.

But I guess that doesn't always happen. Unfortunately, passion is often associated with directed emotion against something rather than directed emotion for something. Humans are funny that way. It is much easier to be fired up against something than it is to be fired up for something at least for more than 15 minutes . Once the opposition is removed, the passion may not be there anymore.

 

Gold Dragon said:

.

For me, it was the amazing realization that Christ had chosen me in eternity past, before the foundation of the world! That awareness I found so startling, overwhelming and wonderful that the greatest gratitude filled my soul and propel me on in love of Him who would do such for one so horrifically unworthy of Him! Such is grace! If I thought for one second that I'd had anything at all to do with it, then it would no longer be 'grace', but my decision! Such a wonder! The passion that drives me comes from this knowledge!

 

That is awesome. And I hope that passion never fades!